coldie with a "lox"

**Absinthe** · 03-07-2009, 09:06 AM

Greetings!! I love your avatar and signature....you seem like a person with taste!

**Stormraaf** · 03-07-2009, 10:26 AM

1/8th Cherokee? Excuse me, but is there some kind of "cut-off point" on The Apricity as to how much non-European blood one can have before being banned from the forum? Last time I checked, TA was still a board for people of full European descent only.

I'm not trying to be rude here, Coldielox, but if the forum moderators intend to accept you as a member, I'd at least expect a rationalisation on how you reconcile your mixed ancestry with your views of cultural and ethnic European preservation, assuming you hold such views (otherwise, why'd you join?).

**coldielox** · 03-07-2009, 10:58 AM

lol ty absinthe

and storm: no offense taken.. if theres rules and regulations that should keep me from this forum, the please do not hesitate to enforce them.. I cant hel who my ancestors banged in history.. and just for a illy fact.. most Americans have some form of Indian in their blood line.. even if its a small amount, I mean they were here first

anyways, I am honest with my heritage, so if that causes a ban, thats fine.. was fun while it lasted.
if im banned.. was nice meting all of you.. and thank you for such a warm welcome.

**The Lawspeaker** · 03-07-2009, 11:45 AM

Stormraaf- A lot of Americans and Canadians have some indigenous blood running to their veins but that is no different from the early Afrikaans colonists that slept with their own slaves. We all know that's true and there is no point in denying that. Nor is it- given the circumstances these early colonists were in- shameful. I have read old V.O.C reports that indicated that the same was going on in the East Indies and that they were (literary) asking for "shiploads of young orphaned girls".

Even if she has some Indian blood in her- that doesn't make any less European or any less colonial. Well-yes perhaps it makes her more colonial but then again I have always chuckled a bit when a fifth generation American still calls himself Dutch,German, Maltese, English (and usually another very long list). The Americans are themselves steadily becoming a people, a nation. Like the Afrikaners cannot be called Dutch- they are a people and a nation of themselves.

Can Americans (or Afrikaners) be called a European people ? Yes if you look at their culture, their language and parts of their blood and heritage. They way they think and the way they conduct their daily lifes. Sure- because being European (that is if we count out certain countries) is also a social construct based on our common heritage that spread into the colonies. Of course some colonies were touched more then others- like Australia and New Zealand, like Canada and the US that received the full touch of British culture. Like South Africa whose Afrikaners received a full touch of Dutch culture.

Is being European a racial thing: sure is. But do the same standards go for European-Europeans and Colonial-Europeans then I say no. Because Colonial-Europeans are living in territories that were not originally European. Of course a certain standard has to be met and I know Coldie- does she look European ? Yes.

**Stormraaf** · 03-07-2009, 01:20 PM

The claim that all Americans are part Amerindian and that Afrikaners are part African and are "already mixed anyway" is nothing but multicultarist propaganda. Frankly, LS, I'm surprised and somewhat disappointed that someone like you have bought into it.

I won't deny that early Dutch colonists slept with their own slaves - the result of that is today's "coloured" mixed racial group in SA, numbering more than Afrikaners. Offspring from such unions were not considered Afrikaners, and "white" South Africans today claiming to have negroid admixture is simply wrong in calling themselves Afrikaners.

Coldielox, when someone's appearance and my interaction with that person tells me he or she is Germanic, or Celtic, or whatever the case may be, that's good enough for me and when it's down to a few silent foreign genes in one's blood, I'm not the type to go and make accusations of "impurity". However, since you've listed it in your profile, and put the admixture at 12.5% at that, I have my doubts - normally when people claim to have a significant foreign component in their own genetic makeup, they're pretty multicultarist. On the other hand, if your European identity is what's important to you and you champion the preservation of European society, then I hope you won't harbor any grudges against me for raising the issue.

I'd still like to hear from the moderators about where they'd draw the line, though. What if someone with a Jewish or Iranian great-grandparent signed up here, saying "I can't help that my great-grandmother allowed herself to be bedded by a semite"?

**The Lawspeaker** · 03-07-2009, 01:30 PM

Originally Posted by Stormraaf

The claim that all Americans are part Amerindian and that Afrikaners are part African and are "already mixed anyway" is nothing but multicultarist propaganda. Frankly, LS, I'm surprised and somewhat disappointed that someone like you have bought into it.

No I meant that I wouldn't be surprised. After all- the first ships arrived in the early 17th century and I am quite sure that not every one kept to their own kind as there were not enough women to go round. I am having my own opinions about that which are probably not too different from yours but it is the way it is. It happened.

