Scotland's genetic map reveals the country's natives live in the same 'Dark Age kingdoms' created by

**Creoda** · 09-04-2019, 03:22 AM

So Donegal is the most Irish part of Ireland, have I got that right?

Not sure but I think the higher English/Saxon correlation in Central and Southern Ireland could be read more as Danish (+ later English) admixture as opposed to Norwegian, if such a distinction can be made. The Viking paper said that the Norwegian influence across the British Isles outside of Orkney and Shetland was fairly low and uniform.

**Peterski** · 09-04-2019, 03:32 AM

Originally Posted by Creoda

So Donegal is the most Irish part of Ireland, have I got that right?

Could be.

I have Irish kit with 100% ancestry from Donegal and look how "isolated" it is (no similarities higher than 85 except Irish average itself):

**Dick** · 09-04-2019, 03:34 AM

Originally Posted by Creoda

So Donegal is the most Irish part of Ireland, have I got that right?

Not sure but I think the higher English/Saxon correlation in Central and Southern Ireland can be read more as Danish (+ later English) admixture as opposed to Norwegian, if such a distinction can be made. The Viking paper said that the Norwegian influence across the British Isles outside of Orkney and Shetland was fairly low and uniform.

What if this "Norwegian" is actually From Anglo-Saxons. Anglo-Saxon dna could be mistaken for that especially when considering how Norwegian the DNA remains of A/S NO3423 appear (Gedmatch kit T643508)

Kit T643508

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 North_Sea 46.64
2 Atlantic 23.09
3 Eastern_Euro 12.45
4 Baltic 10.51
5 West_Med 2.93
6 West_Asian 2.18
7 Sub-Saharan 0.98
8 Northeast_African 0.78
9 Red_Sea 0.25
10 Oceanian 0.19

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 West_Norwegian 5.46
2 Norwegian 7.4
3 Swedish 8.21
4 Orcadian 9.9
5 North_Dutch 9.92
6 Danish 10.33
7 North_Swedish 10.67
8 West_Scottish 11.28
9 Irish 12.25
10 Southeast_English 13.08
11 North_German 13.42
12 Southwest_English 13.97
13 West_German 14.92
14 South_Dutch 17.39
15 Southwest_Finnish 18.38
16 East_German 19.89
17 Finnish 20.17
18 French 21.37
19 Hungarian 23.4
20 Austrian 24.89

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Yoruban @ 5.45
2 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Bantu_S.W. @ 5.45
3 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Bantu_S.E. @ 5.45
4 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Biaka_Pygmy @ 5.45
5 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Mandenka @ 5.45
6 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Luhya @ 5.45
7 99.6% West_Norwegian + 0.4% Mbuti_Pygmy @ 5.45
8 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Bantu_N.E. @ 5.45
9 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% San @ 5.45
10 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Sudanese @ 5.45
11 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Ethiopian_Anuak @ 5.46
12 99.8% West_Norwegian + 0.2% Ethiopian_Gumuz @ 5.46
13 99.8% West_Norwegian + 0.2% Hadza @ 5.46
14 99.9% West_Norwegian + 0.1% Sandawe @ 5.46
15 99.9% West_Norwegian + 0.1% Maasai @ 5.46
16 100% West_Norwegian + 0% Abhkasian @ 5.46
17 100% West_Norwegian + 0% Adygei @ 5.46
18 100% West_Norwegian + 0% Afghan_Hazara @ 5.46
19 100% West_Norwegian + 0% Afghan_Pashtun @ 5.46
20 100% West_Norwegian + 0% Afghan_Tadjik @ 5.46

**Peterski** · 09-04-2019, 03:34 AM

Irish 100% from County Donegal in Eurogenes K15:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 North_Sea 36.44
2 Atlantic 35.98
3 Eastern_Euro 9.61
4 Baltic 7.79
5 West_Med 7.19
6 West_Asian 2.34
7 Amerindian 0.61
8 South_Asian 0.04

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 West_Scottish 5.52
2 Irish 5.78
3 Southeast_English 6.35
4 Orcadian 6.97
5 Southwest_English 7.69
6 Danish 8.21
7 North_Dutch 8.87
8 North_German 9.92
9 South_Dutch 11.49
10 West_Norwegian 12.02
11 Norwegian 12.23
12 Swedish 13.77
13 West_German 14.34
14 French 15.14
15 North_Swedish 15.91
16 East_German 18.17
17 Southwest_Finnish 19.77
18 Spanish_Cataluna 20.75
19 Austrian 21.18
20 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon 21.91

