North Norwegian Hunter-Gatherer on GEDmatch

[Aren]

This is basically the Northernmost European ancient DNA sample known so far!

I mean geographically northernmost. But also genetically, as Leto wrote here:

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...=1#post5796330

I strongly doubt that these samples have the specific Balto-Slavic drift. They are just an EHG-WHG mix similar to the ones from Sweden, named SHG in Davids spreadsheet.
I think we just have to accept that Balto-Slavs rose from a small population probably located somewhere in Belarus and surrounding area during the LBA or the IA and that we wont find samples that will work well to model modern day Balto-Slavic speakers prior to that.

However David did mention that qpAdm ignores recent genetic drifts, if you know how to work qpAdm then try some runs and post them here.

[Peterski]

They are just an EHG-WHG mix similar to the ones from Sweden, named SHG in Davids spreadsheet.

If I remember correctly, SHG samples from Southern Sweden and Gotland have quite different scores on GEDmatch.

What about Hum1 and Hum2, Middle Mesolithic Southern Norway, 7500-7300 BC - are these samples in Global25 ???

[Aren]

If I remember correctly, SHG samples from Southern Sweden and Gotland have quite different scores on GEDmatch.

What about Hum1 and Hum2, Middle Mesolithic Southern Norway, 7500-7300 BC - are these samples in Global25 ???

BTW, I sent David raw data for Steigen, maybe he will add him.

No only the SHG from Östergötland in southern Sweden are there, and the Middle Neolithic samples from Gotland.

[Peterski]

No only the SHG from Östergötland in southern Sweden are there, and the Middle Neolithic samples from Gotland.

And they are also older than Steigen. Steigen is the youngest of all SHG samples we have so far.

Other Scandinavian Hunter-Gatherer samples available are older than 4000 BC (6000 years ago).

Edit:

Well, maybe only these ones from Gotland are younger, they co-existed with farmers as neighbours:

http://science.sciencemag.org/content/344/6185/747

What about Hum1 and Hum2, Middle Mesolithic Southern Norway, 7500-7300 BC - are these samples in Global25 ???

No

Too bad, because they were probably ancestral to Steigen, read below.

Some archaeological context (posted by Boreas on another forum):

Steigen was U5a1, just as two of the oldest remains found in western Fenno-Scandia; Hummervikholmen 1 and 2 - a man and a woman from the southernmost shores of Norway, some 9.500 BP.

Moreover, the man carried y-dna I2 (M438), while Steigen 3.500 yrs later carried I2 (M423).

Both these populations represent descendants of the pioneers that populated the Norwegian coast after ice-time, between 11.900 and 11.200 BP - from Hummerholmen to North Cape.

One may suspect that I2-M438 is ancestral to I2-M423.

It's well documented that these pioneers were seaborn fishers, trappers and hunters - mastering deep-sea-fishing as well as seal- and whale-hunting; from the North Sea to the Arctic Ocean.

Their origin is pretty well known to have been Bromme-Lyngby, from which this "Fosna-Hensbacka-culture" spread north, at the very beginning of the Holocene already.

Meanwhile the Bromme-Lyngby starts sperading south as the "Ahrensburg/Federmesser-culture" - branching south along the Atlantic Facade - as well as east into the Baltic, repopulating the mounth of Oder and Vistula - from where the "Swidrien-culture" went east, to become the Kunda/Volga/Suoumisalmi-cultures. This eastern branch became dominant east of the Botnic Oceaan - effectively repopulating Finland and the northern tiers of Fenno-Scandia - today recognized as the 10.800 year old "Komsa-culture".

During the late mesolithic is seems a borderland between the "Fosna-Hensbacka" and the "Komsa" develops along the weathershed north of Lofoten and the watershed of the North-Scandinavian Mountainridge. By 8.000 BP the major rivers crossing the northern arctic was somewhat populated - as routes of travel and trade went from the Botnic Bay - west to the North Atlantic and east to the White Sea, Carelia and the Volga-trade. The east-west-connections were very early. The first migrants to follow the Volga towards the Caspian Sea and Ural are documented around 11.000 yrs BP.

https://journals.plos.org/plosbiolog...l.pbio.2003703

Today we know that the oldest pottery found in Europe came through these connections - no less than 9.000 yrs ago. The first East-Asian ('Sino-Tibetan') brides to arrive Oleni Ostrov in Carelia appeared no less than 7.500 yrs BP. Well married, cherished and memorized - by a specific grave aka memorial - she could hardly have crossed the Urals by chance and luck.

One may note that Gunther et al misses out of the scenario of a common, paleolithic origin for the SHG, the EHG and the WHG - from - a refugia known to have survived at the shores of the Western Baltics - from where it spread both west and east. When these two branches meets - north of the Arctic Circle around 11.000 years ago - they had already developed characteristic differences in terms of tool-material and knapping-techniques, later visible in house-constructions, pottery-production, art/deco and trade-connections/import-materials. The eastern Komsa were obviously connected with contemporary Finland/Careila/Estonia - whose cultural origin were very close to the Swidrien - from where the early Komsa got their flint. Unlike the early Fosna-Hensbacka, who enjoyed shipments from the Scanian and Danian flint-mines.