I won't deny that early Dutch colonists slept with their own slaves - the result of that is today's "coloured" mixed racial group in SA, numbering more than Afrikaners. Offspring from such unions were not considered Afrikaners, and "white" South Africans today claiming to have negroid admixture is simply wrong in calling themselves Afrikaners.

Of course. But the fact is that it happened and whether society approves or not is off little relevance- it happened (there were certainly not enough settlers in the beginning and I am quite sure that there must have been some fumbling outside wedlock if only to make sure that there would be no inbreeding which is always a real danger in small groups). We share the same views on this matter but no colonial can claim that his ancestors followed the book unless he has his full ancestry well documented and even then we could ask ourselves some questions. It just happened- I am not the one to condemn our ancestors. But let's try to be realistic. After all- we were on their turf
But the question we need to ask ourselves is: where do we draw the line ?

I am going to put it even more strongly: because someone's ancestors married a non-European today someone with preservationist views is being turned down. Yes then I understand why preservationism can be very hard and why multiculturalism seems to be on the winning hand. It's like cutting ones own flesh and then complaining that it hurts.

**coldielox** · 03-07-2009, 01:40 PM

umm.. i was asked by someone to be very specific.. my first answer to these questions was im a mutt.. because theres soo much in me, and the fact that im not 100% on all my background.. the ones im 100% on are German italian , irish and polish.. the cherokee i believe due to some of the distant family members looks, however im pretty pale ( so pale that after every birth i gave, id freak the nurses out.. my husband had to be in the room at all times for the first 24 hrs just to inform my nurses i was naturally this pale) ... my mother told me im 1/8th indian.. i have NO clue if thats true.. nor do i go around being proud of being part indian, however im also not gunna bow my head down like i should be ashamed for my background.. i had to go to an all african amercian school as a freshman in HS ... and I got accosted every single day for being a slave owner ( among other things.. but that has nothin to do with this topic

).. i told them they were ignorant f*ks and that they enslaved their darn slaves.. and further more, i never touched them.. yes i am of my heritage.. but that does not mean i am gunna do as they did.. i am my own person, and proud of who I am as me.
so if you cant handel that i am part indian.. or a mutt to say the least, thats fine.. but i wont hold my head in shame for someone makin a mistake 100's of years ago in my family.

If the mods/admins feel I need to leave, they may ban me or ask me to do so.. I will go if thats what needs to be done, I don't desire to cause a situation...

and lastly.. im sorry if anything i have said in this post seems hostile.. or angry.. or w/e.. im not, im a very blunt person ( makes most ppl un easy due to the fact i am female) and i don't suck up to ppl just cause their superior to me.. if your wrong and i know it as a fact.. i have absolutely no problem informing you ( hopefully in a respectable way). But I am also completely able to take it if im wrong, and admit it. I hope not to cause any form of insult, I am just trying my best to explain, and speak for myself since I never expect someone else to do things for me.

**Electronic God-Man** · 03-07-2009, 06:20 PM

Honestly, "1/8th Cherokee" is the most frequently claimed non-European admixture in European-Americans.

First, whatever happened to full Cherokees, half Cherokees, 1/4 Cherokees, 1/16 Cherokees, etc.

Second, I wouldn't believe that you are Cherokee at all until you found out for sure. When did your German ancestors (the ones with the Indian blood) immigrate? The Polish and Italian (oh, and I see Irish too now) are obviously more recent and if the Germans in your family came here more recently as well then I would question whether an "off-the-boat" immigrant would marry an Indian.

In fact, I am going to guess that you were raised Catholic, judging by the Polish and Italian. There's a good chance that your German ancestors were recent immigrant Catholics too from Southern Germany. The thing that ties together your "mixed" ancestry is religion. ...but I suppose some Cherokee could have converted to Catholicism...

That's my best shot at playing detective.

**coldielox** · 03-07-2009, 06:28 PM

uhh no... my parents were forced into Catholic school, and thus revolted once they grew up.. as far as when certain ppl came into this country from my background, the only ones I know of are on my mothers side.. My grandfather was born in Ireland, and my grandmother was born in Italy.. as far as my fathers side.. I kinda have no way of knowing.. my grandmother is very quiet about our background because of the family being crule to her.. so I have no clue.. Her maiden name was Finley.. if that helps any, which would make my grandfather last name Valentine.. I am sorry, i kinda wish I knew more... but it is a very touche subject on my fathers side.. and I am almost an outcast because of their history..
I dont really go around tellin the world im part cherokee indian.. i was asked to be truthful and more descriptive.. so I added what I knew.. I dont even truly desire to look into tha matter.. my mother ( the crazy one) once told me i was 1/8th and i should claim the money for it.. i told her she was crazy and I was not gunna claim anything for that!