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 88.9% West_Scottish + 11.1% French_Basque @ 4.55
2 90.7% Irish + 9.3% French_Basque @ 5.18
3 93.8% West_Scottish + 6.2% Spanish_Aragon @ 5.31
4 84.7% Orcadian + 15.3% French_Basque @ 5.31
5 94.4% West_Scottish + 5.6% Southwest_French @ 5.37
6 95% West_Scottish + 5% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 5.39
7 95.1% West_Scottish + 4.9% Spanish_Cantabria @ 5.41
8 95.7% West_Scottish + 4.3% Spanish_Valencia @ 5.43
9 97% West_Scottish + 3% Spanish_Andalucia @ 5.47
10 97.6% West_Scottish + 2.4% Spanish_Murcia @ 5.5
11 98% West_Scottish + 2% Spanish_Cataluna @ 5.51
12 98.2% West_Scottish + 1.8% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 5.51
13 98.7% West_Scottish + 1.3% Spanish_Extremadura @ 5.51
14 100% West_Scottish + 0% Abhkasian @ 5.52
15 100% West_Scottish + 0% Adygei @ 5.52
16 100% West_Scottish + 0% Afghan_Hazara @ 5.52
17 100% West_Scottish + 0% Afghan_Pashtun @ 5.52
18 100% West_Scottish + 0% Afghan_Tadjik @ 5.52
19 100% West_Scottish + 0% Afghan_Turkmen @ 5.52
20 100% West_Scottish + 0% Afghan_Uzbeki @ 5.52

**Matty74** · 09-04-2019, 03:37 AM

I have some, through my great grandfather who married a German woman (Uelzen, near Hannover). He is mostly Pennsylvania German (Rhineland), French Canadian (original French Settlers) and English (Stackhouse family) but those are all quite distant compared to the rest of my ancestry. Most of my ancestral paper trail is around the North and Baltic Seas. Norway, Denmark (Slesvig), Ostfriesland, Mecklenburg Vorpommern, etc. I do have a g-g grandfather from Ireland but need to do more research on that. His daughter's birth record states he was from the Isle of Man, so I'm unsure. The vast majority of my ancestry came to America after the 1880's. I probably need to do a little more digging

Your closest Archaeogenetic matches...
(Smaller numbers mean closer matches to you)

