USA big genetic study 15.620 samples

[Argentano]

Cuz those nuevomexicanos were part of the New Spain viceroyalty and Iturbide's empire. But I don't understand why their euro component is mainly iberian, they seems more iberian than argentines in the genotype way.

[CostaRicaBall]

Yes but I mean, if they were and are part of USA. Make more sense that gringos absorbed them and pushed down their iberian component.

[Westbrook]

False. All of us have Indian, Jewish, and/or SSA mixture. Everyone knows this.

For what it’s worth, this white American has no Amerindian or ssa admixture (talking about myself)

[Carlito's Way]

It's really interesting and something that was already known. Northern regions that are now part of US were probably the whitest parts of Colonial Mexico and the ''Hispanos'' of New Mexico and other previous Mexican states were always regarded as whites by Americans before Mexican mass immigration started in the second half of the 20th century.

The claim of Mexican users that Hispanos are exactly like Mexicans from Mexico seems to be untrue.

You really need to read studies posted on this forum, especially those posted by Argento who seems to never really summarize where they take these reference samples from in the first place
For example, the "Mexican" samples come from an old project called 1000 Genomes which are samples from Los Angeles Mexican Americans

"The individual panels shown correspond to Native American reference populations (Chipewyan, Algonquin, Cree, Ojibwa, Pima, Tepehuano), 1000 Genomes Project reference populations (Mexican and Puerto Rican)"
https://www.coriell.org/1/NHGRI/Coll...les-CA-USA-MXL

"Including the name of the city and state where these samples were collected reinforces the point that the sample set, while not genetically "atypical", does not necessarily represent all people with Mexican ancestry in the United States, nor all Mexican people, whose population history is complex."


Los Angeles Mexicans are of Western-Central and Southern Mexican roots, therefore OBVIOUSLY New Mexicans will show a different Amerindian component because our indigenous people are DIVERSE genetically, now if this study would have included people from Chihuahua, Zacatecas and Sonora then you would have seen a similar Amerindian component because the Mexicans who settled there were from those states, not from Western-Central and Southern Mexico

Yeah, it makes sense considering what was already known. It seems a substantial portion of the population in the previous Mexican regions of New Mexico, California, Colorado etc. was made of criollos and castizos, with indo-mestizos and mestizos being very minoritary. It's no wonder they were considered white oficially until the 50s when they lost white status due to association with Mexicans from Mexico proper and Central Americans. It's a similar reason to why Spaniards are regarded as ''Hispanics/Latinos'' in USA.

That is false and there are census based on the races of the first Mexican settlers in those areas and majority were mestizos, in fact the first pobladores of Los Angeles were majority Afro-Mexicans and Native Americans
New Mexicans are similar to Northern Mexicans, particularly the ones from Northwestern Mexico, this is why New Mexicans on 23andMe have Mexico under the Native American category LOL because of their high Mexican matches and they have Chihuahua as their top matches for Mexico, I wonder why.... I will post my brother's girlfriend who is colonial New Mexican 23andMe results, she has Mexico under her Native American and when she clicks to see the Mexican map, she has Chihuahua and Zacatecas as her two top matches, her last names are primarily found in Northwestern Mexico other than New Mexico smh


And Mexican Americans were considered white but not socially accepted as such, this is why Mexican Americans FOUGHT to be classified as minorities rather than being classified as white

"In some cases, legal classification of white racial status has made it difficult for Mexican-American rights activists to prove minority discrimination. In the case Hernandez v. Texas (1954), civil rights lawyers for the appellant, named Pedro Hernandez, were confronted with a paradox: because Mexican Americans were classified as white by the federal government and not as a separate race in the census, lower courts held that they were not being denied equal protection by being tried by juries that excluded Mexican Americans by practice. The lower court ruled there was no violation of the Fourteenth Amendment by excluding people with Mexican ancestry among the juries. Attorneys for the state of Texas and judges in the state courts contended that the amendment referred only to racial, not "nationality," groups. Thus, since Mexican Americans were tried by juries composed of their racial group—whites—their constitutional rights were not violated. The US Supreme Court ruling in Hernandez v. Texas case held that "nationality" groups could be protected under the Fourteenth Amendment, and it became a landmark in the civil rights history of the United States."

"While Mexican Americans were allowed to serve in all-white units during World War II, many Mexican–American veterans were discriminated against and even denied medical services by the United States Department of Veterans Affairs when they arrived home. They created the G.I. Forum to work for equal treatment"

"In the late 1960s the founding of the Crusade for Justice in Denver and the land grant movement in New Mexico in 1967 set the bases for what would become known as Chicano (Mexican American) nationalism. The 1968 Los Angeles, California school walkouts expressed Mexican-American demands to end de facto ethnic segregation (also based on residential patterns), increase graduation rates, and reinstate a teacher fired for supporting student political organizing. A notable event in the Chicano movement was the 1972 Convention of La Raza Unida (United People) Party, which organized with the goal of creating a third party to give Chicanos political power in the U.S."

