Genética de españoles e hispanoamericanos

[Defcon2]

Joder, como está el patio, la gente se vuelve loca por cualquier chorrada, si más buena gente no puedo haber sido con estas 4 referencias.

http://https://www.theapricity.com/f...46#post6836746

No acabo de ver lo que crítica, que no es lo suficientemente eslavo?

[Erronkari]

Joder, como está el patio, la gente se vuelve loca por cualquier chorrada, si más buena gente no puedo haber sido con estas 4 referencias.

http://https://www.theapricity.com/f...46#post6836746

Que raro... pincho el enlace y me da error...

[gixajo]

He estudiado muy a fondo mi genética, de hecho no soy nuevo en esto, soy usuario habitual de Anthrogenica y llevo bastante tiempo metido en estos asuntos (que me he metido aquí estos días de parón), el porcentaje judío es real acorde a mis investigaciones en genealogía genética (corroborado por otros especialistas en este campo de la genealogía genética judía), aparte tengo muchos matches judíos en un segmento cromosómico en concreto, y lo he verificado además por genalogía tradicional a través de un apellido mío bastante raro. También tengo Global 25 y sí corrobora dicha ancestría. En españoles es muy normal que el porcentaje judío sea pequeño (el que lo tenga claro está, no todos han heredado segmentos judíos perceptibles), pero no tiene porqué ser falso, solo hay que corroborarlo concienzudamente. Cierto es que hay casos en los que es falso, pero como he dicho, hay que ponerse a ello.

Hay muchos usuarios de esta prueba que coinciden en que es una de las mejores, en mi caso así ha sido también.

También he utilizado el Morley predictor con anterioridad, me dice que lo más probable es que sea R1b, pero estoy esperando una prueba para confirmar resultados.

Supongo que ya hablamos de esto en Anthrogenica,pro ya sabrás que lo de los apellidos no es muy fiable, no recuerdo cual era tu apellido sospechoso de provenir de judíos.

Yo sigo pensando que es muy difícil determinar una ascendencia judía muy lejana y en pequeña cantidad, y sospecho que muchos casos, en europeos, te marca como judío algo que en realidad es una mezcla de levantino con europeo o con otros componentes.

Tampoco es imposible, por supuesto.

Yo creo que siendo prudentes, deberíamos llamarlo Levantino, que es lo que realmente tienen en común genéticamente todos los judíos en mayor o menor medida, y que eso de etiquetarlos como Mitzrahim, Sephardim, Ashkenazim etc al final son Levantino+Iraní, Yemenita, Italiano, Ibérico, Eslavo, Germano, Turco etc...

A los judíos de por aquí les suelo poner para marcar su parte judía esta mezcla de referencias viejunas y modernas, y no deja de ser una referencia levantina:

Palestinian/Jewish=(Levant_Yehud_IBA,+Levant_Ashkelon_IA1,)+Pa lestinian_Beit_Sahour

[gixajo]

Que raro... pincho el enlace y me da error...

Espero que no hayan eliminado el thread, sería ridículo.

[Rocinante]

He estudiado muy a fondo mi genética, de hecho no soy nuevo en esto, soy usuario habitual de Anthrogenica y llevo bastante tiempo metido en estos asuntos (que me he metido aquí estos días de parón), el porcentaje judío es real acorde a mis investigaciones en genealogía genética (corroborado por otros especialistas en este campo de la genealogía genética judía), aparte tengo muchos matches judíos en un segmento cromosómico en concreto, y lo he verificado además por genalogía tradicional a través de un apellido mío bastante raro. También tengo Global 25 y sí corrobora dicha ancestría. En españoles es muy normal que el porcentaje judío sea pequeño (el que lo tenga claro está, no todos han heredado segmentos judíos perceptibles), pero no tiene porqué ser falso, solo hay que corroborarlo concienzudamente. Cierto es que hay casos en los que es falso, pero como he dicho, hay que ponerse a ello.

Hay muchos usuarios de esta prueba que coinciden en que es una de las mejores, en mi caso así ha sido también.