1. Pict (670 AD) ..... 4.452 - CL83 (Click for more info)
Top 99% match vs all users

2. Nordic Lombard (670 AD) ..... 5.104 - CL92 (Click for more info)
Top 97% match vs all users

3. Scotland Late Bronze Age (900 BC) ..... 5.232 - I2860 (Click for more info)
Top 96% match vs all users

4. Bronze Age Celt England (1000 BC) ..... 5.469 - I5383 (Click for more info)
Top 99% match vs all users

5. St Marys Coffin Maryland (1683 AD) ..... 5.472 - I2097 (Click for more info)
Top 98% match vs all users

6. Bell Beaker England (2100 BC) ..... 5.603 - I2452 (Click for more info)
Top 97% match vs all users

7. Alemanni Longobard Noble (605 AD) ..... 5.793 - NS1 (Click for more info)
Top 98% match vs all users

8. Scotland Late Bronze Age (900 BC) ..... 5.848 - I2859 (Click for more info)
Top 97% match vs all users

9. Nordic Lombard (590 AD) ..... 5.941 - SZ15 (Click for more info)
Top 92% match vs all users

10. Celtic Briton (0 AD) ..... 6.126 - Hinxton 4 (Click for more info)
Top 96% match vs all users

11. Bell Beaker England (2150 BC) ..... 6.271 - I1767 (Click for more info)
Top 85% match vs all users

12. Viking Gaelic Mix Iceland (1000 AD) ..... 6.764 - VDP-A6 (Click for more info)
Top 94% match vs all users

13. Nordic-Celtic Gladiator York (250 AD) ..... 6.875 - 6DRIF-18 (Click for more info)
Top 93% match vs all users

14. Late Medieval Gotlander (1600 AD) ..... 7.22 - Unknown (Click for more info)
Top 91% match vs all users

15. Anglo Saxon (700 AD) ..... 7.239 - Hinxton HS3 (Click for more info)
Top 96% match vs all users

16. Bronze Age Orkney Islands (1750 BC) ..... 7.271 - I2981 (Click for more info)
Top 87% match vs all users

17. Young Longobard Noble (605 AD) ..... 7.307 - NS6 (Click for more info)
Top 87% match vs all users

18. Viking Norse Iceland (935 AD) ..... 7.332 - SSJ-A2 (Click for more info)
Top 98% match vs all users

19. Viking Saxon Iceland (1150 AD) ..... 7.365 - TSK-A26 (Click for more info)
Top 94% match vs all users

20. Bell Beaker Southern France (2050 BC) ..... 7.539 - I3875 (Click for more info)
Top 91% match vs all users

21. Nordic Lombard (590 AD) ..... 7.546 - SZ12 (Click for more info)
Top 92% match vs all users

22. Nordic Lombard (670 AD) ..... 7.637 - CL146 (Click for more info)
Top 96% match vs all users

23. Nordic Lombard (590 AD) ..... 7.64 - SZ14 (Click for more info)
Top 95% match vs all users

24. Philip Calvert Coffin Maryland (1683 AD) ..... 7.723 - 2099 (Click for more info)
Top 97% match vs all users

25. Viking Norse Iceland (935 AD) ..... 7.732 - KNS-A1 (Click for more info)
Top 97% match vs all users

26. Bell Beaker Scotland (2100 BC) ..... 7.778 - I2568 (Click for more info)
Top 85% match vs all users

27. Alemannic Saxon Bavaria (500 AD) ..... 7.95 - AED_249 (Click for more info)
Top 97% match vs all users

28. Saxon Germanic Empuries (275 BC) ..... 7.96 - I8206 (Click for more info)
Top 98% match vs all users

29. Briton Gladiator York (250 AD) ..... 8.037 - 6DRIF-23 (Click for more info)
Top 95% match vs all users

30. Nordic Lombard (670 AD) ..... 8.04 - CL84 (Click for more info)
Top 95% match vs all users

31. Alemannic Frankish Bavaria (465 AD) ..... 8.084 - NW_255 (Click for more info)
Top 97% match vs all users

32. Gaelic Settler Viking Iceland (935 AD) ..... 8.11 - ORE-A1 (Click for more info)
Top 86% match vs all users

33. Nordic Lombard (590 AD) ..... 8.12 - SZ4 (Click for more info)
Top 96% match vs all users

34. Ireland Copper Age (1880 BC) ..... 8.14 - Rathlin2 (Click for more info)
Top 96% match vs all users

35. Viking Sweden (1100 AD) ..... 8.148 - 97029 (Click for more info)
Top 97% match vs all users

36. Colonial American Pennsylvania (1700 AD) ..... 8.208 - Shohola (Click for more info)
Top 86% match vs all users

37. Alemannic Bavaria (500 AD) ..... 8.313 - ALH_1 (Click for more info)
Top 87% match vs all users

38. Icelander Late Medieval (1650 AD) ..... 8.349 - KOV-A2 (Click for more info)
Top 84% match vs all users

39. Bronze Age Scottish Islands (2350 BC) ..... 8.39 - I5367 (Click for more info)
Top 94% match vs all users

40. Viking Gaelic Mix Iceland (935 AD) ..... 8.479 - GTE-A1 (Click for more info)
Top 83% match vs all users

41. Saxon Settler Viking Iceland (935 AD) ..... 8.512 - GRS-A1 (Click for more info)
Top 93% match vs all users

42. Germano-Celtic Gladiator York (250 AD) ..... 8.569 - 6DRIF-3 (Click for more info)
Top 90% match vs all users

