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Thread: Why Arabs failed to arabize Iranians?

  1. #211
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aren View Post
    Blatant lies to make yourself seem less mixed. Arabic was originally not as close to Aramaic as it is today. Earlier Aramaic has had a profound effect on the modern Arabic dialects. More like a koine language nowadays tbh.
    Modern Arabs are also genetically quite distinct from actual Levantines, like Samaritans and Lebanese/Palestinian Christians. Within a West Asian context ofc.
    They may have been more open to Arab settlers at that time(like if there was much of a choice lol), but maybe try ask a native Levantine Christian or Jew today what they think of the Arab Muslim presence in the Levant...
    That's not true, Northern Arabic is in the same family as Aramaic languages. What you are referring to you is South Arabian, which was only spoken in certain areas of the Arabian peninsula and yes it belonged to a different from of Semitic languages being Southern Semitic. Not to mention that Arabian tribes were always present in the Levant since antiquity. Also many of these Arabian tribes settled in the Levant, before even Islam appeared. I can give you their names, some of them are the Midianite, Kedarite, Nabatean, Tankhuids, the Kalb, and the Tayyids. This not mention that the Arabian Ghassanids have moved into the Levant, due to Ethiopian raids. There the Ghassanids originally place themselves into the region and then convert to Christianity and become vassal to the Byzantines. Also many of the tribes in Jordan and Syria especially in the Desert frontiers were pagan and often had conflict with the Christian Levantine both Arab/non-Arab and the Byzantines, and hence why they willingly converted and joined the Arabian forces. The Southern Levant was very close to Arabia. Jordan was always inhabited by Arabian Bedouin tribes for example.

    You know what I say to them, We won get over it, just like Whites say it to the Amerindians in Americas and Aborgines in Australia. Unlike the Whites we had equal level of weapons to the Byzantines, unlike the Whites who had an advantage due to more advanced weapons.
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  2. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by StonyArabia View Post
    That's not true, Northern Arabic is in the same family as Aramaic languages. What you are referring to you is South Arabian, which was only spoken in certain areas of the Arabian peninsula and yes it belonged to a different from of Semitic languages being Southern Semitic. Not to mention that Arabian tribes were always present in the Levant since antiquity. Also many of these Arabian tribes settled in the Levant, before even Islam appeared. I can give you their names, some of them are the Midianite, Kedarite, Nabatean, Tankhuids, the Kalb, and the Tayyids. This not mention that the Arabian Ghassanids have moved into the Levant, due to Ethiopian raids. There the Ghassanids originally place themselves into the region and then convert to Christianity and become vassal to the Byzantines. Also many of the tribes in Jordan and Syria especially in the Desert frontiers were pagan and often had conflict with the Christian Levantine both Arab/non-Arab and the Byzantines, and hence why they willingly converted and joined the Arabian forces. The Southern Levant was very close to Arabia. Jordan was always inhabited by Arabian Bedouin tribes for example.

    You know what I say to them, We won get over it, just like Whites say it to the Amerindians in Americas and Aborgines in Australia. Unlike the Whites we had equal level of weapons to the Byzantines, unlike the Whites who had an advantage due to more advanced weapons.
    Arabic and Aramaic are much closer to each other than Akaddian (the actual Assyrian language) and Aramaic were. As an 'Assyrian' he should know that. Also, the Arabization process of Levant was much more natural than people think, just like people had already previously switched from Canaanite to Aramaic. They are all closely related languages. Also, in fact the Arabization process intensified under Turkish/Ottoman rule.

    Also why don't people talk about the Romans and how they completely replaced Gaulish, pre-Latin languages of Italy, native Iberian languages, Thracian etc and several other Indo and non-Indo European languages that were once spoken in Europe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by StonyArabia View Post
    That's not true, Northern Arabic is in the same family as Aramaic languages. What you are referring to you is South Arabian, which was only spoken in certain areas of the Arabian peninsula and yes it belonged to a different from of Semitic languages being Southern Semitic. Not to mention that Arabian tribes were always present in the Levant since antiquity. Also many of these Arabian tribes settled in the Levant, before even Islam appeared. I can give you their names, some of them are the Midianite, Kedarite, Nabatean, Tankhuids, the Kalb, and the Tayyids. This not mention that the Arabian Ghassanids have moved into the Levant, due to Ethiopian raids. There the Ghassanids originally place themselves into the region and then convert to Christianity and become vassal to the Byzantines. Also many of the tribes in Jordan and Syria especially in the Desert frontiers were pagan and often had conflict with the Christian Levantine both Arab/non-Arab and the Byzantines, and hence why they willingly converted and joined the Arabian forces. The Southern Levant was very close to Arabia. Jordan was always inhabited by Arabian Bedouin tribes for example.

    You know what I say to them, We won get over it, just like Whites say it to the Amerindians in Americas and Aborgines in Australia. Unlike the Whites we had equal level of weapons to the Byzantines, unlike the Whites who had an advantage due to more advanced weapons.
    Indeed and Northern Arabic was very different from the actual Arabic spoken further south due to heavy Aramaic influence, the Nabateans were probably heavily Levantine autosomally, very different from the actual Arabs. And Old Arabic was part of the Central Semitic group not the Northwest like Aramaic. You do realize that most of the tribes you mentioned are specifically said to have originated in Arabia and then migrated further north into the Levant. Just because they migrated northwards before the Islamic era doesn't make them any more native.