The first HG succeeding to re-populate the Atlantic Facade from Biscany to North Cape, as well as the rivers mounting the North Sea and the Baltic Sea - all seem to share y-dna I2.
The later spread of EEF - between the rivers - seem to congruate pretty well with the Holocene Optimum and a massive growth of R1a and R1b throughout Eurasia, together with horse-breeding and cattle-farming, diaries and lactose persistance.

Some think the bifurication of y-dna R1 - into R1a and R1b - seem to have happened around the southern shores of the Baltics. That would correspond quite neatly with the native habitat of the paleolithic Aurochs, namely the heaths surrounding the wetlands of NW Europe - from Vallonia to Pommerania. Surrounding the SW Baltoics, where the highest diversity of domesticated horse- and cattle-races are found - along with the highest percentage of lactose persistance among any native population in the world.

http://theconversation.com/ancient-d...inavians-89703

[Cumansky]

One may suspect that I2-M438 is ancestral to I2-M423.

"Haplogroup I-M438,

also known as I2 (and until 2007 as I1b), is a human DNA Y-chromosome haplogroup, a subclade of Haplogroup I-M170. Haplogroup I-M438 originated some time around 26,000–31,000 BCE and has two primary subclades: I-L460, I-L596 and I-L147.

Haplogroup I-M438
Possible time of origin 28–33,000 years ago
Possible place of origin Eastern Europe (Balkans), possibly the Eastern Mediterranean
Ancestor I-M170
Descendants I-L460, I-L1251
Defining mutations M438/P215/S31

Highest frequencies
I2a1a: Sardinia
I2a1b: Bosnia and Herzegovina
I2a2: Britain, Germany, and Sweden

(The haplogroup can be found all over Europe) and reaches its maximum frequency in the Dinaric Alps in Eastern Europe (especially in the Balkans). Examples of basal I-M438* have been found in males from Crete and Sicily."

[Peterski]

Official PCA from the study in which stg001 was published, also confirms its "Estonian-ness":

https://journals.plos.org/plosbiolog...l.pbio.2003703

https://journals.plos.org/plosbiolog...=supplementary



^^^
This PCA shows that Norwegian hunter-gatherers were different than Swedish hunter-gatherers.

[Peterski]

I have uploaded this Steigen hunter-gatherer also to DNA Land, and here is his Ancestry Report:

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...ncestry-Report

[Imperator Biff]

EHG is basically WHG + ANE. The Norwegian HG was seriously admixed with ANEs. I think that admixture was absent in Central Europe and present only in Northeastern Europe. See the Lithuanian sample I posted (11% ANE, because Lithuania is more Southern than Northern Norway).

They also seem to harbour basal CHG related ancestry which would explain why a Karelian EHG turned up belonging to haplogroup J*.

[Proto-Shaman]

Admix Results (sorted):

#    Population    Percent
1    European_Hunters_Gatherers    77.05
2    Ancestral_Altaic    14.08
3    Amerindian    3.16
4    European_Early_Farmers    2.48
5    Arctic    1.8
6    Khoisan    0.49
7    South_Indian    0.43
8    East_Siberian    0.32
9    Paleo_Siberian    0.16
10    Archaic_Human    0.03

Single Population Sharing:

#    Population (source)    Distance
1    Saami ( )    21.52
2    Saami_Finland ( )    25.87
3    Bashkir ( )    29.74
4    Udmurd ( )    30.21
5    Mari ( )    31.59
6    Saami_Kola ( )    31.62
7    Tatar-Siberian ( )    31.93
8    Finn ( )    32.65
9    Karelian ( )    32.77
10    Finn_East ( )    34.12
11    Komi ( )    34.21
12    Chuvash ( )    34.38
13    Uygur-Han ( )    34.39
14    Finnish-East ( )    34.41
15    Hakas ( )    34.93
16    Finnish_FIN ( )    34.96
17    Kazahs ( )    35.37
18    Aleut ( )    35.46
19    Vepsa ( )    35.58
20    Chuvashs ( )    35.77