43. Iron Age Melton England (85 BC) ..... 8.593 - M1489 (Click for more info)
Top 98% match vs all users

44. Vandal Chieftain (375 AD) ..... 8.625 - DA119 (Click for more info)
Top 97% match vs all users

45. Viking Sweden (1100 AD) ..... 8.754 - stg021 (Click for more info)
Top 89% match vs all users

46. Viking Celtic Mix Sweden (1100 AD) ..... 8.781 - Sigtuna grt035 (Click for more info)
Top 98% match vs all users

47. Nordic Lombard (590 AD) ..... 8.802 - SZ7 (Click for more info)
Top 92% match vs all users

48. Viking Celtic Mix Sweden (1100 AD) ..... 8.831 - 84035 (Click for more info)
Top 92% match vs all users

49. Nordic Lombard (590 AD) ..... 8.85 - SZ22 (Click for more info)
Top 97% match vs all users

50. Celtic Briton (70 BC) ..... 8.853 - Hinxton 1 (Click for more info)
Top 89% match vs all users

51. Viking Norse Iceland (935 AD) ..... 8.864 - DKS-A1 (Click for more info)
Top 99% match vs all users

52. Viking Sweden (1100 AD) ..... 8.935 - Sigtuna stg021 (Click for more info)
Top 88% match vs all users

53. Frankish / Hungary (590 AD) ..... 8.941 - SZ23 (Click for more info)
Top 70% match vs all users

54. Alemannic Bavaria (500 AD) ..... 9.008 - ALH_10 (Click for more info)
Top 94% match vs all users

55. Bell Beaker Cambridge (2075 BC) ..... 9.023 - I3255 (Click for more info)
Top 89% match vs all users

56. Gaelic Settler Viking Iceland (935 AD) ..... 9.053 - SSG-A2 (Click for more info)
Top 77% match vs all users

57. Viking Celtic Mix Sweden (1100 AD) ..... 9.094 - 97002 (Click for more info)
Top 99% match vs all users

58. Ireland Copper Age (1880 BC) ..... 9.278 - Rathlin2B (Click for more info)
Top 96% match vs all users

59. Frankish Longobard Noble (605 AD) ..... 9.364 - NS12c (Click for more info)
Top 80% match vs all users

60. Viking Gaelic Child Iceland (935 AD) ..... 9.372 - YGS-B2 (Click for more info)
Top 98% match vs all users

**Peterski** · 09-04-2019, 03:38 AM

Irish 100% from County Donegal in Eurogenes K13:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 North_Atlantic 56.4
2 Baltic 22.64
3 West_Med 12.48
4 West_Asian 4.73
5 East_Med 1.52
6 Amerindian 1.08
7 South_Asian 0.83
8 Red_Sea 0.23
9 Siberian 0.1

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 West_Scottish 3.11
2 Irish 4.13
3 Southwest_English 4.88
4 Orcadian 4.91
5 Southeast_English 6.2
6 North_Dutch 6.63
7 Danish 7.2
8 Norwegian 7.44
9 North_German 9.82
10 Swedish 10.65
11 South_Dutch 11.95
12 West_German 13.32
13 French 16.36
14 North_Swedish 16.97
15 Austrian 19.01
16 East_German 19.19
17 Spanish_Cataluna 22.48
18 Southwest_French 23.01
19 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon 23.55
20 Spanish_Cantabria 23.58

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 97.9% West_Scottish + 2.1% French_Basque @ 3.06
2 100% West_Scottish + 0% Abhkasian @ 3.11
3 100% West_Scottish + 0% Adygei @ 3.11
4 100% West_Scottish + 0% Afghan_Pashtun @ 3.11
5 100% West_Scottish + 0% Afghan_Tadjik @ 3.11
6 100% West_Scottish + 0% Afghan_Turkmen @ 3.11
7 100% West_Scottish + 0% Aghan_Hazara @ 3.11
8 100% West_Scottish + 0% Algerian @ 3.11
9 100% West_Scottish + 0% Algerian_Jewish @ 3.11
10 100% West_Scottish + 0% Altaian @ 3.11
11 100% West_Scottish + 0% Armenian @ 3.11
12 100% West_Scottish + 0% Ashkenazi @ 3.11
13 100% West_Scottish + 0% Assyrian @ 3.11
14 100% West_Scottish + 0% Austrian @ 3.11
15 100% West_Scottish + 0% Austroasiatic_Ho @ 3.11
16 100% West_Scottish + 0% Azeri @ 3.11
17 100% West_Scottish + 0% Balkar @ 3.11
18 100% West_Scottish + 0% Balochi @ 3.11
19 100% West_Scottish + 0% Bangladeshi @ 3.11
20 100% West_Scottish + 0% Bantu_N.E. @ 3.11

**Matty74** · 09-04-2019, 03:40 AM

Eurogenes K13 Oracle results:
K13 Oracle ref data revised 21 Nov 2013

Kit DB6447857

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 North_Atlantic 51.88
2 Baltic 24.1
3 West_Med 13.39
4 West_Asian 5.66
5 Red_Sea 2.16
6 Oceanian 1.38
7 East_Med 0.76
8 Siberian 0.43
9 South_Asian 0.23

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Irish 2.65
2 West_Scottish 2.84
3 Orcadian 3.13
4 Southwest_English 3.41
5 North_Dutch 4.22
6 Southeast_English 4.79
7 Danish 5.34
8 Norwegian 5.78
9 North_German 6.94
10 Swedish 8.12
11 South_Dutch 9.14
12 West_German 10.48
13 French 14.14
14 North_Swedish 14.27
15 Austrian 15.32
16 East_German 15.5
17 Hungarian 20.1
18 Spanish_Cataluna 20.98
19 Southwest_French 21.46
20 Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon 21.98