"Although Mexican Americans were legally classified as "White" in terms of official federal policy, socially they were seen as "too Indian" to be treated as such. Many organizations, businesses, and homeowners associations and local legal systems had official policies in the early 20th century to exclude Mexican Americans in a racially discriminatory way. Throughout the Southwest, discrimination in wages was institutionalized in "white wages" versus lower "Mexican wages" for the same job classifications. For Mexican Americans, opportunities for employment were largely limited to guest worker programs."


If people are going to talk about Mexican American history, they really need to read up books about this, and don't make me post pictures of those so called "white" mexicans because they were majority mestizo looking and many pred Amerindians were commonly seen

[Argentano]

You really need to read studies posted on this forum, especially those posted by Argento who seems to never really summarize where they take these reference samples from in the first place
For example, the "Mexican" samples come from an old project called 1000 Genomes which are samples from Los Angeles Mexican Americans

Apart from that mexican reference you have a lot more hispanics/mexican samples from different regions of USA tested in this study. Thousands. Only the Mountain hispanics (where nuevomexicanos live) are the ones having a different native component. The other region hispanics have results closer to the mexican reference. Look at WSC Hispanics and Pacific Hispanics All have similar native to the mexican reference.

Native American ancestry of the Nuevomexicanos
The ADMIXTURE results for the Hispanic/Latino group in the Mountain region (MNT) point to the presence of two distinct sub-populations, one of which is clearly Mexican in origin, whereas the second group has a very distinct pattern compared to any other Hispanic/Latino group analyzed here (Figure 4B and Figure 6A). If these two apparent Mountain Hispanic/Latino sub-populations are considered separately, they form distinct phylogenetic groups (Figure 6B). One group clearly falls into the clade with the other Mexican origin populations (see MNT, Mexican), whereas the distinct group is basal to the Mexican clade and intermediate between the Western US and Mexican clades (see MNT, Nuevomexicano). The results of the ADMIXTURE and phylogenetic analyses are consistent with historical records indicating the presence of a unique group of Spanish descendants in the American Southwest, known as the ‘Hispanos of New Mexico’ or Nuevomexicanos. This population is descended from very early Spanish settlers to the Four Corners region of the US, primarily New Mexico and southern Colorado, and distinct from Mexican-American immigrants who arrived later27.

Members of the Nuevomexicano population have maintained a distinct cultural identity for centuries, and the ability to isolate individuals from this group based on analysis of their genotypes allowed us to address open questions related to their ancestry. In addition to characterizing their distinct pattern of Native American ancestry, we also compared the levels of Native American admixture between Nuevomexicanos and the other nearby Hispanic/Latino groups, which show a more Mexican pattern of Native American ancestry. Consistent with previous results28, we show that Nuevomexicanos have significantly more European ancestry and less Native American ancestry than other Hispanic/Latino groups from the Western Census regions (Figure 6C). Nuevomexicanos also show significantly lower levels of African ancestry compared to the other Hispanic/Latino groups.

Nuevomexicano cultural and historical traditions suggest that many of the early Spanish settlers in the region were Conversos, or crypto-Jewish individuals, who ostensibly converted to Catholicism in an effort to avoid religious persecution and pogroms, while secretly maintaining Jewish identity and traditions29. We interrogated this idea by comparing the extent of Sephardic Jewish admixture found among individuals with the Nuevomexicano ancestry pattern compared to other Hispanic/Latino populations. Sephardic Jewish admixture was measured by comparing European haplotypes from Hispanic/Latino individuals to a reference panel including both European and Sephardic Jewish populations. Nuevomexicanos show elevated levels of matching to Jewish haplotypes compared to Spanish and other European populations, consistent with substantial Converso ancestry among New World Hispanic/Latino populations30 (Figure 6d). However, Nuevomexicanos do not show a higher level of Converso ancestry compared to the other New World Hispanic/Latino populations.


....Perhaps most striking, the patterns of Native American ancestry seen for the Mountain census regions were alone sufficient to distinguish descendants of very early Spanish settlers to the region, the group known as Hispanos or Nuevomexicanos, from subsequent waves of Hispanic/Latino immigrants who arrived later from Mexico.


