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Thread: East Finnish sports superiority over West Finland

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    Quote Originally Posted by Harkonnen View Post
    Do you happen to know Seppo's opinion on Germany?
    who

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    How about these:

    Jarkko Nieminen - the best Finnish tennis player of all times




    Matti Hautamäki - one of the young sky jumper


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    Quote Originally Posted by Impaler View Post
    How about these:

    Jarkko Nieminen - the best Finnish tennis player of all times




    Matti Hautamäki - one of the young sky jumper

    Both dudes are Westerners.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Teutone View Post
    who
    Does not speak when he is asked. Speaks when he is not asked. That is Seppo.

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  6. #46
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    Do you differentiate between East Finns and West Finns by their surnames? Many in Northern Finland have Western Finnish surnames, but Eastern Finnish genetics if I am not wrong.

    I have seen many Finnish immigrants in Sweden who looked very Skandonordid and could easily pass for Swedish, and nearly all Finns in Sweden are Eastern Finns. Meanwhile, I saw many in Southern Ostrobothnia, Satakunta and SW Finland who looked very "Finnish" as in exaggerated Baltid or East Baltic types. I even have a friend who is half Swedish-speaking Finland-Swede with a super Swedish mother and looks very Baltid.

    Yet, both DNA studies and old school typologists said that these were supposed to be the most Germanic-shifted and Nordid Finns. This geographic bias when it comes to Finland seems to be pretty off IMHO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Östsvensk View Post
    nearly all Finns in Sweden are Eastern Finns
    Isn't that true of only Forest Finns, but not of the Finns who migrated to Sweden after World War 2?

    The map below shows how many promilles (not percent) of the population of each Finnish municipality migrated to Sweden in the year 1970 (which was the peak year of Finnish migration to Sweden along with 1969). The darkest regions are mostly in Lapland, Ostrobothnia, and in the Swedish-speaking municipalities of southern Finland. Of course almost no-one lives in Lapland. Today even the combined population of the four Ostrobothnian regions of Finland (about 830,000) is about five times the population of the region of Lapland (about 180,000).


    http://www.migrationinstitute.fi/fil...n_28042014.pdf

    In 2016, the total number of persons living in Sweden who either were born in Finland or who had a parent or grandparent who was born in Finland was estimated as 719,179 (https://sverigesradio.se/sida/artike...rtikel=6638007).

    The total population of predominantly Eastern Finnish regions of Finland was listed as 1,024,854 by Wikipedia (https://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suomen_maakunnat) (Keski-Suomi 275,364, Pohjois-Savo 244,707, Pohjois-Karjala 161,540, Etelä-Savo 142,770, Etelä-Karjala 128,054, Kainuu 72,419).

    Eastern Finns and Western Finns have become so mixed that the number of pure Eastern Finns whose all grandparents are Eastern Finnish is possibly even smaller than the number of persons who live in Sweden with one or more Finnish grandparent.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ymyyakhtakh View Post
    Isn't that true of only Forest Finns, but not of the Finns who migrated to Sweden after World War 2?

    The map below shows how many promilles (not percent) of the population of each Finnish municipality migrated to Sweden in the year 1970 (which was the peak year of Finnish migration to Sweden along with 1969). The darkest regions are mostly in Lapland, Ostrobothnia, and in the Swedish-speaking municipalities of southern Finland. Of course almost no-one lives in Lapland. Today even the combined population of the four Ostrobothnian regions of Finland (about 830,000) is about five times the population of the region of Lapland (about 180,000).


    http://www.migrationinstitute.fi/fil...n_28042014.pdf

    In 2016, the total number of persons living in Sweden who either were born in Finland or who had a parent or grandparent who was born in Finland was estimated as 719,179 (https://sverigesradio.se/sida/artike...rtikel=6638007).

    The total population of predominantly Eastern Finnish regions of Finland was listed as 1,024,854 by Wikipedia (https://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suomen_maakunnat) (Keski-Suomi 275,364, Pohjois-Savo 244,707, Pohjois-Karjala 161,540, Etelä-Savo 142,770, Etelä-Karjala 128,054, Kainuu 72,419).

    Eastern Finns and Western Finns have become so mixed that the number of pure Eastern Finns whose all grandparents are Eastern Finnish is possibly even smaller than the number of persons who live in Sweden with one or more Finnish grandparent.
    I see that Central Ostrobothnia* had large migrations. The majority were from northern Finland? Well, these regions are supposed to have the "least" Germanic genetics according to Lundman:



    *Kokkola aka Sweden Finn

    Spoiler!

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Östsvensk View Post
    I see that Central Ostrobothnia* had large migrations. The majority were from northern Finland? Well, these regions are supposed to have the "least" Germanic genetics according to Lundman:

    Lundman's map also shows that "the intensity of the Nordic race" is lower on average in Denmark than in Southwestern Finland or Estonia.

    The map says "beräknad efter kartorna 1-4" ("calculated based on maps 1-4"), where map 1 is adult male height, map 2 is cephalic index, map 3 is percentage of males with light or mixed eyes, and map 4 is percentage of 22-year-old men with light hair color (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/rastyper-03.htm). (Did Lundman really have data of the hair color of specifically 22-year-old males even from multiple regions of Finland?)