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 99% Irish + 1% Papuan @ 2.32
2 68.3% Irish + 31.7% Southwest_English @ 2.39
3 98.9% Irish + 1.1% NAN_Melanesian @ 2.39
4 68.5% Southwest_English + 31.5% Norwegian @ 2.41
5 76.3% Southwest_English + 23.7% Swedish @ 2.42
6 98.9% West_Scottish + 1.1% Papuan @ 2.46
7 98.7% West_Scottish + 1.3% NAN_Melanesian @ 2.51
8 96.5% Irish + 3.5% Southwest_French @ 2.53
9 97.1% Irish + 2.9% French_Basque @ 2.53
10 96.7% Irish + 3.3% Spanish_Cantabria @ 2.54
11 95.5% West_Scottish + 4.5% Ukrainian_Lviv @ 2.55
12 98.7% Irish + 1.3% Sardinian @ 2.55
13 97% Irish + 3% Spanish_Galicia @ 2.56
14 97.3% Irish + 2.7% Spanish_Aragon @ 2.56
15 97.2% Irish + 2.8% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 2.57
16 97.5% Irish + 2.5% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 2.57
17 97.4% Irish + 2.6% Portuguese @ 2.58
18 59.9% Southwest_English + 40.1% North_Dutch @ 2.58
19 97.6% Irish + 2.4% Spanish_Extremadura @ 2.58
20 99% Irish + 1% Moroccan @ 2.59

**Peterski** · 09-04-2019, 03:46 AM

Originally Posted by Matty74

Eurogenes K13 Oracle results:
K13 Oracle ref data revised 21 Nov 2013

Kit DB6447857

(...)

Huge difference in Germanic regions compared to Donegal Irish sample:

**Matty74** · 09-04-2019, 03:57 AM

I'm still learning about this stuff. I didn't realize the numbers were a huge difference. All I saw were similarities. It does appear that I've picked up a substantial amount of English ancestry though.

**Creoda** · 09-04-2019, 04:01 AM

Originally Posted by Dick

What if this "Norwegian" is actually From Anglo-Saxons. Anglo-Saxon dna could be mistaken for that especially when considering how Norwegian the DNA remains of A/S NO3423 appear (Gedmatch kit T643508)

Kit T643508

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 North_Sea 46.64
2 Atlantic 23.09
3 Eastern_Euro 12.45
4 Baltic 10.51
5 West_Med 2.93
6 West_Asian 2.18
7 Sub-Saharan 0.98
8 Northeast_African 0.78
9 Red_Sea 0.25
10 Oceanian 0.19

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 West_Norwegian 5.46
2 Norwegian 7.4
3 Swedish 8.21
4 Orcadian 9.9
5 North_Dutch 9.92
6 Danish 10.33
7 North_Swedish 10.67
8 West_Scottish 11.28
9 Irish 12.25
10 Southeast_English 13.08
11 North_German 13.42
12 Southwest_English 13.97
13 West_German 14.92
14 South_Dutch 17.39
15 Southwest_Finnish 18.38
16 East_German 19.89
17 Finnish 20.17
18 French 21.37
19 Hungarian 23.4
20 Austrian 24.89

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Yoruban @ 5.45
2 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Bantu_S.W. @ 5.45
3 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Bantu_S.E. @ 5.45
4 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Biaka_Pygmy @ 5.45
5 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Mandenka @ 5.45
6 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Luhya @ 5.45
7 99.6% West_Norwegian + 0.4% Mbuti_Pygmy @ 5.45
8 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Bantu_N.E. @ 5.45
9 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% San @ 5.45
10 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Sudanese @ 5.45
11 99.7% West_Norwegian + 0.3% Ethiopian_Anuak @ 5.46
12 99.8% West_Norwegian + 0.2% Ethiopian_Gumuz @ 5.46
13 99.8% West_Norwegian + 0.2% Hadza @ 5.46
14 99.9% West_Norwegian + 0.1% Sandawe @ 5.46
15 99.9% West_Norwegian + 0.1% Maasai @ 5.46
16 100% West_Norwegian + 0% Abhkasian @ 5.46
17 100% West_Norwegian + 0% Adygei @ 5.46
18 100% West_Norwegian + 0% Afghan_Hazara @ 5.46
19 100% West_Norwegian + 0% Afghan_Pashtun @ 5.46
20 100% West_Norwegian + 0% Afghan_Tadjik @ 5.46

I don't know. If some Irish have a fair degree of English ancestry as those charts suggest, that would mean they have elevated Anglo-Saxon. But Danish Vikings and Anglo-Saxons seem to be basically inseparable genetically.