Vikings “Saved” Europe – Not Charlemagne

[PaleoEuropean]

Normans saved half of Italy from Muslims that were in Sicily, Byzantine Empire was very weak and unable to do anything.

I would be always grateful for them for having not let the area of my italian ancestors becoming muslim.

They were also the heavy hitters during the Crusades, even if they were a bit unruly.

[Grace O'Malley]

We don't even know how much impact Vikings had on Normandy or Normans. It looks like the Normans were largely Northern French at any rate. We need some studies to see what the impact was on the population. At any rate I don't think Normans = Vikings. People should be specific as they are different populations on the whole IMO.

[PaleoEuropean]

We don't even know how much impact Vikings had on Normandy or Normans. It looks like the Normans were largely Northern French at any rate. We need some studies to see what the impact was on the population. At any rate I don't think Normans = Vikings. People should be specific as they are different populations on the whole IMO.

Norman nobility were descendants of Vikings and a few other Germanic peoples, the Norman Peasantry was just french.

[Grace O'Malley]

Norman nobility were descendants of Vikings and a few other Germanic peoples, the Norman Peasantry was just french.

We really need to see some genomes to assess this sort of thing. Yes it makes sense it was most likely the nobility. Anyway I still think people shouldn't mix the two groups up. They aren't the same.

[Dick]

Normans saved half of Italy from Muslims that were in Sicily, Byzantine Empire was very weak and unable to do anything.

I would be always grateful for them for having not let the area of my italian ancestors becoming muslim.

The Serb Drobnjak clan belong to a specific subclade of I1-P109 that is common in Normandy. All these Balkan samples also have an exact match in Catania, Sicily (Norman stronghold), and their common ancestor lived about 850 years ago, so roughly around the time when Normans increased their activities on the Balkans.

[JamesBond007]

Normans made Europe great

Nigga, I am Norman :

Target: Kevin_scaled
Distance: 2.3582% / 0.02358216
79.6 Norwegian
16.4 Spanish_Soria
Etc...

[JamesBond007]

Norman nobility were descendants of Vikings and a few other Germanic peoples, the Norman Peasantry was just french.

Nigga, I am Norman and 79.6% Norwegian the rest is mostly Spanish but it might as well be Southern French and I cluster with the Dutch. My last name is Hiberno-Norman.

[Token]

We don't even know how much impact Vikings had on Normandy or Normans. It looks like the Normans were largely Northern French at any rate. We need some studies to see what the impact was on the population. At any rate I don't think Normans = Vikings. People should be specific as they are different populations on the whole IMO.

Early Normans were fiercely anti-gallicisation and refused to abandon Old Norse in favour of Latin. Thus the rebellion of 927 against Willian Longsword, who was already half French and considered too soft and French by his Norse peers. Normans surely didn't just forsake their culture to adapt to their new reality. Gallicisation was gradual and driven by mixture with the French locals.

[Token]

Nigga, I am Norman and 79.6% Norwegian the rest is mostly Spanish but it might as well be Southern French and I cluster with the Dutch. My last name is Hiberno-Norman.

No you are not. It just happens 79.6% Norwegian and the rest Spanish is a good approximation to where your Murican mutt background makes you plot in the G25 PCA.

[PaleoEuropean]

We really need to see some genomes to assess this sort of thing. Yes it makes sense it was most likely the nobility. Anyway I still think people shouldn't mix the two groups up. They aren't the same.

Well Norman's are broken up into two periods basically, the initial Normans and then those that were assimilated or basically joined the Normans, most the nobility is pretty certain on their origins, for instance the Tosny's are known to be of French origin but were Norman nobility.

I2a2a3 (Z161+)
I2-Z161 is the largest I2a2 subclade today. Also formed about 10,000 years ago, it is composed of three top-level subclades: L623, Y5188 and L801. The two first are extremely rare and have only been identified in Scotland and Ireland. 99% of Z161 members belong to L801 and share a common ancestor who lived 4,000 years ago, although L801 subclades experienced a dramatic expansion in the last 2,000 years. L801 is found predominantly in Germanic countries, with a particularly high concentration in Denmark, Germany, the Netherlands, England and in Northwest Sicily (Norman settlement). It is also found at lower densities throughout the rest of Europe, from Portugal to Russia. I2-L801 is thought to have been propagated around Europe by the Danish Vikings (Britain, Normandy, Sicily), the Swedish Vikings (Baltic, Russia, Ukraine), the Goths (Moldova, Balkans, Italy, south-west France, Spain), the Suebi (Portugal and Galicia), the Lombards (attested by a hotspot in Campobasso, Molise), and the Franks (Rhineland, Belgium). All top level subclades are found in Germany, which points to its place of origin. Z161+ commonly known as the I2 Continental clade (except Continental 3).