Unconquered Nations

[Damião de Góis]

Since i'm saying almost the same thing as Viriato i can answer:

Sure...
C'mon, the French invaded and occupied Portugal during Napoleon...

It was but lasted less than a year.

It doesn't matter, the area of Portugal with its cities were occupied even before the birth of the Kingdom of Portugal (different from nowaday state). By this logic Italy was never occupied or ruled after it was formed (maybe if we count the Allies during WWII...)

Yes Italy was never occupied. For example you can't look at this map from 1300 and say Italy is there:



I don't get this logic, it's like saying Yugoslavia was invaded by the romans.

That being said. Portugal is located in a particular part of Europe, little exposed to foreigner powers this is the probably the reason why had few foreigner occupations. Do you think powers like France, HRE and Spain had more interests in conquering a nation like Portugal or a strategic and more important one like Italy?
Oh yeah but Italy didn't exist before 1860 so foreigner rule before that period doesn't count...

Portugal was anything but small during centuries:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portuguese_Empire

If no one tried to conquer it, it's their problem.

[MinervaItalica]

Portugal was anything but small during centuries:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portuguese_Empire

If no one tried to conquer it's their problem.

No matter if it had an oversea empire. I was speaking about Mainland Portugal and that was less strategically important and with less resources than other states in Europe. Without count that it borders only with Spain...

I mean the Italian city states were far richer, obviously this attracted foreigner bordering powers not to mention Rome and its importance...

History books count French, HRE, Spanish and Austrian as occupation of Italy even when the present day modern nation wasn't born so...

Also the Kingdom of Portugal isn't the same thing as the present day nation (also different flag), same for other old formations like France and Austria.

[Damião de Góis]

No matter if it had an oversea empire. I was speaking about Mainland Portugal and that was less strategically important and with less resources than other states in Europe. Without count that it borders only with Spain...

I mean the Italian city states were far richer, obviously this attracted foreigner bordering powers not to mention Rome and its importance...

Lots of foreigners came here too at that time including the genoese Columbus, which you should know. Obviously an invasion of Portugal would grant access to its colonies in South America, Africa and Asia, so of course the empire counts.

History books count French, HRE, Spanish and Austrian as occupation of Italy even when the present day modern nation wasn't born so...

I don't agree. For example this article is called spanish conquest of the Aztec Empire, not the spanish conquest of Mexico.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanis...e_Aztec_Empire

But ok, all i'm saying is that i disagree that Portugal was invaded by the moors(why not saying it was invaded by Morocco?), because Portugal didn't exist. The french invasions or the iberian union can be counted as an invasions of Portugal.

Also the Kingdom of Portugal isn't the same thing as the present day nation (also different flag), same for other old formations like France and Austria.

It's the same thing with a different regime and a different flag.

[MinervaItalica]

I don't agree. For example this article is called spanish conquest of the Aztec Empire, not the spanish conquest of Mexico.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanis...e_Aztec_Empire

Wikipedia is not really an History book, in any case Italy has definitely an older cultural identity (since Middle-Ages and Dante) than Mexico, this is probably the reason. Also the name Italia was used by the Romans to define the peninsula already at their time.

EDIT: dude it speaks about Mexico. Ctrl+G and type Mexico, it is written everywhere.

[Asheffar]

Lots of foreigners came here too at that time including the genoese Columbus, which you should know. Obviously an invasion of Portugal would grant access to its colonies in South America, Africa and Asia, so of course the empire counts.



I don't agree. For example this article is called spanish conquest of the Aztec Empire, not the spanish conquest of Mexico.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanis...e_Aztec_Empire

But ok, all i'm saying is that i disagree that Portugal was invaded by the moors(why not saying it was invaded by Morocco?), because Portugal didn't exist. The french invasions or the iberian union can be counted as an invasions of Portugal.



It's the same thing with a different regime and a different flag.

When I said portugal,I meant the Lusitanian people,they existed since roman times. I know portugal as a state or national identity didn’t exist

[Damião de Góis]

When I said portugal,I meant the Lusitanian people,they existed since roman times. I know portugal as a state or national identity didn’t exist

I'm afraid the Lusitanians and Portugal aren't the same thing.

The lusitanians spoke a celtic or pre-celtic language and lived in modern day central Portugal and central Spain:



They were conquered by the romans (not the moors) and romanized.

Portugal is a romance speaking country that emerged as a kingdom during the christian reconquest of the iberian peninsula. Its people are not exactly ancient lusitanians, only partly.

[MinervaItalica]

Yes Italy was never occupied. For example you can't look at this map from 1300 and say Italy is there:

Spoiler!

Italy is a peninsula, it has natural borders of sea and Alps unlike other countries who are made only of artificial boundaries. In that map i can clearly see Italy definitely better than other state.