Who are Macedonians genetically and phenotypically closer to: Montenegrins or Bulgarians?

[Vojnik]

I thought all Macedonian citizens were called Macedonians as meta-identity. Like Belgian or Turkish citizens. Isn't that right?

I'm obviously referring to the Macedonian ethnicity. Especially when i'm asking who they are closer to genetically.

But, yes, Macedonian is also a meta identity covering all citizens.

[Dianatomia]

Clearly Bulgarians without a doubt. Differences between the two can be regarded as regional differences. There are differences between South and North Bulgarians as well. In this line of thought, the Macedonian Slavs can be regarded as Western Bulgarians based on phenotypes. But they have evolved a separate identity.

Nothing is black and white though, there are some who look similar to Greeks or Serbs.

[Novi Pazar]

Yes Macedonians are Asians like their Bulgarian brothers, off to Eastern Asia!

[oszkar07]

Well I read some theories that claim that Macedonian 's are just rogue or lost Bulgarian's, Im not entirely certain how accurate this is ... I havnt personally researched this thoroughly to be certain.
But from what I have seen as for the OP i would feel confident in saying Bulgarians.

[Novi Pazar]

^ Oszkar, it's laughable that Bulgarians stealing the name Macedonia and it means nothing in their Bulgarian language, whilst in Serbian it means the region of poppies. Yes, your right, they look up to Bulgarian Khans and the Turkic State of Bulgaria as the pinnacle! So, in essence they are Bulgars who tie up to East Asian Mongolian Bulgars!

[oszkar07]

^ Oszkar, it's laughable that Bulgarians stealing the name Macedonia and it means nothing in their Bulgarian language, whilst in Serbian it means the region of poppies. Yes, your right, they look up to Bulgarian Khans and the Turkic State of Bulgaria as the pinnacle! So, in essence they are Bulgars who tie up to East Asian Mongolian Bulgars!

Hey Zdravo Novi , i knew u from old Ilyria forum's , kako si Mate ,

So you think they are lost Serbs Novi ?

[Novi Pazar]

^ yes, it's me! All good Oszkar, it's been difficult for the past year, got child number 3. Man, when your 42 years old not easy to wake up during nights to feed or change the kid. Way easier when l was in my late 20s and early 30s with my first two. I hope things are all with you bro?

To answer your question, yes they are Serbs, 100%! The unfortunate occurance of Bulgar lead VRMO, who's origins and founders were Bulgars who met in Thessaloniki to act solely against Serbs, and the Bulgarian Exarchos, was enough to mould these unlucky people into a de facto Bulgars........now, the Macedonian Bulgars would say it's better to be Turk than Serbian, strange anti-Serbianism!

[Aspar]

Hey Zdravo Novi , i knew u from old Ilyria forum's , kako si Mate ,

So you think they are lost Serbs Novi ?

Hello there,

As an ethnic Macedonian, I strongly advise you to not listen to this Serbian nationalist.
People like him are extremely nationalistic, extremely aggressive, extremely rude and extreme liars.
They are the main reason for destabilization and for the bad reputation of the Balkans!
They don't have any respect and honor and when you smack them, they play victim and even ask you why did you smacked them!

There are many arguments that disprove what he says, the main ones are the language we speak, as the Serbs struggle to understand our language and is not about dialectical thing.

Our languages are fundamentally different, particularly the grammar, and I would mention a few different characteristics:

1.Macedonian has definite articles, which Serbian doesn’t have;
2.Macedonian verbs have no infinitives, Serbian verbs have them;
3.In Macedonian nouns are not declined, in Serbian they are;
4.Macedonian has more verb tenses than Serbian.
5.Different vocabulary(Macedonian have some words that shares only with the Bulgarian and no other Slavic language, some of these words are shared with Albanian, so their ultimate origin might be Thracian or Illyrian).
6.Macedonian is part of the Balkan sprachbund, while Serbian is not: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balkan_sprachbund

And of course, the recent genetic researches about ancestry for which you can find a lot of informations on this or other forums which totally down play the claims of some of these nationalists.
I have made a thread about gedmatch kits of Macedonians where you can have a look yourself: https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...ent-on-the-map

Also, according to DNA data for 17 Y-chromosomal STR loci in Macedonians, the Macedonian population has the lowest genetic distance against the Bulgarian population (0.0815)...Jakovski et al. (2011). "Genetic data for 17 Y-chromosomal STR loci in Macedonians in the Republic of Macedonia"

From the same study, Jakovski et al. (2011), https://balkaninsight.com/2012/01/23...t-similar-dna/, “The analysis of the data has showed that residents of Macedonia share the most DNA with Bulgarians; Serbs and Croats with Bosniaks; while Kosovo Albanians have the fewest similarities with the others,” says the Institute’s Dr Zlatko Jakovski.

Kind regards

[Novi Pazar]

^ the language of Bulgarian to be Turkic/Turkish/Tartar has to at least contain 30% of non-Serbian Slavic! How does an Albanian like you know this! Albanians arrive into Serbian Drach for the first time with Greeks (Romans) as mercenaries in the year 1043AD!

Today's Bulgars past the YAT division are Serbs, this includes the Shopi. Even so, the ones east of YAT speak an archaic form of old Serbian with the loss of declensions!

[Crn Volk]

^ the language of Bulgarian to be Turkic/Turkish/Tartar has to at least contain 30% of non-Serbian Slavic! How does an Albanian like you know this! Albanians arrive into Serbian Drach for the first time with Greeks (Romans) as mercenaries in the year 1043AD!

Today's Bulgars past the YAT division are Serbs, this includes the Shopi. Even so, the ones east of YAT speak an archaic form of old Serbian with the loss of declensions!

Batka mnogu znaesh da kazhvash ama ne mislam znaesh ni eden zbor srpski pa makar Makedonski ili Bugarski. Ajde mrsh od tuka i zanimavajse so neshto drugo.