Ireland's Population Was in Serious Decline Before the Vikings

[JamesBond007]

G25 makes my mom look too Scandinavian. G25 is fun but lets not act like it's the Holy Grail.

You mean Norwegian specifically ? There has been gene flow between Scotland, Iceland and Ireland (to a lesser extant) and Norway for centuries e.g. Orkneys, Shetlands NorthEast Scotland then there as the World Wars e.g. WWII were Norway fought along Scots and English against the Nazis so of course modern Norwegians are going to be significantly native British Celt like Denmark is going to be more mainland continental German. Scandinavia is not one big single country.

[Daco Celtic]

You mean Norwegian specifically ? There has been gene flow between Scotland, Iceland and Ireland (to a lesser extant) and Norway for centuries e.g. Orkneys, Shetlands NorthEast Scotland then there as the World Wars e.g. WWII were Norway fought along Scots and English against the Nazis so of course modern Norwegians are going to be significantly native British Celt like Denmark is going to be more mainland continental German. Scandinavia is not one big single country.

G25 would be better if they just threw out the Norwegian sample or found more accurate samples for Norway. I think they sampled some Scottish tourist on holiday in Norway.

[JamesBond007]

G25 would be better if they just threw out the Norwegian sample or found more accurate samples for Norway. I think they sampled some Scottish tourist on holiday in Norway.

Nope, you are just another ignorant American. Before the union of the crowns between Scotland and England, Scotland had a political alliance, called the Auld Alliance between Norway , France and Scotland and the Orkneys of Scotland used to be politically part of Norway etc.. Scotland and Norway share genes in common like England and Denmark and Frisia/Netherlands share genes.

[Daco Celtic]

Nope, you are just another ignorant American. Before the union of the crowns between Scotland and England, Scotland had a political alliance, called the Auld Alliance between Norway , France and Scotland and the Orkneys of Scotland used to be politically part of Norway etc.. Scotland and Norway share genes in common like England and Denmark and Frisia/Netherlands share genes.

Explain why the Norwegian sample is so different from the Swedish sample. He took flawed samples for Norway, plain and simple.

[PaleoEuropean]

They need pre-Viking Irish to study against Viking genomes. I hope that will be covered in Lara Cassidy's paper next year and of course how much Celtic admixture in Ireland. Here's hoping.

It is interesting that the population had declined steadily over 3 centuries and there's no reason to believe Norwegians have "British-like" ancestry if the Irish and Brits don't have "Norse-like" ancestry. They are obviously genetically close but you need to have an open mind on these subjects. Either way it's great that all this information is coming out.

Anyway you're proposing this unknown Irish migration to Scandinavia. It doesn't make sense that thralls would have such an effect on the population to me. They usually have less productive success than the victors.

Vikings carried Irish DNA back to Scandinavia but not on a massive scale. Orkney and the North has always been more northern shifted due to the native hunter gatherer population moving north once the farmers arrived. Scotland however has a higher than average neolithic population due to them eventually mixing together. Ireland also has heavy hunter gatherer in certain parts. Munster and part of modern Northern Ireland have confirmed native hg populations, the kings of Munster the O'Drisocolls are the native Doggerland clade of I2. The point being there is some affinity between all Northern Atlantic and Scandinavian populations.

[RyoHazuki]

Nope, you are just another ignorant American. Before the union of the crowns between Scotland and England, Scotland had a political alliance, called the Auld Alliance between Norway , France and Scotland and the Orkneys of Scotland used to be politically part of Norway etc.. Scotland and Norway share genes in common like England and Denmark and Frisia/Netherlands share genes.

What? When was France ever Norwegian politically? This is either a Nordic cope or confusing Franks and Normans (who got to rule a shithole like Normandy so long as they assimilated into French population, but vikings didn't have a sense of how shit Normandy is) with contemporary Norwegians.

[RyoHazuki]

Vikings carried Irish DNA back to Scandinavia but not on a massive scale. Orkney and the North has always been more northern shifted due to the native hunter gatherer population moving north once the farmers arrived. Scotland however has a higher than average neolithic population due to them eventually mixing together. Ireland also has heavy hunter gatherer in certain parts. Munster and part of modern Northern Ireland have confirmed native hg populations, the kings of Munster the O'Drisocolls are the native Doggerland clade of I2. The point being there is some affinity between all Northern Atlantic and Scandinavian populations.

The Orcadian G25 sample is more southern than the standard Scottish one.

[RyoHazuki]

G25 would be better if they just threw out the Norwegian sample or found more accurate samples for Norway. I think they sampled some Scottish tourist on holiday in Norway.

Have you noticed how huge of an area the Irish samples alone cover with G25? Bigger than England or Scotland. Some supposed "Irish" plot on top of a mixed frog like me while others overlap with Sweden. I'm curious if some of them are self reporting Irish Americans with mixed heritage or if the Irish genome truly covers a large area on PCAs.

[PaleoEuropean]

The Orcadian G25 sample is more southern than the standard Scottish one.

Thats because they mixed with the Neolithic Picts, they are a balance between Northern Paleolithic and Neolithic. They are also theorized to have spoken a separate more ancient language before the merger. Scotland and Orkney specifically have about 40-50% Hg on average, the highest in Britain. The HG population resisted farming and moved North.

[RyoHazuki]

Thats because they mixed with the Neolithic Picts, they are a balance between Northern Paleolithic and Neolithic. They are also theorized to have spoken a separate more ancient language before the merger. Scotland and Orkney specifically have about 40-50% Hg on average, the highest in Britain. The HG population resisted farming and moved North.

I expected for a Norse influenced people Orcadians would be more Northern than average