Eastern Europe from a Western perspective

[The Lawspeaker]

The Netherlands became prosper after we expelled the Jews from the Kingdom of Portugal and Spain and they moved to there.

Nope. The Jews just added to that. The Netherlands had been wealthy since, at least, the 1300s or further back. I am sure you're well aware of the Hanseatic Trade ?

[The Lawspeaker]

Well cities in Panonnia are typical Central European, not exactly reneissance but mostly baroque and secessionist in arhitecture, with some medieval remains here and there. They're very beautiful.

Surely but they were built by rulers, not by merchants or a rich burgher class.

[Magnolia]

And where were all these companies located ?

Baťa = Zlín (a Moravian city)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom%C3%A1%C5%A1_Ba%C5%A5a
Tomáš Baťa (Czech pronunciation: [ˈtomaːʃ ˈbaca]) (3 April 1876 – 12 July 1932) was a Czech entrepreneur, founder of the Bata Shoes company, one of the world's biggest multinational retailers, manufacturers and distributors of footwear and accessories.

Tatra = Kopřivnice (a Moravian town)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tatra_(company)
Tatra is a Czech vehicle manufacturer in Kopřivnice. It is owned by the Tatra Trucks company, based in Ostrava, and is the third oldest company in the world producing cars with an unbroken history.

Škoda = Mladá Boleslav (a Bohemian town)
Škoda Auto (Czech pronunciation: [ˈʃkoda] (About this sound listen)), more commonly known as Škoda, is a Czech automobile manufacturer founded in 1895 as Laurin & Klement. Its headquarters are in Mladá Boleslav, Czech Republic.

[The Lawspeaker]

In the 1800s river transport was still important and Vistula would have been a much better accelerator of economic growth, had its course been controlled by one country. Instead the river was divided between 3 empires (southern part Austrian, central part Russian and the outlet was controlled by Prussia), as was its basin.

I am aware that Poland is quite unique in its position that they actually underwent the growth pains and actually shares the same traditions but do the Hungarians and Czechs share the same excuse ? Or further East ?

[Peterski]

Many cities that had been historically important - such as Sandomierz (Sandomir), located along the Vistula river - lost importance in the 1800s due to changes in political borders. After 1815 Sandomir became a peripheral town on the Russian-Austrian border and all trade and transport died out.

[Jana]

Surely but they were built by rulers, not by merchants or a rich burgher class.

Rulers gave them privileges as free royal cities, but it's not that they built them. Anyway, in middle ages there was no real middle class but nobility and pesantry.
In most of Central Europe, merchant class in towns and cities were Germans and Jews.

[Magnolia]

It is but it is more endemic and visible in Eastern Europe.

Really?

[The Lawspeaker]

Baťa = Zlín (a Moravian city)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom%C3%A1%C5%A1_Ba%C5%A5a
Tomáš Baťa (Czech pronunciation: [ˈtomaːʃ ˈbaca]) (3 April 1876 – 12 July 1932) was a Czech entrepreneur, founder of the Bata Shoes company, one of the world's biggest multinational retailers, manufacturers and distributors of footwear and accessories.

Tatra = Kopřivnice (a Moravian town)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tatra_(company)
Tatra is a Czech vehicle manufacturer in Kopřivnice. It is owned by the Tatra Trucks company, based in Ostrava, and is the third oldest company in the world producing cars with an unbroken history.

Škoda = Mladá Boleslav (a Bohemian town)
Škoda Auto (Czech pronunciation: [ˈʃkoda] (About this sound listen)), more commonly known as Škoda, is a Czech automobile manufacturer founded in 1895 as Laurin & Klement. Its headquarters are in Mladá Boleslav, Czech Republic.

Indeed: all in the former Austrian area. Indeed let's us not forget Tatra's old name: Nesselsdorfer Wagenbau-Fabriksgesellschaft
Indeed: the founders of Skoda were this family.
As for Bata: he got his production methods... from the Americans.

[The Lawspeaker]

Rulers gave them privileges as free royal cities, but it's not that they built them. Anyway, in middle ages there was no real middle class but nobility and pesantry.
In most of Central Europe, merchant class in towns and cities were Germans and Jews.

So that might be the key difference then: our own merchant class was home grown. Then we may have gotten to the very heart of the issue: there was no home grown or free peasantry like here. There was no tradition of middle class virtues (such as a certain tolerance for religion (after all: money speaks louder than God to a merchant, self-reliance, a certain egalitarianism in regards to Royalty because you held the purse strings), no Royal privileges had to be given and no bedes (Royal requests for a loan to the Crown from the Free City) had to be made. This didn't lead to widespread public consultation and to a democratic tradition.

In the case of much of Eastern Europe (the Czech Republic comes to mind): they just took it from the ones who had laid the groundwork and who had done the building. Communism avant la lettre.

[The Lawspeaker]

Many cities that had been historically important - such as Sandomierz (Sandomir), located along the Vistula river - lost importance in the 1800s due to changes in political borders. After 1815 Sandomir became a peripheral town on the Russian-Austrian border and all trade and transport died out.

But as I said to someone else: who built these cities ? Merchants or Kings ?