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Thread: How come that many White South Africans have Hottentot admixture (even if minor)?

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    Quote Originally Posted by bandeirante View Post
    anglo Caribbean colonies are mixed!
    They don't belong to White society. No, not the Rastafarian and Pastafarian islands...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cristiano viejo View Post
    Read carefully, sudaca. And I hope you dont say again Anglos did not mix:


    «Scots played an extremely influential role as Indian agents all along the frontier, especially in the South. Indeed, Scottish Indian agents and merchants frequently intermarried with the Indians and produced generations of Indian chiefs with Scottish roots. Three in particular should be mentioned at this time.

    In 1783, Alexander McGillivray was elevated to the status of a chief of the Creek Nation in what is now parts of Georgia and Alabama. McGillivray’s father had been a British Indian agent whose wife was half-Creek and half French. […]

    Another Creek chief of Scottish heritage was William McIntosh. He was born in 1775 from the marriage between John McIntosh of Borlum, Scotland, who was a British Indian agent, and a Creek princess. […]

    Perhaps the greatest Scottish-Indian was Chief John Ross (Kooweskowe) of the Cherokee Nation. He was born in 1790 near Lookout Mountain on the border of Georgia and Tennessee. His father, David Ross, had been a British Indian agent and a Loyalist in the Revolution. His mother was Mary McDonald Ross, whose mother was Cherokee and whose father was Scottish.» (pp. 155-156).


    The Scottish Settlers of America: The 17th and 18th Centuries
    http://books.google.es/books?id=j9Vpdkvc2IcC



    «Mixed-race subjects were commonly called “country-born,” “East Indian,” “half-cast,” and “Eurasian,” in this period, as the East India Company state made numerous distinctions based on racial differences which were further elaborated as the Company state matured into the British Raj.» (p. 15)

    «Although there was little documentary proof of interracial liaisons, the mixed-race population was growing as THERE WERE SIX TIMES AS MANY EURASIANS BEING BORN IN INDIA THAN “PURE” EUROPEANS.» (p. 40).

    «Officers of the East India Company’s armies had established the Military Orphan Society in 1782 to educate these mixed-race children while removing them from their mother’s care. Subsequently, many more schools to train the children of Englishmen were founded, and by the 1800s, over 30 such schools existed in Calcutta alone.

    Women who were Eurasian, or mixed-race, were always sexually suspect, even when THEY CONVERTED AND MARRIED, MAKING THEMSELVES INTO “LEGITIMATE” WIVES.» (p. 55).

    «THE DEVELOPMENT OF COMMUNITIES OF INTERRACIAL COUPLES WITH MIXED-RACE CHILDREN, ESPECIALLY AMONG HIGH-RANKING EUROPEAN OFFICIALS, EXISTED ACROSS THE INDIAN SUBCONTINENT in towns that were outside the Company’s dominions. [...] Covenanted Company officials such as Harry Verelst, Philip Francis, James Rennell, John Shore, Neill Edmonstone, Charles Warre Malet, and John Bristow kept Indian female companions. John Bristow and Nathaniel Middleton […] had mixed-race children baptized at St. John’s Church in Calcutta before they were legitimately married.» (p. 76).

    «The narratives of the relationships and families of William Palmer and James Achilles Kirkpatrick demonstrate the ways in which interracial relationships and mixed-race families of high-ranking officials and noblewomen of the local princely courts contributed to intercultural negotiation and exchange […] PALMER COHABITED WITH A MUSLIM NOBLEWOMAN, BUT HIS CHILDREN WERE ALL BAPTIZED AND SUBSEQUENTLY MARRIED EUROPEANS. YET WHILE PALMER’S DESCENDANTS RESIDED IN INDIA WITH EUROPEAN AIRS, KIRKPATRICK’S CHILDREN LIVED IN ENGLAND.» (p. 105).

    «SOLDIERS’ FAMILIES FREQUENTLY INCLUDED NATIVE WIVES AND MIXED-RACE CHILDREN, the policy of supporting an Anglicized but mixed-race population funded by the Company became more complicated.» (p. 213).

