The stupidity of the "Mediterranean" label for phenotypes.

[Morena]

I've always considered "Med" to be a European phenotype, which other groups can sometimes look like (because of ancestral reasons) but not as a whole. In other words, you'll have people outside of Europe and European influenced areas who appear Med but whose co-ethnics are mostly not Med. For example, MENA people. Most MENA don't look like true meds, but individually, there are quite a few who fit into the Med spectrum.

Med is in between North Europe and MENA. In fact, that's how it should be defined because that's how it looks in ever plot I've seen.

[Zroota]

FIG. 6 (2 views, photo Henry Field. From Field, Henry, Arabs of Central Iraq, Anth. Mem. of the Field Museum of Natural History, vol. 4, 1935, Plate LXXX). A tall Mediterranean from Iraq. The Iraqians, who are apparently direct and unaltered descendants of the ancient Mesopotamians, are Mediterraneans. They are, however, on the whole taller, darker-skinned, longer-faced, and straighter-haired than the Arabs.

Coon being ignorant yet again. Modern day Iraqi Arabs are very mixed and impure. The majority are more Arabian admixed, though many would have Iranian, Mandean, Turkmen, Kurdish and a mishmash of other West Asian groups in their blood. They are not straightforward descendants of ancient Mesopotamians. That will be us Assyrians (not saying we're 100% pure descendants, as we have mixed with Armenians to some degree, but we're up there as being pure Mesopotamians alongside Mandeans who come from southern Mesopotamia). Iraqi Arabs are too mixed and that Iraqi template up there ironically shows his admix very clearly (Arabian head and ear shape, Turkmen eyes and Iranian jaw - typical Iraqi Arab look that even Saddam and his henchmen possessed).

And why did Coon broaden the Med race? Arabs are long-headed Mediterranean? There is nothing Mediterranean about them, other than their elongated head shape. If a long head means Mediterranean, then those Caucasoid Somalis with long heads should also be Mediterranean by his strange logic.

[Dick]

Coon being ignorant yet again. Modern day Iraqi Arabs are very mixed and impure. The majority are more Arabian admixed, though many would have Iranian, Mandean, Turkmen, Kurdish and a mishmash of other West Asian groups in their blood. They are not straightforward descendants of ancient Mesopotamians. That will be us Assyrians (not saying we're 100% pure descendants, as we have mixed with Armenians to some degree, but we're up there as being pure Mesopotamians alongside Mandeans who come from southern Mesopotamia). Iraqi Arabs are too mixed and that Iraqi template up there ironically shows his admix very clearly (Arabian head and ear shape, Turkmen eyes and Iranian jaw - typical Iraqi Arab look that even Saddam and his henchmen possessed).

And why did Coon broaden the Med race? Arabs are long-headed Mediterranean? There is nothing Mediterranean about them, other than their elongated head shape. If a long head means Mediterranean, then those Caucasoid Somalis with long heads should also be Mediterranean by his strange logic.

Friend you're ok user to me, but you don't have any right to insult anyone on very personal level like this, I came to warn you, next time 3 days ban, no offence, even this is stretching the rules not to ban you now, but to warn you.

[catgeorge]

No it's not vast majority of phenotypes although I consider it a pseudo science derives from the seas

Mediterranean sea = Mediterranean
North Sea = Nordic
Baltic Sea = Baltid
Euxinos Pontos/Black Sea = Pontid
Celtic Sea = Keltid
Aegean Sea = Aegean Med
Levantine Sea = Levatine
Atlantic sea = Atlantid
Ionian Sea --- interesting one indeed but resembles mainland Greek
Adriatic Sea ---- another very interesting one
European Inland - largely Alpine

What Im trying to get at that people's race tends to gravitate towards the seas

[Tauromachos]

South Europeans are in the first place Mediterranean by Geography.

Since the Mediterranean region includes both parts of Europe,Africa and the Middle East
,North Africans for example are Mediterraneans as well which does not mean they are the same
people with South Euros.