    Get over what? My post was towards the Palestinian mongrel regarding his actual autosomal profile, nothing to do with who "won". Though you are quite mongrelized yourself and yet being a fanatical Arab. I wonder if I don't actually plot closer to Saudis than you do? You know considering your Chechen half or whatever your father is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haider View Post
    Arabic and Aramaic are much closer to each other than Akaddian (the actual Assyrian language) and Aramaic were. As an 'Assyrian' he should know that. Also, the Arabization process of Levant was much more natural than people think, just like people had already previously switched from Canaanite to Aramaic. They are all closely related languages. Also, in fact the Arabization process intensified under Turkish/Ottoman rule.

    Also why don't people talk about the Romans and how they completely replaced Gaulish, pre-Latin languages of Italy, native Iberian languages, Thracian etc and several other Indo and non-Indo European languages that were once spoken in Europe.
    You are obsessed with Assyrians. Did someone hurt you or what?
    I love how you call me "Assyrian" yet I actually speak the language descendat from the Aramaic form willingly adapted by Assyrians during the Neo-Assyrian period. You though, I don't know what your identity is, you seem to lick Arab ass on one hand and then also circlejerk over the Crusade input in the Muslim "Lebanese" population but at the same time you also have a huge inferiority complexity towards Lebanese Christians because of their purity which ofc you Muslims of the area didn't preserve(You have African, Arab, European and Mesopotamian blood).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aren View Post
    You are obsessed with Assyrians. Did someone hurt you or what?
    I love how you call me "Assyrian" yet I actually speak the language descendat from the Aramaic form willingly adapted by Assyrians during the Neo-Assyrian period. You though, I don't know what your identity is, you seem to lick Arab ass on one hand and then also circlejerk over the Crusade input in the Muslim "Lebanese" population but at the same time you also have a huge inferiority complexity towards Lebanese Christians because of their purity which ofc you Muslims of the area didn't preserve(You have African, Arab, European and Mesopotamian blood).
    Purity

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aren View Post
    Indeed and Northern Arabic was very different from the actual Arabic spoken further south due to heavy Aramaic influence, the Nabateans were probably heavily Levantine autosomally, very different from the actual Arabs. And Old Arabic was part of the Central Semitic group not the Northwest like Aramaic. You do realize that most of the tribes you mentioned are specifically said to have originated in Arabia and then migrated further north into the Levant. Just because they migrated northwards before the Islamic era doesn't make them any more native.
    Northern Arabic was already in proximity to the Aramaic languages. Also Northern Arabic developed in what's now the Syrian Desert and Jordan before moving into the Arabian peninsula. Yes they have their origins in Arabia, but their influence has been for a long time and even since antiquity. They are part of the Levant and have become native to it, similar to how Europeans became natives to South Africa and North America. Nabatean samples shows them to be very close to modern Saudis and Jordanians actually and have no similarity to Levantine Christians for the most part. They even score some SSA admix, being East African.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aren
    Get over what? My post was towards the Palestinian mongrel regarding his actual autosomal profile, nothing to do with who "won". Though you are quite mongrelized yourself and yet being a fanatical Arab. I wonder if I don't actually plot closer to Saudis than you do? You know considering your Chechen half or whatever your father is.
    I was speaking in general terms of how "Levantine" Christians and Jews think about Muslim Arab presence there. This what I will say we won get over it lol. I am mixed yes, but the culture I was raised in was mostly Arabian Bedouin. Yes my father is Circassian with some Anatolian shift. I also have an Arabian spirit, plus it's 50% of my blood. Well I only little about my Circassian roots, and it's only part of my genetic element nothing more than that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haider View Post
    Arabic and Aramaic are much closer to each other than Akaddian (the actual Assyrian language) and Aramaic were. As an 'Assyrian' he should know that. Also, the Arabization process of Levant was much more natural than people think, just like people had already previously switched from Canaanite to Aramaic. They are all closely related languages. Also, in fact the Arabization process intensified under Turkish/Ottoman rule.

    Also why don't people talk about the Romans and how they completely replaced Gaulish, pre-Latin languages of Italy, native Iberian languages, Thracian etc and several other Indo and non-Indo European languages that were once spoken in Europe.
    Nothing to do with how related the languages are. Its assimilation and social dominance.

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    Iran's culture is simply too rich, old and strong.
    You can acculturate others, but look at Iran or China, or the Ancient nations now dominated by Islam...
    If you were an advanced civilization, today you have a higher GDP, a stronger state and a culture more uniquely yours.

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    arabization was an ideology linked to islam, first islamic empire and their scholars (omeyyades abassides ...) believed all muslims should learn arabic like the prophet learnt arabic and claimed to be arab (this idea is outdated now)
    there were difficulties to arabize iran because there weren't enough arabic speakers (arabization started after other mena areas) original arabic speakers were not more than 12 000 and iran used to include a huge population with minorities many mountains that's why they just kept arabic alphabet
    before western try to make it a symbol of so call domination learning arabic was a cultural enrichment for different ethnicities who kept their native identity
    if iranians could read a little arabic maybe they would not apply a distorted version of islam like shia

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