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

#         Primary Population (source)    Secondary Population (source)    Distance
1         84.4%    Saami ( )    +    15.6%    Athabask ( )    @    18.98
2         79.2%    Saami ( )    +    20.8%    Haida ( )    @    18.99
3         79.5%    Saami ( )    +    20.5%    Ojibwa ( )    @    19
4         78.4%    Saami ( )    +    21.6%    Ayta_AE ( )    @    19.17
5         81.9%    Saami ( )    +    18.1%    Cree ( )    @    19.29
6         87.2%    Saami ( )    +    12.8%    Navajo ( )    @    19.38
7         77.7%    Saami ( )    +    22.3%    Tsimsian ( )    @    19.41
8         81.6%    Saami ( )    +    18.4%    Ati ( )    @    19.51
9         80.1%    Saami ( )    +    19.9%    Mamanawa ( )    @    19.54
10         83.5%    Saami ( )    +    16.5%    Sandawe ( )    @    19.55
11         85.9%    Saami ( )    +    14.1%    Cochimi ( )    @    19.55
12         82.6%    Saami ( )    +    17.4%    Manggarai ( )    @    19.58
13         82.9%    Saami ( )    +    17.1%    Lamaholt ( )    @    19.59
14         84.6%    Saami ( )    +    15.4%    Khwe ( )    @    19.6
15         83%            Saami ( )    +    17%            Kensiu ( )    @    19.61
16         84.1%    Saami ( )    +    15.9%    Hema ( )    @    19.62
17         88.6%    Saami ( )    +    11.4%    Apache ( )    @    19.62
18         83.3%    Saami ( )    +    16.7%    Lembata ( )    @    19.63
19         85.1%    Saami ( )    +    14.9%    Shua ( )    @    19.65
20         83.7%    Saami ( )    +    16.3%    Algonquin ( )    @    19.65 

Looks like autosomal R1 but has I1, How comes? hmmmmm...

[Harkonnen]

Basically he was part of the population which, much later, the Sagas called Kvens:

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...-Scandinavians

Is Steigen hunter-gatherer present in Global25 spreadsheet ???

Dodecad V3:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 West_European 58.23
2 East_European 37.33
3 Northeast_Asian 4.01
4 Palaeo_African 0.24
5 Neo_African 0.09
6 Mediterranean 0.09

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Finnish (Dodecad) 8.3
2 FIN (1000Genomes) 10.44
3 Swedish (Dodecad) 26.92
4 Russian (HGDP) 27
5 Polish (Dodecad) 27.48
6 Russian (Dodecad) 27.6
7 Mixed_Slav (Dodecad) 27.99
8 German (Dodecad) 28.7
9 Norwegian (Dodecad) 30.46
10 Lithuanians (Behar) 30.93
11 Slovenian (Xing) 31.67
12 Hungarians (Behar) 32.56
13 Lithuanian (Dodecad) 32.69
14 Argyll (1000 Genomes) 32.71
15 N._European (Xing) 32.97
16 Orkney (1000 Genomes) 33.45
17 Orcadian (HGDP) 33.67
18 CEU (HapMap) 34.37
19 Belorussian (Behar) 34.49
20 Mixed_Germanic (Dodecad) 36.38

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 87.7% Finnish (Dodecad) + 12.3% Norwegian (Dodecad) @ 7.2
2 86.3% Finnish (Dodecad) + 13.7% Swedish (Dodecad) @ 7.21
3 66.9% Finnish (Dodecad) + 33.1% FIN (1000Genomes) @ 7.49
4 92.1% Finnish (Dodecad) + 7.9% Irish (Dodecad) @ 7.63
5 93% Finnish (Dodecad) + 7% British_Isles (Dodecad) @ 7.81
6 93.4% Finnish (Dodecad) + 6.6% Cornwall (1000 Genomes) @ 7.84
7 93.3% Finnish (Dodecad) + 6.7% British (Dodecad) @ 7.84
8 93.9% Finnish (Dodecad) + 6.1% Kent (1000 Genomes) @ 7.93
9 94.6% Finnish (Dodecad) + 5.4% Dutch (Dodecad) @ 8.03
10 94.8% Finnish (Dodecad) + 5.2% Mixed_Germanic (Dodecad) @ 8.07
11 96.4% Finnish (Dodecad) + 3.6% Orkney (1000 Genomes) @ 8.22
12 96.7% Finnish (Dodecad) + 3.3% Orcadian (HGDP) @ 8.23
13 96.8% Finnish (Dodecad) + 3.2% Argyll (1000 Genomes) @ 8.23
14 97.6% Finnish (Dodecad) + 2.4% N._European (Xing) @ 8.26
15 98.3% Finnish (Dodecad) + 1.7% CEU (HapMap) @ 8.28
16 98.3% Finnish (Dodecad) + 1.7% German (Dodecad) @ 8.29
17 100% Finnish (Dodecad) + 0% Adygei (HGDP) @ 8.3
18 100% Finnish (Dodecad) + 0% Altai (Rasmussen) @ 8.3
19 100% Finnish (Dodecad) + 0% Armenian (Dodecad) @ 8.3
20 100% Finnish (Dodecad) + 0% Armenians_16 (Behar) @ 8.3



His results in Eurogenes Hunter_Gatherer vs. Farmer Admixture Proportions:

Population
Anatolian Farmer -
Baltic Hunter Gatherer 94.03 Pct
Middle Eastern Herder -
East Asian Farmer -
South American Hunter Gatherer 4.75 Pct
South Asian Hunter Gatherer -
North Eurasian Hunter Gatherer 1.22 Pct
East African Pastoralist -
Oceanian Hunter Gatherer -
Mediterranean Farmer -
Pygmy Hunter Gatherer -
Bantu Farmer -

Kal006 from Sigtuna gets pretty high Baltic HG in that test also, whatever it exactly is