If one wants to be more precise one could distinguish South Euros as European Mediterranean.

Of course there is some shared things between Non European and European Mediteranean
people.

The issue is currently sensitive because of the abnormal conditions established by the
mass migrations from North Africans into Europe.

But one should relax and rather consider the history in the past

There have been Phoenicians in Europe and Greeks and Romans in North Africa,so
its normal that some things will be shared.

Then there is the Med phenotype which is a phenotype of the White(Caucasian) race

Of course not all South Europeans are Med by phenotype

[Tauromachos]

I've always considered "Med" to be a European phenotype, which other groups can sometimes look like (because of ancestral reasons) but not as a whole. In other words, you'll have people outside of Europe and European influenced areas who appear Med but whose co-ethnics are mostly not Med. For example, MENA people. Most MENA don't look like true meds, but individually, there are quite a few who fit into the Med spectrum.

Med is in between North Europe and MENA. In fact, that's how it should be defined because that's how it looks in ever plot I've seen.

It is a European phenotype since it can be found throughout all of Europe

For example one can find Med types also among natives of Ireland,Wales,Scottland and in Germany..
and its morphologically fairly similar to Nordic types except the differences in pigmentation.

No there is Med types among Middle Easterners and North African too but one should consider Menas who
have Med phenotypes are basicly still white caucasian in that sense,they are distinguished by language,culture
and genetics mainly and also one shouldn't forget that many North Africans have extra SSA infuence in their phenotypes

[kalach]

Physical anthropology is a pseudo science, we all know that. A very look alike Portuguese and Lebanese can have very little genetic affinity. Phenotypes matter socially, we can't see one's autosomal DNA test but their facial features and body.

[Columella]

No it's not vast majority of phenotypes although I consider it a pseudo science derives from the seas

Mediterranean sea = Mediterranean
North Sea = Nordic
Baltic Sea = Baltid
Euxinos Pontos/Black Sea = Pontid
Celtic Sea = Keltid
Aegean Sea = Aegean Med
Levantine Sea = Levatine
Atlantic sea = Atlantid
Ionian Sea --- interesting one indeed but resembles mainland Greek
Adriatic Sea ---- another very interesting one
European Inland - largely Alpine

What Im trying to get at that people's race tends to gravitate towards the seas

Adriatic was used as another name for Dinaric.

In short geographical based name are highly misleading but They are easy to remember.

[Columella]

Personally I think that North Africans i see (I guess mainly from Marocco) are Metrically much more Mediterranean looking than the average North Italian. Obviously most Moroccans have an African influence while Italians an European one.
They have very long, and very narrow vaults = marked dolicocephaly..
Narrow faced with very fine features. Most Italians compared have larger and thicker skulls denoting a stronger proto-european and Alpine/Dinaric element .

[Trouble]

Coon being ignorant yet again. Modern day Iraqi Arabs are very mixed and impure. The majority are more Arabian admixed, though many would have Iranian, Mandean, Turkmen, Kurdish and a mishmash of other West Asian groups in their blood. They are not straightforward descendants of ancient Mesopotamians. That will be us Assyrians (not saying we're 100% pure descendants, as we have mixed with Armenians to some degree, but we're up there as being pure Mesopotamians alongside Mandeans who come from southern Mesopotamia). Iraqi Arabs are too mixed and that Iraqi template up there ironically shows his admix very clearly (Arabian head and ear shape, Turkmen eyes and Iranian jaw - typical Iraqi Arab look that even Saddam and his henchmen possessed).

And why did Coon broaden the Med race? Arabs are long-headed Mediterranean? There is nothing Mediterranean about them, other than their elongated head shape. If a long head means Mediterranean, then those Caucasoid Somalis with long heads should also be Mediterranean by his strange logic.

I hate to derail this thread further but yes I don’t know how anyone can say they’re not mixed given the history. Unless they’ve got genetic results to back it up, which I doubt they do.