Post an ancient or medieval variation/predecessor of your language

[Gründig]

"Middle High German (abbreviated MHG, German: Mittelhochdeutsch, abbr. Mhd.) is the term for the form of German spoken in the High Middle Ages. It is conventionally dated between 1050 and 1350, developing from Old High German and into Early New High German."

My surname is apparently derived from 2 MHG words.

[Teutone]

My surname is apparently derived from 2 MHG words.

Noble crusader blood in you maybe!

Sacred.

What region are your German ancestors from again?

[tekken999]

The oldest Sardinian documents date back to early XIth century. They are named Condàghes, from the Byzantine Greek "Kontàkion"; they are administrative logs of the Sardinian monasteries, and they record every juridical activity in which the monastery was involved; divided into three categories : Tràmutos (trades), Datùras (donations), Kertos (litigations). It was usually the abbot or the abbess who added a new entry in the log, with a precise formula, Her/His name, a thank to God and the Saints, (and to the ruler, the Judex/Judike), and the reason for which the entry was added.
The language with which these documents are written is still easily understandable for Sardinians who speak Logudorese/Nuorese, because these variants of Sardinian language have changed little since the middle ages, while the language spoken in the south (Campidanese) has become very distant from the medieval language.

Some examples of log entries from various Condaghes :

Spoiler!

Condàghe de Santu Pedru de Silki (XI-XIIIth centuries)

«Ego Maximilla, abatissa de scu. Petru de Silki ki lu renouo custu condake, ad unore deus innanti, e de scu. Petru e de sca. Julia, e ccun boluntate dessu donnu meu iudike Gunnari, e dessu fiju iudike Barusone, e dessos frates, e dessos maiorales de Locudore, dandem’isse paragula de renobarelu su condake.»

Translation in actual Sardinian (Logudorese)

«Eo Massimilla, abatissa de santu Pedru de Silki qui lu renovo custu condaghe, ad honore 'e Deus in anti, e de Santu Pedru e de Santa Julia, e cun voluntade de su segnore meu judiche Gonare, e de su fizu judiche Barisone, e de sos frades, e de sos majores de Logudoro, dèndemi isse paràula de lu renovare su condaghe.»

English

«I Maximilla, abbess of Saint Peter of Silki that I renew this Condaghe, for the honor of God before, and of Saint Peter and of Saint Julia, and with the will of my lord the Judge Gonare, and of his son Judge Barisone, and of his brothers, and of the lords of Logudoro, giving him me his word to renew the Condaghe.»

Spoiler!

Condaghe de Santu Nigola de Trullas (XIIth century)

«Ego prebitero Rodulfo - ki certait mecu iudice Gunnari in su monte pro Simion Macara. Et ego non bi voli ’n’ certare cun illu. Et osca falaince assa festa de sanctu Gaviniu et naraililu assu archipiscopu su certu: a donnu Athu, ci fuit monacu de Camaldula. Et isse naraitindeli a iudice ca: «Male fakes et peccatu, ki li lu levas a Sanctu Nichola». Et isse, co donnu bonu et ca la amavat sa anima sua, benedissitililu a Sanctu Nichola, o clericu esseret o laycu. Testes: su archipiscopu, et issu piscopu de Plavaki donnu Gualfredi, et issu piscopu de Gisarclu donnu Mariane Thelle.»

Translation in actual Sardinian (Logudorese)

«Eo preìderu Rodulfu - qui brigaìat cun megus judiche Gonare in su monte pro Simone Macara. Ed eo no bi querìa brigare cun issu. E pùstis che falaìa a sa festa de Santu Gavine e lu naraìa a s'archipiscopu de sa briga: a don Athu, qui fit padre de Camaldule. E isse narèndeli a su judiche qui : «Male faghes e peccadu, qui lu leas a Santu Nigola». E isse qui fit unu bonu segnore e qui l'amaìat s'anima sua, lu lassaìat a Santu Nigola, o chìrigu esséret o laicu. Testes : s'archipiscopu, e issu piscopu de Piàghe don Gualfredi, e issu piscopu de Bisartzu don Mariane Tedde.»

English

«I priest Rudolph - since argued with me Judge Gonare on the mountain going to Simon Macara. And I didn't want to argue with him. And after I descended to the holiday of Saint Gavin and told it to the archbishop of the argue : to father Athu, that was monk of Camaldoli. And he saying to the Judge, that : «You do wrong and sin, that you take it/him from Saint Nicholas». And he that was a good lord and that loved his soul, left it/him to Saint Nicholas, that was or cleric or laic. Witnesses : the archbishop, and the bishop of Ploaghe father Gualfredi, and the bishop of Bisarcio father Marianus Tedde»

What I love about sardinian is how conservative it continues to remain and how little its changed from its original vulgar latin form compared to other romance languages. It's incredible to note the very few difference from the medieval version and modern version. One can't say the same for languages such as english for example.

[Damião de Góis]

Our ancestor is galician-portuguese, apparently also known as Old Portuguese or as Medieval Galician



lyrics:

Spoiler!

Amigo, queredes vos ir?
Si, mia senhor, ca nom poss'al
fazer, ca seria meu mal
e vosso; por end'a partir
mi convem d'aqueste logar;
mais que gram coita d'endurar
me será, pois m'é sem vós vir!

Amigu', e de mim que será?
Bem, senhor bõa e de prez;
e pois m'eu fôr daquesta vez,
o vosso mui bem se passará;
mais morte m'é de m'alongar
de vós e ir-m'alhur morar.
Mais pois é vós ũa vez ja!

Amigu', eu sem vós morrerei.
Nom o queirades esso, senhor,
mais pois u vós fôrdes, nom fôr
o que morrerá, eu serei;
mais quer'eu ant'o meu passar
ca assi do voss'aventurar,
ca eu sem vós de morrer hei!