También he utilizado el Morley predictor con anterioridad, me dice que lo más probable es que sea R1b, pero estoy esperando una prueba para confirmar resultados.

Ya tu nombre se me hacia algo parecido a uno de Anthrogenica... Si puedes, y no es molestia, podrias subir esos resultados del YSEQ Clade Predictor o MorleyDNA? Si MorleyDNA te dice que eres R1b, es porque eres R1b 100% seguro, en realidad esta comprobado que no falla, lo que te puede fallar es el ultimo clado que te de MorleyDNA por tema de que ellos manejan unos SNPs de clados modernos que han sido desaprobados por ISOGG, en pocas palabras, eran nada mas y nada menos que experimentales.

Ahora, vamos a ver que tan judio eres, por favor, usa este modelo:

Tianyuan:CHN_Tianyuan,-0.027318,-0.260991,-0.075424,0.071383,0.033545,-0.018407,-0.00799,-0.003,0.040291,0.021322,-0.006333,-0.005995,-0.003568,-0.00523,-0.000407,-0.000663,0.008084,0.002407,-0.001131,0.027263,-0.001747,0.008037,-0.008874,-0.010845,0.011256
Gravettian:RUS_Sunghir,0.0401228,0.01244,0.0022628,0.0713022,0.030467,-0.0033465,0.0028788,-0.0045,0.0404445,0.0083828,0.011895,-0.0098913,0.0084365,-0.0130397,0.0114685,0.016607,0.0167218,0.0019637,-0.005782,0.029639,0.0263908,0.0058428,-0.0130335,-0.0473262,0.004281
Ancient_North_Eurasian:RUS_MA1,0.078538,-0.025388,0.039598,0.186049,-0.068936,0.04518,-0.048412,-0.056998,-0.019839,-0.069432,0.029879,-0.009591,0.015312,-0.045553,0.014251,0.021082,-0.007693,0,-0.003645,0.000625,-0.027327,0.002844,0.011339,-0.008314,-0.001437
Early_Anatolian_Farmer:TUR_Barcin_N,0.1175998,0.180118,0.0035312,-0.101158,0.0510443,-0.0483875,-0.0043582,-0.0069334,0.0362287,0.0807473,0.0079718,0.0118803,-0.0234545,0.0004691,-0.0419807,-0.0101913,0.0233091,0.0019866,0.0136954,-0.0097489,-0.0142249,0.0057723,-0.0041232,-0.0031658,-0.0043437
Satsurblia_Cluster:GEO_CHG,0.091058,0.102568,-0.083344,-0.00323,-0.08617,0.020638,0.024911,-0.001846,-0.128236,-0.074717,-0.006333,0.023979,-0.054856,0.004404,0.026601,-0.03275,0.02386,-0.013429,-0.022249,0.034767,0.033815,-0.007048,0.006532,-0.025787,-0.002036
Iberomaurusian:MAR_Taforalt,-0.189857,0.0814452,-0.0242866,-0.085595,0.027636,-0.0552202,-0.0705968,0.0184146,0.155397,0.003499,0.0209156,-0.0318316,0.0747168,-0.0513334,0.0711988,-0.0363032,0.0052676,-0.066106,-0.1424162,0.0389938,-0.0376836,-0.1255322,0.0730118,-0.0137606,0.0164534
Western_Hunter-Gatherer:LUX_Loschbour,0.133173,0.106631,0.20176,0.192186,0.164338,0.055778,0.00611,0.036922,0.096535,0.02278,-0.020786,-0.016186,0.024975,-0.007432,0.065824,0.063643,0.008084,0.006714,-0.013324,0.065281,0.120038,0.019166,-0.059405,-0.175687,0.022992