    «From 1783 through the 1810s, marrying off half-caste orphan girls with European soldiers was seemingly uncomplicated by anxieties about promoting miscegenation. Instead, it was seen by military authorities as a way to maintain appropriate male guardianship over female orphans […] By marrying off half-cast women to European soldiers, the orphan society was complicit in ACTIVELY PROMOTING INTERRACIAL MARRIAGES, MISCEGENATION, AND THE GROWTH OF A MIXED-RACE OR CREOLE POPULATION THAT DILUTED THE RACIAL PURITY OF THE BRITISH COMMUNITY IN INDIA.» (p. 238).

    «Even when the numbers of men acknowledging interracial relationships and illegitimate children declined in the early 1800s, THE NUMBER OF MIXED-RACE CHILDREN BORN GREW EVERY YEAR paralleling an increase in colonial companions leaving wills, suggesting that INTERRACIAL SEX DID NOT FADE AWAY, but that it was recorded with less frequency in colonial archives. […] While cohabiting with a local woman and Anglicizing mixed-race children was sometimes seen as beneficial to the nascent colonial state of the East India company, these practices met wit little resistance from native elites, probably because THESE RELATIONSHIPS INVOLVED WOMEN OF THE LOWER SOCIAL AND CASTE ORDERS.*» (p. 249).


    Sex and the Family in Colonial India: The Making of Empire
    http://books.google.es/books?hl=es&id=dmJj8ibGQp4C

    «In every colony, wherever the unmarried white man found himself isolated, liaisons with local women were common in the nineteenth century. […] IN THE EARLY NINETEENTH CENTURY THERE WAS SEXUAL INTERACTION WITH THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLES OF NEW ZEALAND, AUSTRALIA AND SOUTH AFRICA, including the trekboer regions. WHEN CAPE COLONY CAME UNDER BRITISH RULE IN 1807, PERHAPS TEN PER CENT OF WHITES WERE MARRIED TO NON-WHITES* (probably including Asians and Coloureds); under three per cent of Cape marriages were to pure-blooded Africans, even less in rural areas. BUT WHILE MARRIAGE WAS NOT FREQUENT, AND INTERMARRIAGE ALREADY IN DECLINE, MISCEGENATION WAS STILL QUITE HIGH. IT HAS BEEN CALCULATED THAT THE PERCENTAGE OF NON-WHITE BLOOOD IN TODAY’S AFRIKANER COMMUNITY IS PERHAPS SEVEN PER CENT. [W. M. Freund, ‘Race in social structure of South Africa, 1652-1836’, Race and Class, XVIII, 1976, pp. 53-67; R. Ross, Adam Kok’s Griquas, Cambridge, 1976, p. 4; the key work, apparently, is J. A. Heese, Die herkoms van die Afrikaner, 1652-1867, 1971]» (p. 107).


    «Bibi is a Hindustani word meaning ‘high-class woman’, which in Hobson-Jobson ‘Anglo-Indian’ parlance came to mean native mistress. […] THE KEEPING OF A MISTRESS IN BRITISH INDIA BECAME A WELL-ESTABLISHED PRACTICE BY THE LATER EITGHTEENTH CENTURY, DEFENDED AS INCREASING THE KNOWLEDGE OF INDIAN AFFAIRS. SOME OFFICERS RECOMMENDED IT QUITE OPENLY, AND THE PATTERN WAS SET AT THE HIGHEST LEVEL. Job Charnock (d. 1693), founder of Calcutta, had three children by the Hindu mistress he had rescued from a suttee funeral pyre. George Dick (Governor of Bombay in the 1790s) kept a Maratha woman, allowing her to parade about the streets ostentatiously […] Sir David Ochterlony (the Resident of Delhi, 1803-25) apparently had thirteen mistresses among Indian ladies. Even so respectable a figure as Lord Teignmouth, Governor General (1793-98) and a British and Foreig Bible Society founder, had such a liaison. COL. JAMES SKINNER (1778-1841), FOUNDER OF THE CRACK REGIMENT ‘SKINNER’S HORSE’, WAS SAID TO HAVE HAD A HAREM OF FOURTEEN WIVES, THOUGH THE FAMILY HOTLY DENIED THERE WERE EVER MORE THAN SEVEN; EIGHTY [¡80!*] CHILDREN CLAIMED HIM AS THEIR FATHER.