    Anyway, I don't trust Lundman's data, because his map for eye color shows Finland as being much darker-eyed than Sweden, and it shows multiple regions of Sweden as having 97-98% light and mixed eyes. In Lundman's map for adult male height, Finns are also shown to be much shorter than Swedes, but in the Wikipedia article titled "Average human height by country", adult male height is listed as 181.5 cm in Sweden and 180.7 cm in Finland.

    A table published by a Polish blog based on data collected by Karin Mark includes two Eastern Finnish populations (Northeast Finns and Ingrians) and one North Germanic population (Finland-Swedes). Both Northeast Finns and Ingrians have lighter average hair color than Finland-Swedes. The average eye color is the same in Ingrians and Finland-Swedes but lighter than either in Northeast Finns.

    (average eye color (lower is lighter);average hair color (lower is lighter);population)
    0.29;3.00;Izhorian
    0.32;2.86;Northeast Finnish
    0.33;2.80;Finnish
    0.36;3.26;Livonian
    0.37;2.36;Northwest Russian (Ostrov)
    0.37;2.71;Estonian
    0.39;2.90;Ingrian
    0.39;2.99;Finland-Swede
    0.40;2.85;Votic-Izhorian
    0.46;2.92;Karelian
    0.48;2.05;Curonian
    0.49;3.02;Mordvin (Karatai)
    0.50;2.78;Northern Latvian (Limba˛i)
    0.53;3.11;Mordvin (Erzya)
    0.54;3.08;Vepsian
    0.56;2.94;Mordvin (Teryukhan)
    0.62;3.25;Volga-Ural Russian
    0.64;3.08;Komi-Zyrian
    0.71;3.18;Mordvin (Moksha)
    0.77;3.20;Komi-Permyak
    0.78;3.36;Saami
    0.91;3.31;Udmurt (Besserman)
    0.92;3.46;Mari
    0.95;3.26;Udmurt
    1.12;3.63;Tatar
    1.12;3.60;Chuvash
    1.28;3.67;Mansi
    1.32;3.82;Bashkir
    1.39;3.73;Khanty

    A "pigmentation index" was the lowest in Estonians, followed by Finns, Northeast Finns, Izhorians, Ingrians, Finland-Swedes, and Karelians:


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ymyyakhtakh View Post
    Lundman's map also shows that "the intensity of the Nordic race" is lower on average in Denmark than in Southwestern Finland or Estonia.

    The map says "beräknad efter kartorna 1-4" ("calculated based on maps 1-4"), where map 1 is adult male height, map 2 is cephalic index, map 3 is percentage of males with light or mixed eyes, and map 4 is percentage of 22-year-old men with light hair color (https://www.theapricity.com/snpa/rastyper-03.htm). (Did Lundman really have data of the hair color of specifically 22-year-old males even from multiple regions of Finland?)

    Anyway, I don't trust Lundman's data, because his map for eye color shows Finland as being much darker-eyed than Sweden, and it shows multiple regions of Sweden as having 97-98% light and mixed eyes. In Lundman's map for adult male height, Finns are also shown to be much shorter than Swedes, but in the Wikipedia article titled "Average human height by country", adult male height is listed as 181.5 cm in Sweden and 180.7 cm in Finland.

    A table published by a Polish blog based on data collected by Karin Mark includes two Eastern Finnish populations (Northeast Finns and Ingrians) and one North Germanic population (Finland-Swedes). Both Northeast Finns and Ingrians have lighter average hair color than Finland-Swedes. The average eye color is the same in Ingrians and Finland-Swedes but lighter than either in Northeast Finns.

    (average eye color (lower is lighter);average hair color (lower is lighter);population)
    0.29;3.00;Izhorian
    0.32;2.86;Northeast Finnish
    0.33;2.80;Finnish
    0.36;3.26;Livonian
    0.37;2.36;Northwest Russian (Ostrov)
    0.37;2.71;Estonian
    0.39;2.90;Ingrian
    0.39;2.99;Finland-Swede
    0.40;2.85;Votic-Izhorian
    0.46;2.92;Karelian
    0.48;2.05;Curonian
    0.49;3.02;Mordvin (Karatai)
    0.50;2.78;Northern Latvian (Limbaži)
    0.53;3.11;Mordvin (Erzya)
    0.54;3.08;Vepsian
    0.56;2.94;Mordvin (Teryukhan)
    0.62;3.25;Volga-Ural Russian
    0.64;3.08;Komi-Zyrian
    0.71;3.18;Mordvin (Moksha)
    0.77;3.20;Komi-Permyak
    0.78;3.36;Saami
    0.91;3.31;Udmurt (Besserman)
    0.92;3.46;Mari
    0.95;3.26;Udmurt
    1.12;3.63;Tatar
    1.12;3.60;Chuvash
    1.28;3.67;Mansi
    1.32;3.82;Bashkir
    1.39;3.73;Khanty

    A "pigmentation index" was the lowest in Estonians, followed by Finns, Northeast Finns, Izhorians, Ingrians, Finland-Swedes, and Karelians:

    Lundman was biased, but his map is probably in order with how Finns and Finnish migrants would cluster in relation to the Swedish host population. One person (jokingly, I think) said that half Finns should be thrown out and one responded with trying to say that many Finns had Swedish ancestors. If there were, then most probably northern Finland from where they got all their immigrants is the last place where you would find those.

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