Greece as part of Western world make bori so anxious

[Sikeliot]

No one today considers Greece or balkans Near Eastern as they're closer culturally to Southern and Eastern Europe.

[brennus dux gallorum]

Dragoon, if this helps, poles and rest of Catholic Europeans were grouped as "non-white" in 19th century America, which back then meant "non-western", and later that church was abandoned from being part of the definition poles are not more "white" or western than Russians are (both are 100%)

IMO, if Greece is Western then so are Ukraine/Russia. If Greece isn't Western, then neither are they. I group all Orthodox countries together when discussing civilization stuff. Ex-communist Catholic countries are definitely 100% Western. Not Western Euro (debatable), but definitely part of Western civilization. Western civilization generally refers to all European (and maybe MENA) Christian nations. But some definitions say only Protestant-Catholic countries are part of Western civilization.

MENAs contributed to Western civilization since the Fertile Crescent is often said to be the "Cradle of Civilization". But nobody says that MENAs are part of Western civilization, so I can understand the argument for excluding Orthodox countries (inc. Greece) from the West since their contributions were in ancient times before the Great Schism. Anyways, most people consider all Orthodox countries to be part of Western civilization; and that includes Greece, Russia, Ukraine, etc.

The way you perceive west vs east is the way this division was perceived in 15th century, but after the establishment of Lutherans, and even more after the adoption of ancient Greek values (which wasn't even Christian) as the definition of Western civilization during the enlightenment, your definition is considered outdated since 3-4 centuries

This



Is definitely the new West, and Jews who are not even Christian, are depicted as part of it. The particular "odd chart" may also help dragoon

The part that I will agree is that yes, Eastern Europe is Europe, and if west=Christian Europe (which has started to dominate global perception) then yes, even Russia is western, and this is the way I mostly perceive west

And the only sure is that the answer goes to a non-European/near eastern person (bori)

But if not, then back to the question about Greece, as you previously stated that "ancient menas also contributed to Western civilization (which is true)", did you mean by that that they contributed to Catholic Church?

I mean, your post has some contradictions

[Mingle]

Dragoon, if this helps, poles and rest of Catholic Europeans were grouped as "non-white" in 19th century America, which back then meant "non-western", and later that church was abandoned from being part of the definition poles are not more "white" or western than Russians are (both are 100%)

This never happened. Ask Smeagol if you want to confirm. Catholics (especially Irishmen) were discriminated against but they were never not considered White. Jews were also never not considered White.

The way you perceive west vs east is the way this division was perceived in 15th century, but after the establishment of Lutherans, and even more after the adoption of ancient Greek values (which wasn't even Christian) as the definition of Western civilization during the enlightenment, your definition is considered outdated since 3-4 centuries

It was the traditional definition up until communism. See this: https://imgur.com/a/vGwqC

Is definitely the new West, and Jews who are not even Christian, are depicted as part of it. The particular "odd chart" may also help dragoon

This is just one chart, and it doesn't even make sense. Turkey and Georgia in South Asia, really? There isn't a single "civilization map" that we can all agree on. This is just as valid as the one that Stears used to post.

The part that I will agree is that yes, Eastern Europe is Europe, and if west=Christian Europe (which has started to dominate global perception) then yes, even Russia is western, and this is the way I mostly perceive west

Agree. Even if Eastern Europe wasn't considered part of Western civilization in the past, it is today.

But if not, then back to the question about Greece, as you previously stated that "ancient menas also contributed to Western civilization (which is true)", did you mean by that that they contributed to Catholic Church?

Technically in a way since MENAs founded Christianity Jews founded Christianity before integration into the West. But no, I was referring to stuff like the alphabet, domestication of plants/animals, bringing wheels, founding cities, founding libraries, etc. See more here: http://geography.name/fertile-crescent/

[brennus dux gallorum]

I....
Sent from my SM-G925T using Tapatalk

I have edited all of my post, so can you delete this one and answer to my new one?

[Mingle]

What are your views on South America? Americas were "discovered" by Iberian Spain/Portugal, originally colonies of Catholic Portugal and Spain.
They are more diverse though.

I'd say only White Latin Americans are part of Western civilization.

[Mingle]

I have edited all of my post, so can you delete this one and answer to my new one?

Fixed it.

[Rgvgjhvv]

No one today considers Greece or balkans Near Eastern as they're closer culturally to Southern and Eastern Europe.

Eastern Europe? Like Ukraine, Belarus, Poland? Lol