    Lower down the social scale, too, many of the British in India formally married Hindu women or (preferably) half-Indians, known as Anglo-Indians, or in Victorian times as Eurasians. IT IS ESTIMATED THAT NINETY PER CENT OF THE BRITISH IN INDIA BY THE MID-EIGHTEENTH CENTURY MADE SUCH MARRIAGES* […] the directors of the East India Company on 8 April 1778 declared that because of the importance of soldiers’ marrying Indian women in Madras, THEY WERE ‘CONTENT TO ENCOURAGE AT SOME EXPENSE’ SUCH MARRIAGES, MAKING A CHRISTENING PRESENT OF FIVE RUPEES FOR EVERY CHILD OF A RANK-SOLDIER BAPTISED. IN OTHER WORDS, A DELIBERATE POLICY OF INTERMARRIAGE WAS ENCOURAGED BY THE COMPANY» (pp. 115-116).


    «Although intermarriage was virtually at an end by the beginning of the nineteenth century, the bibi still held her place. METCALFE (ACTING GOVERNOR-GENERAL 1835-36) HAD THREE EURASIAN SONS BETWEEN 1809 AND 1817 BY AN INDIAN WOMAN HE HAD MET AT THE COURT OF RANJIT SINGH. HE NEVER MADE A EUROPEAN MARRIAGE.» (p. 117).


    Empire and Sexuality: The British Experience
    http://books.google.es/books?id=DVS8AAAAIAAJ


    «THE ARMY WAS NOT WHOLLY AGAINST ITS SOLDIERS MARRYING MIXED-RACE OR NATIVE WOMEN AS IT WAS MUCH CHEAPER THAN SHIPPING OVER EUROPEAN WOMEN FOR THEM TO MARRY.» (p. 37).

    «Until the closing decades of the eighteenth century, British attitudes towards persons of mixed descent were not necessarily negative. Many mixed-race people had been more or less unproblematically assimilated as individuals into the British establishment. IT WAS NOT UNCOMMON FOR HIGH-RANKING OFFICIALS TO HAVE MIXED OFFSPRING WITH INDIAN WOMEN. INTERRACIAL MARRIAGE AND CONCUBINARY ARRANGEMENTS WERE GENERALLY TOLERATED IF NOT POSITIVELY ENCOURAGED. High-ranking British men often invested in the futures of their mixed-race offspring, sending them to the metropole for higher education.» (p. 60).

    «As a Eurasian writer, Kenneth Wallace, remarked in his book (1930), ‘SO MUCH INTERMARRIAGE TAKES PLACE BETWEEN DOMICILED EUROPEANS AND ANGLO-INDIANS (I.E. EURASIANS) THAT IT IS ALMOST SAFE TO SAY THAT DOMICILED EUROPEANS OF ONE GENERATION ARE SUCCEEDED BY ANGLO-INDIANS IN THE NEXT’. [Wallace, The Eurasian Problem Constructively Approached, 29]» (p. 67).