Implications of genetic ancestry for the historical and cultural traditions of Nuevomexicanos
Our ability to distinguish Nuevomexicanos from the HRS dataset, using their patterns of Native American ancestry, allowed us to address a number of open questions and controversies regarding the history and culture of this interesting population. Nuevomexicanos from the American southwest are historically defined as the descendants of early Spanish settlers, those who arrived in the period from 1598 to 1848, as opposed to immigrants from Mexico who arrived the region considerably later. The two distinct patterns of Native American ancestry seen for Hispanic/Latino individuals from the Mountain census region are very much consistent with this historical definition. The Nuevomexicanos show a pattern of Native American ancestry that is intermediate to the Canadian and Mesoamerican reference populations analyzed here, whereas the Mexican American individuals from the same region are more closely related to Mesoamerican reference populations. This is consistent with early admixture with local Native American groups in the US southwest, for the Nuevomexicanos, versus admixture with Mesoamerican groups in Mexico for the later Mexican immigrants. A more precise characterization of Nuevomexicanos’ Native American ancestry would require access to genomic data from US Native American reference populations, which are not readily available owing to cultural resistance to genetic testing for ancestry among these groups37.

Historically, Nuevomexicanos have identified strongly with their European (Spanish) ancestry, while downplaying ancestral ties to Native Americans38. This tradition of exclusive European identity is rooted in the colonial era when Spanish descendants in the region were preoccupied with the notion of maintaining so-called pure blood, and the local aristocracy identified as Castilian. Mexicans, on the other hand, have long identified as Mestizo with an explicit recognition of their Native American heritage39. Our comparative analysis of genetic ancestry for Nuevomexicanos and Mexican ancestry groups yielded results that are partly consistent with this historical narrative. On the one hand, Nuevomexicanos do have a substantial amount of Native American ancestry, with a median of just under 40% (Figure 6C), which is far more than seen for the African American and European American groups analyzed here, and also more than seen for an number of other Latin American populations in the Caribbean and South America40. Nevertheless, the Nuevomexicanos have significantly less Native American ancestry, and more European ancestry, than nearby Mexican descendant populations (Figure 6C). Our results are consistent with a recent study that used microsatellite-based ancestry analysis on a much smaller sample of self-identified Nuevomexicanos, who were also found to have higher European ancestry and lower Native American ancestry compared to Mexican Americans28. Interestingly, we found that the Nuevomexicanos also have significantly less African ancestry than Mexican descendant populations, which likely reflects higher levels of early African admixture in Mexico41.

Perhaps the most controversial aspect of Nuevomexicano history relates to the influence of Conversos, or crypto-Jewish individuals, on the culture and traditions of the local community. Conversos are Jewish people who converted to Catholicism under intense pressure from religious persecution in Spain, and elsewhere in Europe, and many Spanish Conversos immigrated to the New World42. Despite their forced conversion to Catholicism, some New World Conversos apparently maintained Jewish religious traditions over the centuries since their immigration from Spain. For example, the persistence of rituals and symbols related to Jewish traditions in New Mexico has been taken as evidence for an influential presence of Conversos among the Nuevomexicanos, a position championed by the historian Stanley Hordes29. On the other hand, the folklorist Judith Neulander and others have been fiercely critical of this narrative based on what they perceive to be misunderstandings of the origins of many of the cultural traditions tied to Jewish rituals and even deliberate misrepresentations of facts43. Neulander’s interpretation relates the notion of Converso identity among Nuevomexicanos back to the colonial assertions of pure Spanish ancestry given that the Sephardim are Spanish and would presumably be loath to marry outside of their religious group44.

We evaluated the extent of Sephardic Jewish ancestry among Nuevomexicanos, via comparative analysis of their European haplotypes to both European and Sephardic Jewish reference populations, in attempt to assess the genetic evidence in support of the Converso narrative. While we did find more Sephardic Jewish ancestry among Nuevomexicanos compared to Spaniards or other Europeans, they did not show any more Sephardic Jewish ancestry than Mexican descendants from nearby regions (Figure 6D). Our results are consistent with a recent study that used haplotype-based ancestry methods to uncover widespread Converso ancestry in Latin American populations30. Taken together, we interpret these results to indicate that, while Nuevomexicanos do in fact have a demonstrable amount of Jewish ancestry, they are no more, or less, Jewish than other New World Latin American populations. Of course, we cannot weigh in on the strength of evidence for or against the persistence of Jewish cultural traditions among Nuevomexicanos based on our genetic evidence alone. Nevertheless, there does not seem to be anything particularly unique, at least from the genetic perspective, with respect to the extent of Sephardic Jewish heritage among Nuevomexicanos.

[Smitty]

Do african americans usually claim Native ancestry? They have a little more than whites

Most of the blacks on YouTube seem to claim Indian blood. I don't know any personally.

[Argentano]

Edit

[CordedWhelp]

False. All of us have Indian, Jewish, and/or SSA mixture. Everyone knows this.

What's funny though, is if my wife and I have children, they will be 1/8 Amerindian and have a slight sliver of SSA.