Putin congratulates Muslims of Russia on Eid al-Adha Islamic holiday

[Finnish Swede]

Bans didn't stop Venetians and Genoese from buying Christian slaves in Kaffa, largest slave market in Europe, as late as 16th century. Blond Slavic women were especially valuable on that market. Only destruction of Crimean Khanate and annexation of Crimea by Russian Empire had put an end on that practice.

Don't know about those, but if true that doesn't automatically mean that all Christians would have behaved same ways ... what comes to bans. Europeans behaves quite diferently even today what comes to common ''rules'' of EU.

As the slavery was allowed in Russia quite long.
* 1723 ban to slavery markets (plus all house slaves => house serfs)
* 1861 abolishes serfdom

1780 slavery abolished in the Crimean Khanate by Russians (after end of state Crimean Khanate 1441 - 1783).
Like you said most of slaves came from Russia, Poland, Lithuania etc. I wonder what has been influence for that ''operation'' as Russians ended their own slavery markets just 57 years earlier. And realeased their serdoms just 1861.

Most likely nobody has risen fingers up as seeing slavery caravans ending into the south many hundreds years.... to Crimean Khanate.

[Marmara]

Never happened. Don't make mistake - it's not common even now. It's some freaks brainwashed by new extremist religious propaganda adopting these barbaric practices.

Majority of Muslims in Russia, like Volga Tatars and Bashkirs, culturally much closer to Orthodox Russians than to Saudis. Living in same climate and natural environment is always far more important than religion.

Saudis don't practice FGM, it's not an Islamic practice, it's an old tradition which survived even after spread of Islam, those who used to pratice FGM still do, and claim it's an islamic practice, while those who never did FGM also never adopted it.

[Kamal900]

Saudis don't practice FGM, it's not an Islamic practice, it's an old tradition which survived even after spread of Islam, those who used to pratice FGM still do, and claim it's an islamic practice, while those who never did FGM also never adopted it.

Indeed. Such practice is also practiced in countries like Southern Sudan and etc that are not Muslim countries.

[Mingle]

Saudis don't practice FGM, it's not an Islamic practice, it's an old tradition which survived even after spread of Islam, those who used to pratice FGM still do, and claim it's an islamic practice, while those who never did FGM also never adopted it.

FGM is mandatory in the Shafi school of Sunni Islam while other Sunni schools recommend it (though its not mandatory). Despite other Sunni schools (Hanafi, Hanbali, Maliki) recommending it, its not common among them. I believe Shias also recommend it but I've never heard of it associated with any Shia groups besides the Dawoodi Bohras.

FGM was introduced to Indonesia/Malaysia with Islam (they're Shafis). Before that, they didn't practice it AFAIK.

[Rumata]

AFAIK FGM is practiced to surpress female sexual drive. Logically, those who use it must be ones most obsessed with this idea and also ignorant and savage enough.

[itilvolga]

FGM is mandatory in the Shafi school of Sunni Islam while other Sunni schools recommend it (though its not mandatory). Despite other Sunni schools (Hanafi, Hanbali, Maliki) recommending it, its not common among them. I believe Shias also recommend it but I've never heard of it associated with any Shia groups besides the Dawoodi Bohras.

FGM was introduced to Indonesia/Malaysia with Islam (they're Shafis). Before that, they didn't practice it AFAIK.

There are many Shafi’is in Turkey and they don’t have such a practice here. Are you sure?

[Mingle]

There are many Shafi’is in Turkey and they don’t have such a practice here. Are you sure?

Yes, fully sure. The Shafis in Turkey are pretty much all Kurds and the practice is well known among them, especially in Iraq. Maybe those in Turkey decided to go against their school and ignore that part, but it is a thing most Shafis do. Multiple Turks used to post about Kurds doing FGM in the past on TA to show how backwards they were.

In Indonesia, around half do it if I'm not mistaken. So many don't do it despite it being mandatory. Guess if there are Muslims that drink alcohol, there can exist Shafis that don't do FGM.

I looked it up on Wikipedia and they claimed that Kurds in southern Turkey do it but their sources were talking about Iraqi Kurds and said evidence of the practice in Turkey is scarce. So FGM among Shafis in Turkey probably doesn't happen. Maybe because Turkey may have outlawed it or the Kurds there are less religious compared to elsewhere.

This is what it says in the Shafi manual on the topic:

"Circumcision is obligatory (O: for both men and women. For men it consists of removing the prepuce from the penis, and for women, removing the prepuce (Ar. bazr) of the clitoris (n: not the clitoris itself, as some mistakenly assert). (A: Hanbalis hold that circumcision of women is not obligatory but sunna, while Hanafis consider it a mere courtesy to the husband.)"

[itilvolga]

Yes, fully sure. The Shafis in Turkey are pretty much all Kurds and the practice is well known among them, especially in Iraq. Maybe those in Turkey decided to go against their school and ignore that part, but it is a thing most Shafis do. Multiple Turks used to post about Kurds doing FGM in the past on TA to show how backwards they were.

In Indonesia, around half do it if I'm not mistaken. So many don't do it despite it being mandatory. Guess if there are Muslims that drink alcohol, there can exist Shafis that don't do FGM.

I looked it up on Wikipedia and they claimed that Kurds in southern Turkey do it but their sources were talking about Iraqi Kurds and said evidence of the practice in Turkey is scarce. So FGM among Shafis in Turkey probably doesn't happen. Maybe because Turkey may have outlawed it or the Kurds there are less religious compared to elsewhere.

This is what it says in the Shafi manual on the topic:

Well, in Turkey most of people don’t even know what FGM is and I have never heard Kurds were doing it in the past. Thanks for sharing the quote though, I would like to search about it.

[KirillMazur]

Havent been on this forum for ages.
Seems FS wasnt losing time and wrote 8k posts, i bet most of them about how she doesn't care about Russia or how she is not inerested in any russian stuff. Admirable dedication.

From An Ordinary Miracle (1978 film).

"I chased you for three days to say how indifferent you are to me."

[Root]

So FGM is not part of Kavkaz culture? That good to hear. I think the soviets would have banned it if was true

fortunately, FGM is not part of Kavkaz culture, it never was and never will be as local indigenous peoples are against the foreign non-Kavkaz cultural invasion