    The Meaning of White: Race, Class, and the 'Domiciled Community' in British India 1858-1930
    http://books.google.es/books?id=8Mt78VcAhfIC


    «Interestingly, the Company’s men showed a similar openness to native “abilities” when it came to their sexual lives. During the period of Company governance in India (roughly between 1757 and 1858), MARRIAGE BETWEEN BRITISH MEN AND INDIAN WOMEN WAS COMMON. AND THERE WAS CONSIDERABLY MORE MISCEGENATION THAN THERE WAS INTERMARRIAGE. “I now commenced a regular course of fυck¡ng with native women,” wrote one Englishman, recalling his early days in India as a sixteen-year-old Company cadet. Another Company employee waxed more philosophical: “THOSE WHO HAVE LIVED WITH A NATIVE WOMAN FOR ANY LENGTH OF TIME NEVER MARRY A EUROPEAN… so amusingly playful, so anxious to oblige and please [are they], that A PERSON AFTER BEING ACCUSTOMED TO THEIR SOCIETY SHRINKS FROM THE IDEA OF ENCOUNTERING THE WHIMS OR YELDING TO THE FANCIES OF AN ENGLISHWOMAN.”

    The Company’s promiscuity, both sexual and religious, outraged English evangelicals back in London.» (p. 215)

    Day of Empire: How Hyperpowers Rise to Global Dominance—and Why They Fall
    http://books.google.es/books?id=nOSZPne0zVwC


    «Mixed-race subjects were commonly called “country-born,” “East Indian,” “half-cast,” and “Eurasian,” in this period, as the East India Company state made numerous distinctions based on racial differences which were further elaborated as the Company state matured into the British Raj.» (p. 15)

    Sex and the Family in Colonial India: The Making of Empire
    http://books.google.es/books?hl=es&id=dmJj8ibGQp4C


    «Intermarriage between Highlanders and Indians, as well as between Highlanders and the daughters of other Highlanders and Indians, reached all across the continent and produced a population in both Canada and the United States that traced its descent from both Scottish clans and Indian tribes. Highland men and Indian women generated webs of allegiance and identity that persist to this day.» (pp. 147-148).

    «Englishmen in the seventeenth century resisted intercourse and intermarriage with Indian women as a threat to their assumed cultural supremacy and their social order. However, in the eighteenth century they engaged in plenty of both on the frontiers, especially in the fur trade, where Indian partners brought commercial advantages, as well as sexual companionship. […]

    “I am really at a loss how to pass my time in this remote part of the Country if I don’t take one of the Squaws into the Woods and play at all fours with her,” one Highland soldier stationed at the Abenaki town of Saint Francis (now Odanak) near Montreal wrote to his brother in 1762. Simon Fraser boasted of his sexual conquests with Indian women to Sir William Johnson (whose own sexual exploits with Iroquois women were legendary).» (p. 148).

    «European men and Indian women all across America produced children of mixed parentage, and Highland Scots probably had no more interactions with Indian women than did the French, who intermarried so commonly with Indian peoples of the Great Lakes and Canadian prairies that a “new” Métis population developed with a distinct ethnic identity. Nonetheless, Scots took up with Indian women in large numbers, far more proportionately than did their English counterparts. An investigation of ethnic patterns of intermarriage with Indian people in the Pacific Northwest in the last two decades of the nineteenth century, for example, found that foreigh-born settlers were far more likely than their American-born neighbors to marry Indians. Scottish settlers accounted for only 1.4 percent of the total population but for 5.6 percent of marriage with Indians, a rate of intermarriage four times what would be predicted merely from their proportion of the region’s total population.» (p. 149).

    «In a world where prosperous Scots traders often owned plantations and slaves, Scots and Indian intermarriages sometimes became entwined with African intermarriage. Robert Grierson, a native of Scotland […] married a woman named Sinnugee […] Grierson was “much attached to this country and means to spend his days here with his Indian family and connexions.” Grierson and Sinnugee had eight children and many descendants, including those of a daughter who had children with a man of African descent.» (p. 156).

    «The North West Company had few compuctions about intermarriage: All ranks took Indian partners, and the company accepted some responsibility for maintaining Native wives and families.» (p. 157).

    «Scots may have taken more easily than Englishmen to the “custom of the country,” but living with Indian women was widespread, even standard, practice. By 1821, when the two companies merged, “practically all offices of the Hudson’s Bay and North West Companies, and many lower-ranked employees as well, were allied with women born in the Indian country.” […]» (p. 158).