Jomon:JPN_Jomon,0.011003,-0.3440953,-0.0537398,0.0124893,0.038161,0.0139448,-0.0020758,-0.0015383,0.024577,0.0205622,-0.049718,-0.0068938,0.0096878,-0.0069958,-0.023819,-0.0154467,0.006454,0.0099242,0.0024722,-0.0060655,0.0639705,-0.0456895,0.0091615,0.0112062,-0.0994323
Iran_Neolithic:IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N,0.0430252,0.0664158,-0.1550722,0.0047158,-0.122669,0.0235384,0.017109,-0.0011998,-0.082546,-0.0544158,-0.0028258,-0.0016186,0.0044896,-0.0062756,0.0316498,0.0561384,-0.0054242,0.0068664,0.0136508,-0.0334162,0.00856,-0.028836,-0.0110678,-0.039331,0.0222254
Dravidian:IRN_Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA2,0.043708,-0.0327002,-0.170006,0.0950268,-0.1047582,0.0568936,0.0063452,0.0041998,0.0056858,0.0067428,-0.0051964,0.0079128,-0.0018436,-0.0031928,0.0098534,0.0097852,-0.0023732,0.0025084,0.0016342,-0.0142568,0.0029694,-0.0125136,-0.0011832,-0.0119052,0.001317
Western_Steppe_Herder:Yamnaya_RUS_Samara,0.1255849,0.089028,0.0426986,0.1153479,-0.0287232,0.0450564,0.0036033,-0.0025642,-0.0559032,-0.0728943,0.0018222,3.32e-05,-0.0026924,-0.0233041,0.0366141,0.0157633,-0.0012316,-0.0017879,-0.0038408,0.0137704,-0.0031749,0.0007557,0.0110649,0.0186102,-0.004537
Eastern_Hunter-Gatherer:RUS_Karelia_HG,0.1236877,0.0321583,0.129855,0.2101663,-0.010361,0.0571723,-0.0196627,-0.0234603,-0.002659,-0.0860153,0.0182957,-0.0184337,0.0333497,-0.039085,0.018865,0.0295237,-0.0148203,0.0031673,-0.0044413,0.012506,-0.007487,0.0169817,0.0093667,-0.021007,-0.0103383
Early_Levantine_Farmer:Levant_Natufian,0.020488,0.1431895,-0.0377125,-0.1387295,0.030775,-0.079484,-0.025616,-0.0175375,0.114329,0.002005,0.0332085,-0.0222555,0.076486,0.002133,0.0153365,0.009016,-0.0154505,-0.001014,-0.02206,0.040832,0.001497,0.0001235,-0.003636,-0.0044585,0.006287
Scandinavian_Hunter-Gatherer:SWE_Motala_HG,0.13249,0.0895696,0.1651034,0.187341,0.0864774,0.0551646,-0.00235,0.008538,0.0376324,-0.0389258,0.0016562,-0.0187034,0.0310404,-0.0173406,0.0315686,0.049297,0.005763,0.0024324,-0.006335,0.039744,0.0507604,0.014418,-0.022086,-0.0977008,0.0070412
Rudnaya:RUS_Devils_Gate_Cave_N,0.0162197,-0.4440402,0.0722185,-0.0511148,-0.0373912,-0.0395328,0.0034075,0.0084802,0.0064935,0.019408,-0.048595,-0.004833,-0.0030848,0.0086702,-0.0096025,-0.0133915,-0.0007825,0.0089,0.0174408,0.0100362,0.008828,-0.027729,-0.0174702,-0.00244,-0.0145795
