The genetic diversity of Northern Italy

[Adamastor]

There are Italians in Trento.

Only as immigrants.

[Nurzat]

Rumano immigrants can assimilate in Northeast Italy then.

yes, Romanians and Italians share a whole lot: looks, language, culture...


Romanian versus Italian:

nu te cred / non ti credo (I do not believe you)

lasa-ma in pace / lasciami in pace (leave me alone)

noapte buna / buona notte (good night)

ciaoles / ciao (hi)


some dialects resemble even more:

Romanian versus Calabrese:

cu mine / ccu mine (with me)

mama ta / mamma ta (your mom)

frate-miu / frate meu (my brother)


average Romanian:


average Italian:

[MinervaItalica]

Only as immigrants.

hahahaha.

[Percivalle]

Are there Piedmontese who are southern-shifted compared to Bergamo?

Yes, I saw some results from Lower Piedmont (Alessandria, Monferrato) and they were going in the direction of Liguria and Emilia. There is a cline everywhere in Italy, even within the same region.

Try inserting this into Tolan's tool.

Alessandria/Asti (4/4 Piedmontese grandparents)

North_Sea 13.02
Atlantic 25.34
Baltic 6.53
Eastern_Euro 5.52
West_Med 19.84
West_Asian 7.74
East_Med 17.59
Red_Sea 3.95
South_Asian -
Southeast_Asian -
Siberian -
Amerindian -
Oceanian -
Northeast_African 0.09
Sub-Saharan 0.38

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 North_Italian 4.82
2 Tuscan 6.17
3 Spanish_Andalucia 9.47
4 Spanish_Extremadura 10.05
5 Spanish_Murcia 10.27
6 Spanish_Valencia 10.71
7 Portuguese 11.1
8 West_Sicilian 11.12
9 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon 11.59
10 Spanish_Cataluna 11.63
11 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha 11.68
12 Italian_Abruzzo 12.06
13 Greek 12.49
14 Spanish_Galicia 12.58
15 Spanish_Aragon 13.49
16 Greek_Thessaly 13.9
17 Spanish_Cantabria 13.92
18 Bulgarian 14.06
19 Southwest_French 14.51
20 Romanian 14.84

[Leto]

yes, Romanians and Italians share a whole lot: looks, language, culture...


Romanian versus Italian:

nu te cred / non ti credo (I do not believe you)

lasa-ma in pace / lasciami in pace (leave me alone)

noapte buna / buona notte (good night)

ciaoles / ciao (hi)


some dialects resemble even more to Romanian.

Romanian versus Calabrese:

cu mine / ccu mine (with me)

mama ta / mamma ta (your mom)

frate-miu / frate meu (my brother)


average Romanian:


average Italian:

Romance/Latin legacy. If Romanians were Roman Catholics, they would fit in Italy even better.

[Token]

Correct me if I'm mistaken, but Friuli seems to have more than one cluster, right? I have some Friulan results (Pordenone province, where my Friulan ancestry is from) in my possession and they seem to plot different than the sample you're using.

They seem much closer to 'Austria Tyrol' than 'Austria', they are located between 'S' and 'Q' in the OP. Not that dissimilar from Trento results. It seems this region has tons of micro-variations, all probably linked to different introgressions in the Middle Ages.

The mere fact that Austrian Tyroleans and other Austrians are significantly different attest what I'm saying.

I'd attribute this to individual variation, unless we can see concise clusters formed by people from each part of Friuli, which would clearly reflect different natures of admixture. We still don't have nearly enough samples to do something like that, so we can only guess. In the recent Italian paper, with a lot of samples from all over Northern Italy, Friuli is clearly heading towards Slovenians too. Northern Italy, specially the regions that figure in the Alpine cluster looks like a melting pot of basically everything. I'd like to hear your opinion on the matter.

[Nurzat]

Romance/Latin legacy. If Romanians were Roman Catholics, they would fit in Italy even better.

yes, unfortunately we're only Orthodox Guidos but it's for the best, we Roma-nians are even kitschier than the mangiaspaghetti

[savvas]

Yes, I saw some results from Lower Piedmont (Alessandria, Monferrato) and they were going in the direction of Liguria and Emilia. There is a cline everywhere in Italy, even within the same region.

Try inserting this into Tolan's tool.

Alessandria/Asti (4/4 Piedmontese grandparents)

North_Sea 13.02
Atlantic 25.34
Baltic 6.53
Eastern_Euro 5.52
West_Med 19.84
West_Asian 7.74
East_Med 17.59
Red_Sea 3.95
South_Asian -
Southeast_Asian -
Siberian -
Amerindian -
Oceanian -
Northeast_African 0.09
Sub-Saharan 0.38

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 North_Italian 4.82
2 Tuscan 6.17
3 Spanish_Andalucia 9.47
4 Spanish_Extremadura 10.05
5 Spanish_Murcia 10.27
6 Spanish_Valencia 10.71
7 Portuguese 11.1
8 West_Sicilian 11.12
9 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon 11.59
10 Spanish_Cataluna 11.63
11 Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha 11.68
12 Italian_Abruzzo 12.06
13 Greek 12.49
14 Spanish_Galicia 12.58
15 Spanish_Aragon 13.49
16 Greek_Thessaly 13.9
17 Spanish_Cantabria 13.92
18 Bulgarian 14.06
19 Southwest_French 14.51
20 Romanian 14.84

Thanks, updated:

[Leto]

yes, unfortunately we're only Orthodox Guidos but it's for the best, we Roma-nians are even kitschier than the mangiaspaghetti

Lol. A big bridge between the Roman empire and Rajasthan (jokin')

[Token]

"Tyroleans" is a pretty generic term. There are Italians in Trento.

I want to see the source of those numbers.

Cesare Battisti was an Italian patriot.

'Italians' in Trento looks like slightly Italian admixed South Tyroleans.