    «When James Carnegie, the Earl of Southesk, traveledthrough Saskatchewan and the Rockies in 1859 and 1860, Scots and Scots-Indian Métis were ubiquitous. When Lady Ishbel Aberdeen visited the Blackfeet in the 1860s, she saw “many faces reminding of Scottish characteristics.” Treaty commissioners in Manitoba reported “a large population of French Métis and Scotch Halfbreeds.” Although there was much general resemblance, the Earl of Southesk wrote, Scots-Indian Métis differed considerably from those of French Indian origin. They often had “the fair hair and other physical characteristics of a northern race, while in disposition they are more industrious and more actuated by a sense of duty.”» (p. 164).

    White People, Indians, and Highlanders: Tribal People and Colonial Encounters in Scotland and America
    http://books.google.es/books?id=kL8bYs02ahoC


    «The East India Company was licensed by the British state to monopolise trade with the subcontinent and points east. When its mercenary army, commanded by Robert Clive, defeated the Nawab of Bengal, Siraj-ud-Dowla, at Plassey in 1757 and installed his uncle Mir Jafar as his successor, the EIC was able to commence the ‘rape of Bengal’, plundering the territory and its taxpayers freely.» (p. 178).

    Gods, Mongrels and Demons
    http://books.google.es/books?id=GAmFGPI8A5gC


    «Allen Edwardes has written a biography of Robert Clive, the British diplomat and explorer, which is, as Edwardes’ subtitle indicates, effectively “a sexual history of the conquest of Hindustan”. But Clive was also the great sexual nabob of the of the Indian subcontinent. […] Clive’s ‘conquest’ was sexual, partly homosexual. […] according to his own manuscript diaries […] Clive commited sodomy on dozens of natives in orgies that today seem scarcely credible. […] even his French adventures among the confrérie de sodomie seem tame in comparison to those he had in India.» (p. 31).



    Perilous Enlightenment: pre- and post-modern discourses: sexual, historical
    http://books.google.es/books?id=6QoNAQAAIAAJ


    «The British army in India was given to same-sex activities, in the context of what has been described as ‘the prevailing homosocial structure of desire in British India’. There are snippets of evidence from the 1830s and 1840s, such as Sir Richard Burton’s notorious investigation of the boy-brothels of Karachi in 1845, but the rest is silence, broken only by the terrible tragedy of Major-General Sir Hector Macdonald in Ceylon, committing suicide in 1903 after allegations of sex with a considerable number of Sinhalese boys.»

    «It has always been understood that a major justification for ‘regimental brothels’ in India was the fear that without access to female prostitutes, there would be, as one viceroy put it, ‘ever more deplorable evils… an increase in unnatural crimes’» (p. 440).

    «The survival of a lengthy erotic manuscript, of indisputable authenticity, written by a serving Indian army officer, Captain Kenneth Searight, is of great significance. […] embedded in it is a chronicle of imperial experience, all the more important because of its unique revelation of a prolonged and intensive set of sexual relationships with Indian boys.» (p. 441).

    «the vast majority of men in supposedly ‘homosexual’ cultures in the past —whether in ancient Greece and Rome […] Nelson’s navy, or even late Victorian and Edwardian England— were involved in asymmetric relationships, usually with boys and not other mature men.» (p. 442).

    «It was well known to the British in India that Muslim sexuality was ambivalent, even hypocritical […] To get a boy in Peshawar, he [Searight] wrote, ‘was easier than to pick the flowers by the wayside’.» (p. 443).

    «The ‘Paidiology’ list at the back of the volume consists almost entirely of the 125 boys from the Indian period, 1909 to 1917, and it is certainly incomplete […] The tables record for each boy his forename, age, and ‘race’ […] Invariably the boys —Mahmud, Abdul, Umar, Mazuffar, and the rest—» (p. 446).