Beringian:USA_Ancient_Beringian,0.0432525,-0.3051665,0.0873035,0.081073,-0.0887855,-0.020777,-0.1215005,-0.150686,-0.020657,-0.0218685,0.008038,-0.009816,0.0097375,-0.0141065,-0.009093,0.004508,0.002021,0.0119085,0.003017,0.0139445,-0.005927,0.0059355,0.00721,0.0040965,-0.0006585
Siberian:RUS_Kolyma_Meso,0.043253,-0.337156,0.087492,0.045543,-0.07663,-0.02259,-0.047707,-0.050767,-0.006545,-0.024055,0.005846,-0.006145,0.017988,-0.026424,-0.021851,-0.004243,0.001173,0.012162,0.018101,0.008879,0.004118,-0.023247,0.013311,0.009158,0.009221
Amerindian:BRA_LapaDoSanto_9600BP,0.050765,-0.3095332,0.1206032,0.098515,-0.1156522,-0.017626,-0.284645,-0.3400012,-0.0136212,-0.0184422,0.002241,-0.003267,0.0004162,0.017478,-0.0065688,0.0064438,0.006493,-0.001267,0.0026898,0.003727,-0.0010482,0.007963,-0.002662,-0.0043378,0.001413
West_Africa_Early_Stone_Age:CMR_Shum_Laka_8000BP,-0.602693,0.055346,0.0148965,0.0263245,-0.0064625,0.00502,0.1243205,-0.099919,0.0138055,-0.007016,-0.00065,-0.0242785,-0.0203665,-0.0052295,0.0021035,-0.00179,0.0127125,0.017356,-0.0011945,-0.0040645,-0.003494,-0.000371,0.0016025,-0.0009035,-0.0020955
Kura-Araxes:Kura-Araxes_ARM_Kaps,0.1013025,0.133034,-0.07071,-0.043605,-0.0498555,-0.0092035,0.008108,-0.011653,-0.066368,-0.01631,0.0030855,0.011015,-0.019846,0.005849,0.0042075,-0.0102095,-0.0001305,-0.003927,-0.001697,0.0032515,0.003494,-0.000247,-0.0036975,-0.0090975,-0.0030535
Pre-Indo-European:RUS_Khvalynsk_En,0.1221697,0.055177,0.0808297,0.1612857,-0.027082,0.0499213,-0.0098703,-0.014461,-0.0424047,-0.08474,0.0072533,-0.0060947,0.015956,-0.0422043,0.0269633,0.0172367,-0.0034337,-0.001816,-0.010768,0.0121723,-0.0102737,0.0039983,0.0131463,0.000924,-0.007544
Botai:KAZ_Botai,0.102441,-0.0832737,0.0902577,0.1761437,-0.082169,0.0394163,-0.0436337,-0.050613,-0.029247,-0.081338,0.027281,-0.0073933,0.0240333,-0.0694997,0.0219413,0.0205953,-0.011604,-0.00114,0.0001677,-0.002835,-0.0347723,0.017765,0.023787,0.0040567,-0.0082623
Pre-Pottery_Neolithic:Levant_PPNB,0.072847,0.1639064,-0.0316026,-0.1361132,0.0332986,-0.0645352,-0.0134426,-0.0147684,0.0741604,0.03601,0.0188046,-0.0150764,0.035738,0.0025596,-0.0217696,0.006099,0.0098048,-0.0013176,-0.0047264,0.0188088,-0.001797,0.0071472,0.0008872,-0.0056874,-0.0037602
Maykop:RUS_Maykop,0.104717,0.122879,-0.049403,-0.019703,-0.047701,-0.011156,0.01034,-0.005307,-0.049086,-0.015308,0.008444,0.005545,-0.015907,-0.002752,-0.002172,-0.007955,0.009127,0.003927,-0.005531,-0.006503,-0.002995,0.000866,-0.019596,-0.019521,0.009101