Queredes-m', amigo, matar?
Nom, mia senhor, mais por guardar
vós, mato-mi que m'o busquei.

[Teutone]

Our ancestor is galician-portuguese, apparently also known as Old Portuguese or as Medieval Galician



lyrics:

Spoiler!

Amigo, queredes vos ir?
Si, mia senhor, ca nom poss'al
fazer, ca seria meu mal
e vosso; por end'a partir
mi convem d'aqueste logar;
mais que gram coita d'endurar
me será, pois m'é sem vós vir!

Amigu', e de mim que será?
Bem, senhor bõa e de prez;
e pois m'eu fôr daquesta vez,
o vosso mui bem se passará;
mais morte m'é de m'alongar
de vós e ir-m'alhur morar.
Mais pois é vós ũa vez ja!

Amigu', eu sem vós morrerei.
Nom o queirades esso, senhor,
mais pois u vós fôrdes, nom fôr
o que morrerá, eu serei;
mais quer'eu ant'o meu passar
ca assi do voss'aventurar,
ca eu sem vós de morrer hei!

Queredes-m', amigo, matar?
Nom, mia senhor, mais por guardar
vós, mato-mi que m'o busquei.

Sounds so wonderful.

People can say whatever they want about the "dark" ages, it boosted culture incredibly! lyrical,architectural and philosophical.

[gıulıoımpa]

i like the chronological ladder you did

[Mens-Sarda]

The oldest known Sardinian documents, also before the Condàghes, dating to early XIth century had a peculiarity, they were written using Greek script. This is because Sardinia was a Byzantine province from VIth to IXth century, when the contacts with Byzantium were lost because of the Saracen pirates that plagued the sea. However in Sardinia the Byzantine provincial institutions continued to work as if nothing had happened, evolving and adapting to the new situation, the province governor, the Judex Provinciae (Judge of the Province) became the Judike, using the Sardinian vulgar, and the Greek language continued to be occasionally used until early XIIth century in official documents, and by Sardinian church that continued to use the Byzantine liturgy until the same period. The chancellor's offices of southern Sardinia often also used the Greek script to write the Sardinian language, and some of these documents have been found in the church's archives in Pisa and Marseille.

Spoiler!

Spoiler!

Text (ancient southern Sardinian, Campidanese)

I‹n› nomin de Pater et Filiu et santu Ispiritu. Ego iudigi Trogodori de Gunali cum filia mia
donna Iurgia de Zori, per bulintadi de donnu Deu potestandu parti de Galaris, assolbullu a
Gosantini Frau. E deu Gosantini Frau, cum lebandu assultura daba ssu donnu miu iudigi
Trogodori de Gunali, ki mi llu castigidi donnu Deu balagos annos et bonus a issi et a fi‹lia›s suas,
fazumi carta pro gonpora cantu fegi cum mullieri mia Ispilurza de Urgu: conporeilli a
Furada de Urgu terra de plaza IX birgas a llongu et VII a lladu tenendu a plaza mia et deindelli I
baconi e I moiu de triigu et clonpilli pariari. Ante stimonius, Mariani de Seeris maiori de
scolca, Muntanesu maiori de billa, Trogodori Muria. E conporeilli a Gosan[tini ........ et a
f]radis suus......

Actual northern Sardinian (Logudorese)

In nomene de su Babbu e de su Fizu e de s'Ispiritu Santu. Eo judiche Thorgodoriu de Unàle cun fiza mia
donna Jorza de Zori, pro voluntade de donnu Deus guvernende a sa parte de Calaris, do su permissu a
Costantine Frau. Ed eo Costantine Frau, leènde permissu dae su segnore meu judiche
Thorgodoriu de Unàle, qui mi lu cunservet donnu Deus medas annos e bonos a issu e a fizas suas,
mi fatto s'iscrittu pro su còmporu qui faghìa cun muzere mia Ispilurza de Urgu: li comporaìa a
Furada de Urgu un'arzòla, 9 virgas longa e 7 (9x7) a ladu tenzende a s'arzola mia, e dèndeli 1
vagone e 1 moju de trigu e li lompìa a parizare. In anti a testimonzos, Mariane de Seeris, majore de
iscolca, Muntanesu, majore de bidda, Thorgodoriu Murgia. E li comporaìa a Costantine....... e a
frades suos....

English

In the name of the Father of the Son and the Holy Spirit. I Judge Thorgodoriu de Unàle with my daughter
lady Georgia de Zori, for the will of my Lord God ruling the part of Caralis/Calaris, I give permission to
Constantine Frau. And I Constantine Frau, taking permission from my lord the Judge
Thorgodoriu de Unàle, that Lord God may preserve him for me, for many and good years he and his daughters,
I prepare a notary deed for the purchase that I did with my wife Ispilurza de Urgu, I bought from
Furada de Urgu a farmyard 9 bars long and 7 (9x7 bars long), beside my farmyard, and giving her 1
wagon and a bushel of wheat and I accomplished to balance. Before witnesses Marianus of Seeris, commander of
the militia, Muntanesu, mayor of the village, Thorgodoriu Murgia. And I bought from Constantine......and from
his brothers.....

[Marinus]

Wow it sounds veery veeery north German frisian, incredible!

Thanks for sharing!

I know right?! I've always enjoyed finding these similarities between English and the other Germanic languages, it brings about a sense of kinship, even if Modern English sounds quite a bit different.

[Gründig]

Noble crusader blood in you maybe!

Sacred.

What region are your German ancestors from again?

Baden Württemberg, saxony(before ww2) and Alsace. These are the places I know for sure. It also seems the Salzburg state of Austria. From the DNA tests I did, It seems I may have even more german ancestors.

[Kelmendasi]

Arbenisht or Arberisht: