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Thread: Good or Bad? Norman invasion of 1066

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    Default Good or Bad? Norman invasion of 1066

    Do you think the Norman invasion of 1066 is a change for the positive, or was it negative?
    Personally I wish the Normans never invaded, England today would be more Scando-like in culture and language. There was no feudalism in England, all were yoeman farmers and freemen. The Normans reduced the Englishman to a semi slave. I prefer Anglo Saxon art to high medieval Plantagenet art, esp. the manuscript illuminations.

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    good

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyp Snow View Post
    good
    In what way?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Synapsid View Post
    In what way?
    it spared them of a future full of irrelevance

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyp Snow View Post
    it spared them of a future full of irrelevance
    I beg to differ. Anglo Saxon Britain was relevant in Dark age Europe's development. The court of Charlemagne was full of British scholar such as Alcuin. The Anglo Saxons help spread literacy to what is now Netherlands and Northern Germany, by Saint Boniface, who helped establish the foudations of the German church of the future HRE. Anglo monks help preserve classical knowledge in Continental academies in Aachen, and in the British Isles in places like lindisfarne and Iona.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Synapsid View Post
    Do you think the Norman invasion of 1066 is a change for the positive, or was it negative?
    Personally I wish the Normans never invaded, England today would be more Scando-like in culture and language. There was no feudalism in England, all were yoeman farmers and freemen. The Normans reduced the Englishman to a semi slave. I prefer Anglo Saxon art to high medieval Plantagenet art, esp. the manuscript illuminations.
    Good, because without the Norman invasion Britain would have just been more like a rural farming backwater with petty kings ruling over a possibly fragmented kingdom(s) e.g. wessex, essex, sussex, Northumbria etc.. and there would have been no British empire and no colonies and we would not be speaking olde English or middle English or modern English right now but some other language such as German or French or Spanish. Also, Scandinavia had almost like zero impact on history unlike Britain and France too when you think about it. Saying you want England to be more Scandinavian-like is saying you want Britain to be irrelevant but with a high standard of living.

    BTW, you may not want to trust what I just said because apparently I'm Norman my last name is Burke or DeBurgh and I get these results from G25 :

    Basically, Norse with some Latin :

    Target: Kevin_scaled
    Distance: 2.3584% / 0.02358361
    79.6 Norwegian
    16.4 Spanish_Soria

    2.0 Kubachinian

    ...

    [everything under 1% cut out here from the results]

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    Very nice

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    Quote Originally Posted by JamesBond007 View Post
    Good, because without the Norman invasion Britain would have just been more like a rural farming backwater with petty kings ruling over a possibly fragmented kingdom(s) e.g. wessex, essex, sussex, Northumbria etc.. and there would have been no British empire and no colonies and we would not be speaking olde English or middle English or modern English right now but some other language such as German or French or Spanish. Also, Scandinavia had almost like zero impact on history unlike Britain and France too when you think about it. Saying you want England to be more Scandinavian-like is saying you want Britain to be irrelevant but with a high standard of living.

    BTW, you may not want to trust what I just said because apparently I'm Norman my last name is Burke or DeBurgh and I get these results from G25 :

    Basically, Norse with some Latin :

    Target: Kevin_scaled
    Distance: 2.3584% / 0.02358361
    79.6 Norwegian
    16.4 Spanish_Soria

    2.0 Kubachinian

    ...

    [everything under 1% cut out here from the results]
    But by that time England was unified, has been since King Alfred excluding the brief Danelaw intrusions that had been defeated. England was more unified than France at that time IMO, which is why Normans ruled with little interference from the king of West Francia

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    Quote Originally Posted by Synapsid View Post
    But by that time England was unified, has been since King Alfred excluding the brief Danelaw intrusions that had been defeated. England was more unified than France at that time IMO, which is why Normans ruled with little interference from the king of West Francia
    I don't really want to argue about minutiae. Without outside pressure from the Danes and the Norman French -- England could have devolved back into individual petty kingdoms or could have adopted a novel catabolism and anabolism approach to government but I doubt England would have been as historically significant a nation without the Norman invasion but it's impossible to prove the thesis because we can't go back in history and change it so our arguments are likely to be largely conjecture.

    However, with all due respect the English are an intensely snobbish ethnic group so it seems almost schizophrenic for an Englishman to argue against the Norman invasion as the Norman invasion introduced hard core class divisions and even today there are important vestigial remnants of it in England culturally speaking.

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