[gixajo]

No acabo de ver lo que crítica, que no es lo suficientemente eslavo?

Según ella, a los Croatas les molesta que les llamen Balcánicos, es un insulto para ellos, a lo que le he contestado, que igual a ella le molesta, pero que en la península de los balcanes viven unos cuantos más aparte de los Croatas.

Por supuesto, como no, ha soltado algo así como "es lo mismo que los españoles con los moros", y no, no es lo mismo, lo de los españoles con los moros sería si les pongo una referencia Turca en vez de una Túrkica. A lo que sería equiparable es a que un vasco o catalán nacionalista les molestara que los llamaran Ibéricos y los metieran en el mismo saco que a los demás españoles. Eso sí es más parecido a lo que ha pasado.

[rober_tce]

Supongo que ya hablamos de esto en Anthrogenica,pro ya sabrás que lo de los apellidos no es muy fiable, no recuerdo cual era tu apellido sospechoso de provenir de judíos.

Yo sigo pensando que es muy difícil determinar una ascendencia judía muy lejana y en pequeña cantidad, y sospecho que muchos casos, en europeos, te marca como judío algo que en realidad es una mezcla de levantino con europeo o con otros componentes.

Tampoco es imposible, por supuesto.

Yo creo que siendo prudentes, deberíamos llamarlo Levantino, que es lo que realmente tienen en común genéticamente todos los judíos en mayor o menor medida, y que eso de etiquetarlos como Mitzrahim, Sephardim, Ashkenazim etc al final son Levantino+Iraní, Yemenita, Italiano, Ibérico, Eslavo, Germano, Turco etc...

A los judíos de por aquí les suelo poner para marcar su parte judía esta mezcla de referencias viejunas y modernas, y no deja de ser una referencia levantina:

Palestinian/Jewish=(Levant_Yehud_IBA,+Levant_Ashkelon_IA1,)+Pa lestinian_Beit_Sahour

No hablo de los typical apellidos judíos de la lista de la Inquisición, eso no es fiable (que te llames Córdoba por ejemplo no te hace descender de conversos per sé, es un apellido castellano el cual algunos conversos usaron). Nunca lo puse ese apellido por privacidad en el foro, pero descubrí una línea judía a través de genealogía tradicional en dicho apellido. En mi caso sí que descubrí un segmento judío, con ayuda como he dicho antes a través genealogistas genéticos de este campo, así pues sí que se puede verificar con las herramientas adecuadas.

No llegamos a hablar de esto en AG, pero sí que hay unos post míos explicando toda esta temática y cómo llegué a corroborar la veracidad de este asunto.

[Rocinante]

Miren se los digo por experiencia, esa mujer es super bipolar, un dia es tu amiga aqui en TA, y el otro, te da una puñalada por detras con insultos, incluso se mete en temas donde no lo conviene ni le compete, paso con el asirio que es un supuesto experto en genetica, lo defendio a capa y espada nada mas para tocar los huevos, tanto la cago, que tuvo que perdir disculpas un par de veces a mi persona, pero yo la mande a tomar por culo.

No le discutan, es una usuaria que lo que tiene de tonta, lo tiene de poder aqui en TA y te pueden madar a banear nada mas por ello.

[gixajo]

No acabo de ver lo que crítica, que no es lo suficientemente eslavo?

-Stearsolina;6837041-We don't like association with Balkans, it is taken as insult for Croats and it has deeply negative connotations similar like Moor for Spaniards.

And please don't try to imply what I want to see in my results, 50% Slavic is Montenegrin range, Croats on average are above 60% early Slavic.

You calculator is shit and annoys me, so next time leave Croats out of it.

Sorry, but I will go my own way, and to be a model made with modern references, it has enough coherence even compared with models of old references, although it is not possible to extrapolate an ancient population to a modern one completely.

And much more intellectually honest than saying "for a Croat to call him Balkan is like for a Spaniard to call him a Moor", which seems more like a disguised insult for being Spanish, than a valid argument to defend your position.

I understand that you have many quarrels and fights between you, but I am not from the Balkans.

And I have not done anything wrong, nor do I have anything against any Balkan nationality, even assuming that I might like some better than others.

Here is a comparation between my 4 original references and one Balkan ancient samples based model:

[Defcon2]

Sorry, but I will go my own way, and to be a model made with modern references, it has enough coherence even compared with models of old references, although it is not possible to extrapolate an ancient population to a modern one completely.

And much more intellectually honest than saying "for a Croat to call him Balkan is like for a Spaniard to call him a Moor", which seems more like a disguised insult for being Spanish, than a valid argument to defend your position.

I understand that you have many quarrels and fights between you, but I am not from the Balkans.

And I have not done anything wrong, nor do I have anything against any Balkan nationality, even assuming that I might like some better than others.

Here is a comparation between my 4 original references and one Balkan ancient samples based model:

No le gusta su ubicación geográfica por que patatas.