Family issue: differences between Northern and Southern Europe?

[Foxy]

In the thread about the age in which you moved out it started this interesting topic. Which are the differences about family in Northern, Eastern and Southern Europe?

Italy is familistic, I'd say that ,becouse of our long political division, family has acquired a role that substitutes the State. This role is extreme. I dunno in Greece and Spain but here if you say to your parents that you want to move out, it is implicit that you are going to marry. Only exceptions: if you study or work in an other city. Otherwise to live alone is considered "a useless cost".

I dunno if it is positive or not. I let you judge.

EXTREME means that there are areas in Southern Italy where there still is the faida (or fedhe, Blutrache, blood feud), a Norman cultural heritage. If you do something wrong to a member of an other family you have all his/her family against all your family. A Southern Italian friend of mine told me that in her village a guy has been killed becouse he belonged to a family that was in "blood feud" with an other family. Of course in this case we are in the illegacy and this happens very rarely, but the mentality which is behind this is strong, especially in the South.

On the other hand in big cities the situation is different, family is far less rigid but it is always "central" in a person's life.

A positive aspect is that it is very beautiful to have a united family. They solve problems for you and help you in everything, psychologically, materially, and you spend with them very beautiful moments. You feel never lonely.
Family are united becouse when you start it it's like to start a business. Usually the two things come together. There are many couples/families who start a family business (a restaurant, a little firm). Little and medium firms are, indeed, the economic heart of Italy.

And to joke: in rural areas it still happens that an elder may ask you the name and "whose are you son/daughter" instead than the surname.


How's the situation in your country?

Italy's situation can be compared, in my opinion, with traditional China or Japan.

[Aramis]

I'd say we have the same familiar relations as described by you in Italy. Although we lack the "blood feud" you talk of. Reminds me more of Albania and Turkey.

[Daos]

I don't really know how people used to be, but today people put their own interest ahead of that of the family - to the point that rivalry between siblings can lead to fights and, in rare cases, murder. Sadly, very little cooperation exists within a family.

And to joke: in rural areas it still happens that an elder may ask you the name and "whose are you son/daughter" instead than the surname.

It used to be the same in our villages, at least in my area, but now most people are too „modern” for that sort of behaviour and language...

[Grumpy Cat]

I didn't think I'd get such good response to a troll topic.

Anyways, Acadians in general are very close, and will not move far from where they grew up. In the old days, families stayed together in the same house (if you drive through my old hometown, you'll see houses with weird looking additions on them, meant to be a kind of apartment for the new family). Either way, if they're living at home, they're meant to pay their keep, meaning, part of the bills/mortgage/electricity/water, whatever, and have their own phone, cable, Internet, etc.

I haven't moved far from where I grew up, but I migrated to where the jobs were. I still visit home quite often and still have a key, to her house and her car, even though I have my own house and car (her car is bigger, though, so I will borrow it if I have to move something big).

[Wyn]

EXTREME means that there are areas in Southern Italy where there still is the faida (or fedhe, Blutrache, blood feud), a Norman cultural heritage. If you do something wrong to a member of an other family you have all his/her family against all your family. A Southern Italian friend of mine told me that in her village a guy has been killed becouse he belonged to a family that was in "blood feud" with an other family. Of course in this case we are in the illegacy and this happens very rarely, but the mentality which is behind this is strong, especially in the South.

Blood feuds, in Italy? Disturbing, but interesting. There's no concept of 'blood feud' where I'm from, but the attitude you're describing here (a general never-ending grudge bearing mentality) is certainly one I'm familiar with. There are people I wouldn't speak to to this day because they had a falling out with a relative of mine fifteen years ago, when I was still a child.

Which reminds me of an event from my childhood that I remember quite well - when I was about 7 or 8 years old a local lad of about 13 tried to 'borrow' my bike, which prompted an older cousin of mine to intervene, which of course led to a physical fight, and by that very evening all manner of relatives from our families - cousins, uncles, fathers, siblings etc. - were involved in what began as a minor dispute.

But this may well merely be the manner in which things are done in my family/community.

I'd say we have the same familiar relations as described by you in Italy. Although we lack the "blood feud" you talk of. Reminds me more of Albania and Turkey.

Aye, definitely something I'd associate with Albania.

[Ushtari]

Its pretty much the same among Albanians to. There is however a slight difference among us.

The women shall according to Albanian culture:
"Leave" her biological family and accept her new family(the guys). The woman must be prepared to live together in a house with her ​​husband, his siblings and his parents for life. What the guy's mother says to the woman that she should do, she must do(housekeeping). When guests come, the house must be cleaned, the woman must serve food, coffee, tea, cakes and such things. And should always be prepared with refills, this applies until her husband's younger brother gets married and takes up a new girl in the house. The woman must always consider what is best for the family.

This is that kind of little things that I've written, this is given things that a bride must fulfill. There are many more examples that are "radical" as well not be bothered to write down, for example, if the man would die so the woman must really live with his parents and take care of them.

For an Albanian girl, this is a must, in principle, all Albanian girls thinks that they have to do this, not because anyone forces them, but they themselves feel it is their duty. To taking care of the family, to always keep track and serve their guests, to regard her husband's mother as her own and so on. A Swedish girl would for example never want to live together with his husband and his parents, while an Albanian girl do not even discuss that.

However, today most move out to a new house when they get married.

Speaking of blood feuds, until recently many many Albanian where in "war" with each other, until a guy named Anton Çeta made peace between almost all Albanians in Kosovo(1993).