    «To begin with, his contacts in Bengal were with Gurkha boys in their mid-teens, Kaul, Lachman, Bahadur, and Lobzang the Tibetan, ‘slim brown enchanters’ […] A defining moment occurred in Calcutta in 1911 when he was approached […] by a fourteen-year-old seductive Narayan, who, once they had found a room, penetrated him, and thus ‘taught me how the passive love is won’.» (p. 447).


    Sir Hector MacDonald

    Understanding the British Empire
    http://books.google.es/books?id=iylEklKX_WQC


    «Natural population growth was retarded also by the considerable sexual inbalance that existed throught the [17th] century. Besides being an immigrant society, THE CHESAPEAKE WAS EMPHATICALLY A MALE SOCIETY. [...] SIX TIMES MORE MEN THAN WOMEN EMIGRATED IN THE 1630S, and although greater numbers of females took ship after 1650, men continued to outnumber women by nearly three to one throughout the rest of the century.»

    The Oxford History of the British Empire: Volume I: The Origins of Empire, p. 182
    http://books.google.es/books?id=eQHSivGzEEMC
    Escupes contra el viento.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cristiano viejo View Post
    Read carefully, sudaca. And I hope you dont say again Anglos did not mix:

    Spoiler!
    You collected it by yourself from various sources or there is a website with all this stuff?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adamastor View Post
    Well, I don't know about India, maybe you're right in this, but in North America it's completely certain the mixing was very little if any at all in most places there outside Southern USA. There are some White Americans with Amerindian and SSA, but they are mostly restricted to Southern areas as I said.
    You are not understanding... I am not saying white Americans have negro or native blood but that racial mix existed. It is different, not sure if your brain can understand this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Adamastor View Post
    Historical studies are pretty much inferior to genetic studies to measure these things. Many chronicles are heavily exaggerated, for example. The reality is that the overwhelming majority of White Americans are 99-100% European, that was my point. One cannot compare USA, Australia and New Zealand with French, Dutch, Portuguese and especially Spanish colonies.

    In some Spanish colonies there was heavy immigration of Spaniards and they are still mixed as fuck. As I said even Uruguay, the whitest Hispanic American country has only 30% of fully Europeans and most of them from recent immigration. USA will reach this point too, but it still has a large proportion of fully Europeans even among people of colonial stock.

    Don't be irrational, you know there's no comparison between Anglo colonies and others.
    I repeat you: for every Spaniard in America you have 1000 Anglos. That and only that is the reason why still there are pure whites in USA. Now wait another 300 years (to that USA has the same time that the Spanish colonies have) and we will see how mixed USA will be

    Quote Originally Posted by Duffmannn View Post
    Escupes contra el viento.
    A ti te escupen en tu cara y tú callas como puta.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lukasz View Post
    You collected it by yourself from various sources or there is a website with all this stuff?
    It is a Spanish user who collected and posted this and many more from his books about the racial mixing in the British colonies (USA, India, New Zealand etc) in Stormfront time ago
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-3/
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-5/
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-6/
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-7/
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-8/
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-9/
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-10/

    I only posted a bit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cristiano viejo View Post
    A ti te escupen en tu cara y tú callas como puta.
    El tener un comportamiento infantil no va a hacer que tengas más razón y que dejes de hacer el ridículo.

    It is a Spanish user who collected and posted this and many more from his books about the racial mixing in the British colonies (USA, India, New Zealand etc) in Stormfront time ago
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-3/
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-5/
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-6/
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-7/
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-8/
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-9/
    https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1012464-10/

    I only posted a bit.
    Ese eres tú y lo sabes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Duffmannn View Post
    El tener un comportamiento infantil no va a hacer que tengas más razón y que dejes de hacer el ridículo.
    ¿Postear información para desmentir algo de lo que se nos acusa es tener un comportamiento infantil, cenutrio?


    Quote Originally Posted by Duffmannn View Post
    Ese eres tú y lo sabes.
    tío deja de acusarme de ser éste o aquél en otros foros, que me da la risa
    Y yo soy el infantil...

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