The origin of E-V13 is north West Africa

[Halgurd]

The oldest E-M78 we have are from North-West Africa, from Taforalt in modern day Morocco. These are:
E-M78 (15077-13908 ybp)
E-M78 (x4) (15077-13908 ybp)
E-M78 (15077-13908 ybp)

There are also lot of samples with E-M78 from the Gran Canaria dated 1410-750 ybp. I think north-west Africa seems to be the likely origin of E-M78. Lack of ancient samples of E-M78 from north east Africa, and the abundance of ancient E-M78 from north west Africa, makes me skeptical about the current theory of origin.
The oldest E-V13 we have is from north east Spain from the Avellaner cave (Cardium Pottery culture) -7000ybp

I’m not an expert but I think the current theories about E-V13 being born in west Asia or the Balkans is outdated. I think it might have originated in south west Europe around the Iberian peninsula, or perhaps in north west Africa, and it gradually migrated eastwards. I think it’s probable though E-M35 was somewhere around Eastern Africa.

https://www.google.com/maps/d/u/0/vi...6054679058&z=6

What does everyone else think?

[Luso]

While the very basal root of the branch of the HAPLOGROUP E is African, this particular subclade can be attributed to farmers-- at least that is what I think. I wouldn't be surprised if it originated in northwest Africa. There most have been some major migrations. Since the 7,000-year-old Neolithic farmer from northern Spain had E1b1b V13, he has been in Europe for quite a long time. I bet it spreads to forestry, but I don't know it happened earlier. This does not clarify that the high volume of E1b1b in central France is 10-15% and 15-20%. This explains, however, all the E1b1b in that stretch from Romania to Germany and southern Sweden and Norway. However, about 10% of South-Eastern Europe still does not belong to E1b1b V13. Its distribution seems quite similar to that of Linear potter culture and Rossen from our migration maps of Europe. But mainly because of the spread of the Germanic Italo Celtic R1b1a2a1a L11 and the spread of the Balto Slavic R1a1a1b1 Z283 which significantly changed the Y DNA in Eastern and Western Europe. Who knows what the percentages for each haplogroup might have been before that. And those Indo European groups may have modified the prominence of E1b1b, I2a, and G2a in some regions.

Y-DNA hg 'E' is a weird haplogroup! Maybe there's some correlation between this hg and the Mediterranean-admixture?

[Halgurd]

Loosdrecht et al. (2018) analysed genome-wide data from seven ancient individuals from the Iberomaurusian Grotte des Pigeons site near Taforalt in north-eastern Morocco. The fossils were directly dated to between 15,100 and 13,900 calibrated years before present. The scientists found that all males belonged to haplogroup E1b1b, common among Afroasiatic males. The male specimens with sufficient nuclear DNA preservation belonged to the paternal haplogroup E1b1b1a1 (M78), with one skeleton bearing the E1b1b1a1b1 parent lineage to E-V13

[catgeorge]

Its one of the oldest haplos in Europe - it is also likely that I + J came from Africa as well.

[Adamm]

Loosdrecht et al. (2018) analysed genome-wide data from seven ancient individuals from the Iberomaurusian Grotte des Pigeons site near Taforalt in north-eastern Morocco. The fossils were directly dated to between 15,100 and 13,900 calibrated years before present. The scientists found that all males belonged to haplogroup E1b1b, common among Afroasiatic males. The male specimens with sufficient nuclear DNA preservation belonged to the paternal haplogroup E1b1b1a1 (M78), with one skeleton bearing the E1b1b1a1b1 parent lineage to E-V13

E-V13 with Iberomaurusian origins is the most logical theory at the moment.

[Synapsid]

E-V13 with Iberomaurusian origins is the most logical theory at the moment.

As I said in the pevious taforalt thread, E came from ANA in Iberomasurian

[Halgurd]

The mtdna of the Taforalt skeletons was almost exclusively u6, except for 1 individual. Maybe this was the original mtdna paired with E-M78/E-V13?

[Joso]

I always knew it!
I could have done a bet.

[Synapsid]

The oldest E-M78 we have are from North-West Africa, from Taforalt in modern day Morocco. These are:
E-M78 (15077-13908 ybp)
E-M78 (x4) (15077-13908 ybp)
E-M78 (15077-13908 ybp)

There are also lot of samples with E-M78 from the Gran Canaria dated 1410-750 ybp. I think north-west Africa seems to be the likely origin of E-M78. Lack of ancient samples of E-M78 from north east Africa, and the abundance of ancient E-M78 from north west Africa, makes me skeptical about the current theory of origin.
The oldest E-V13 we have is from north east Spain from the Avellaner cave (Cardium Pottery culture) -7000ybp

I’m not an expert but I think the current theories about E-V13 being born in west Asia or the Balkans is outdated. I think it might have originated in south west Europe around the Iberian peninsula, or perhaps in north west Africa, and it gradually migrated eastwards. I think it’s probable though E-M35 was somewhere around Eastern Africa.

https://www.google.com/maps/d/u/0/vi...6054679058&z=6

What does everyone else think?

Natufians got E from Taforalt admixture, via the mashubians. Its was the dominated Y-DNA (with some Anatolian_N Y-DNA such as T and G on the side) until the Bronze, when Iran_N/Iran_Chl/CHG linages began to dominated the rest of the middle with J. I see Levent_N/PPNB carrying E males as the spreaders of Afro Asiatic languages

[Joso]

I always knew it!
I could have done a bet.

Ok maybe not exactly from "northwest africa" but i always had knew highly that it came from a very northern place in Africa