[askra]

here in Sardinia (Italy) the concept of family is totally changed in the last 50-60 years, due to the mutation of economic system and the society.
it was the italian region with the highest fertility rate, now it's the region with lowest one (1.087 births per woman), and the second lowest birth rate in italy, it's also the region with the record of women that get pregnant later.

in the past was normal see big families constituted by 10 or more members, now the average is 3 members (mother, father and one son),
there are entire villages inland populated only by old people, many schools are closing because there aren't children. the population is slightly growing due to immigration from abroad.

years ago the economy was based on agriculture and farming, so it was important have big families, now great part of population is employed in the tertiary sector, as services and turism, the high cost of life and high taxations don't allow to young people to create a family.

a peculiarity of sardinian traditional family is that it was focused on matriarchy, men worked as farmers, while women administered family life, economy of villages and the relations among families.

[Bard]

I can add some additional informations about the situation of italy.

Here in the north of italy things are a bit different, there is no violence at all, we have no blood feuds (thanks god).

Like in the rest of the north, people here are a bit more suspicious and less friendly than in the south and is somewhat rare to see people outside of the same family fraternazing.
Just to adduce evidence: I don't even know my neighbours, I have never been at their home and I barely know the names of half of them.
If you are an outsider, the situation is of course even worse, just because of the way you speak (the accent of other parts of italy) you could be subject of jokes and people will not really be helpful towards you.

Families by the way tend to be united just like in the south of italy, in my region Veneto we resemble the south even more than the rest of the north.
We have an attachment to the land and an history of poverty, immigration and foreign domination (especially after the fall of the Serenissima) that probably caused the formation of stronger familiar bonds and the rise of the family as a substitute of the state.
The characteristics that we share with the south are present more frequently in the most uneducated and less wealthy families, especially in the rural areas, while I have noticed more liberal tendencies in the the upper middle class of the big cities.

a peculiarity of sardinian traditional family is that it was focused on matriarchy, men worked as farmers, while women administered family life, economy of villages and the relations among families.

This is very interesting.
I would say instead that the Venetian family had a patriarchal structure, but both men and women used to work as farmers if I am not wrong.
However naturally some roles were decided by gender.

[Bari]

In the thread about the age in which you moved out it started this interesting topic. Which are the differences about family in Northern, Eastern and Southern Europe?

Italy is familistic, I'd say that ,becouse of our long political division, family has acquired a role that substitutes the State. This role is extreme. I dunno in Greece and Spain but here if you say to your parents that you want to move out, it is implicit that you are going to marry. Only exceptions: if you study or work in an other city. Otherwise to live alone is considered "a useless cost".

I dunno if it is positive or not. I let you judge.

EXTREME means that there are areas in Southern Italy where there still is the faida (or fedhe, Blutrache, blood feud), a Norman cultural heritage. If you do something wrong to a member of an other family you have all his/her family against all your family. A Southern Italian friend of mine told me that in her village a guy has been killed becouse he belonged to a family that was in "blood feud" with an other family. Of course in this case we are in the illegacy and this happens very rarely, but the mentality which is behind this is strong, especially in the South.

On the other hand in big cities the situation is different, family is far less rigid but it is always "central" in a person's life.

A positive aspect is that it is very beautiful to have a united family. They solve problems for you and help you in everything, psychologically, materially, and you spend with them very beautiful moments. You feel never lonely.
Family are united becouse when you start it it's like to start a business. Usually the two things come together. There are many couples/families who start a family business (a restaurant, a little firm). Little and medium firms are, indeed, the economic heart of Italy.

And to joke: in rural areas it still happens that an elder may ask you the name and "whose are you son/daughter" instead than the surname.


How's the situation in your country?

Italy's situation can be compared, in my opinion, with traditional China or Japan.

- Important values are respecting/loyalty to family/tribe/friends, courage, besa/faith(keep promise/word of honor) and hospitality. Virtues that are reflected in friendships, family relations,etc..
The family structure is not like before when dozens of family members lived together. But its still common for grandparents to live at home. And in case of divorce the parents go live with the youngest son. Many aspects, such as 'Besa' is influenced by the Kanun(Albanian laws).

'Shqiptaret vdesin dhe besen nuk e shkelin' (Albanians would die rather than break besa).

Blood feuds still carry on and are not that rare. Its the same concept as in Southern Italy from the sound of it. Though women are not generally taken into consideration in blood feuds. The male line is the one being targeted. The notion of taking justice into your own hands if you/or family has been insulted is still widespread. To start a blood feud doesn't require murder, as insulting someone verbally is also a legitimate reason to kill. If someone dishonors you, the only way to restore your honor is by taking blood. An Albanian would never forget who his friends are, but at the same time never forgets insults. Time won't heal any wound so to speak.

Keeping a word/friendship is essential. Breaking it would either lead to excommunication from the community or result in a blood feud. Forgiveness is a concept yet to gain foothold in the Albanian mentality. There has been made some progress in that regards, as some years ago several families of different religion in Northern Albania agreed to reconcile and make peace. Efforts are being made by people from the cities especially to reverse it, but its hardly going to make a difference until the state would be in position to perform justice.


I think a united family is positive. From what I've seen family ties are not as strong in Northern Europe, where individualism and becoming independent seem like more sought after traits. I personally don't envy or want such a family structure as I find only positive aspects of having strong family ties.

A positive aspect is that it is very beautiful to have a united family. They solve problems for you and help you in everything, psychologically, materially, and you spend with them very beautiful moments. You feel never lonely.
Family are united becouse when you start it it's like to start a business. Usually the two things come together. There are many couples/families who start a family business (a restaurant, a little firm).

- Sums up the rest I wanted to add.

[Raskolnikov]

My father is 'Northern' and evicted me shortly after my 18th birthday for no reason (other than the cultural one), whereas my 'Southern' mother didn't even comprehend what he meant and just ignored it along with me.