View Poll Results: Portuguese speakers, do you say 'pais' or 'paish'?

Voters
6. You may not vote on this poll
  • 'Pais'

    1 16.67%
  • 'Paish'

    5 83.33%
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 19

Thread: Native Portuguese-speakers: do you pronounce the 's' in 'pais' like an 's' or a 'sh'?

  1. #1
    Veteran Member Apricity Funding Member
    "Friend of Apricity"


    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Last Online
    Today @ 01:24 PM
    Ethnicity
    British and Colombian
    Country
    Wales
    Gender
    Posts
    73,707
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 26,039
    Given: 43,516

    2 Not allowed!

    Default Native Portuguese-speakers: do you pronounce the 's' in 'pais' like an 's' or a 'sh'?

    Let us discuss.

  2. #2
    Veteran Member Pedro Ruben's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 06:05 PM
    Location
    Northern Portugal
    Meta-Ethnicity
    Iberian
    Ethnicity
    Portuguese
    Ancestry
    Comarca d'Entre-Douro-e-Minho (Northern Portugal)
    Country
    Portugal
    Y-DNA
    R-P311
    mtDNA
    U5b1c
    Taxonomy
    Mediterranid
    Religion
    Catholic church
    Relationship Status
    Single
    Gender
    Posts
    1,641
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 5,540
    Given: 10,948

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    In my case it is intermediate between S and SH. But in the word festa it is clearly feSta and not feSHta. The SH marked for S is more usual in the south of Portugal. Although younger people across the country tend to pronounce SH
    Target: Pedro_scaled
    Distance: 0.6354% / 0.00635357
    54.2% Iberia
    21.6% Scotland
    12.4% North Africa (Tunisian Berber)
    8.6% Italia (Lazio)
    2.4% West Africa (Gambian)
    0.8% South America (Amerindian Caribe)

  3. #3
    Member Hawkguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Last Online
    01-12-2023 @ 11:19 PM
    Ethnicity
    Brazilian
    Country
    Brazil
    Gender
    Posts
    244
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 177
    Given: 105

    1 Not allowed!

    Default

    In Rio this is quite remarkable. Practically, all the words ending in "S", I end up pronouncing "SH".

  4. #4
    Companhia dos Leőes da Beira
    Apricity Funding Member
    "Friend of Apricity"

    Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Last Online
    @
    Meta-Ethnicity
    Romance
    Ethnicity
    Portuguese
    Country
    Portugal
    Y-DNA
    R1b-L21
    mtDNA
    H15
    Religion
    Cultural Christian
    Relationship Status
    Married
    Gender
    Posts
    18,360
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 24,022
    Given: 16,802

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    Every native Portuguese speaker says it with it a slight "sh". This is the phonetic transcription, I had to learn it at the university and since you are from a faculty of letters I believe you had to as well: [pˈajʃ].
    YDNA: R1b-L21 > DF13 > S1051 > FGC17906 > FGC17907 > FGC17866


  5. #5
    Veteran Member Pedro Ruben's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 06:05 PM
    Location
    Northern Portugal
    Meta-Ethnicity
    Iberian
    Ethnicity
    Portuguese
    Ancestry
    Comarca d'Entre-Douro-e-Minho (Northern Portugal)
    Country
    Portugal
    Y-DNA
    R-P311
    mtDNA
    U5b1c
    Taxonomy
    Mediterranid
    Religion
    Catholic church
    Relationship Status
    Single
    Gender
    Posts
    1,641
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 5,540
    Given: 10,948

    1 Not allowed!

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas View Post
    Every native Portuguese speaker says it with it a slight "sh". This is the phonetic transcription, I had to learn it at the university and since you are from a faculty of letters I believe you had to as well: [pˈajʃ].
    This in standard Portuguese. In the north has several áreas that have sibilants S (I don't speak the Mirandese language, where S is sibilant and different from C and Ç)
    Target: Pedro_scaled
    Distance: 0.6354% / 0.00635357
    54.2% Iberia
    21.6% Scotland
    12.4% North Africa (Tunisian Berber)
    8.6% Italia (Lazio)
    2.4% West Africa (Gambian)
    0.8% South America (Amerindian Caribe)

  6. #6
    Companhia dos Leőes da Beira
    Apricity Funding Member
    "Friend of Apricity"

    Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Last Online
    @
    Meta-Ethnicity
    Romance
    Ethnicity
    Portuguese
    Country
    Portugal
    Y-DNA
    R1b-L21
    mtDNA
    H15
    Religion
    Cultural Christian
    Relationship Status
    Married
    Gender
    Posts
    18,360
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 24,022
    Given: 16,802

    1 Not allowed!

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro Ruben View Post
    This in standard Portuguese. In the north has several áreas that have sibilants S (I don't speak the Mirandese language, where S is sibilant and different from C and Ç)
    These two letters are used differently in our language and never at the end of a word. Whenever you have a word that ends with an "s" the sound it produces is ʃ ("sh"). Ademais, cais, ideais, mais, animais, liberais, etc. The letter "s" itself reproduces different sounds in our language depending on the syllable it is in but when it is in the last syllable as the last character it is always pronounced as "sh".
    YDNA: R1b-L21 > DF13 > S1051 > FGC17906 > FGC17907 > FGC17866


  7. #7
    Veteran Member Pedro Ruben's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 06:05 PM
    Location
    Northern Portugal
    Meta-Ethnicity
    Iberian
    Ethnicity
    Portuguese
    Ancestry
    Comarca d'Entre-Douro-e-Minho (Northern Portugal)
    Country
    Portugal
    Y-DNA
    R-P311
    mtDNA
    U5b1c
    Taxonomy
    Mediterranid
    Religion
    Catholic church
    Relationship Status
    Single
    Gender
    Posts
    1,641
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 5,540
    Given: 10,948

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas View Post
    These two letters are used differently in our language and never at the end of a word. Whenever you have a word that ends with an "s" the sound it produces is ʃ ("sh"). Ademais, cais, ideais, mais, animais, liberais, etc. The letter "s" itself reproduces different sounds in our language depending on the syllable it is in but when it is in the last syllable as the last character it is always pronounced as "sh".
    If we speak in standard European Portuguese you are right. But visit specific areas of Minho, Porto, Trás os Montes and Beiras and listen to people who even pronounce something similar at the end of the word "poiz", bonz, mauz etc ... Regional Portuguese is very rich in sounds.
    Target: Pedro_scaled
    Distance: 0.6354% / 0.00635357
    54.2% Iberia
    21.6% Scotland
    12.4% North Africa (Tunisian Berber)
    8.6% Italia (Lazio)
    2.4% West Africa (Gambian)
    0.8% South America (Amerindian Caribe)

  8. #8
    Companhia dos Leőes da Beira
    Apricity Funding Member
    "Friend of Apricity"

    Brás Garcia de Mascarenhas's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Last Online
    @
    Meta-Ethnicity
    Romance
    Ethnicity
    Portuguese
    Country
    Portugal
    Y-DNA
    R1b-L21
    mtDNA
    H15
    Religion
    Cultural Christian
    Relationship Status
    Married
    Gender
    Posts
    18,360
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 24,022
    Given: 16,802

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro Ruben View Post
    If we speak in standard European Portuguese you are right. But visit specific areas of Minho, Porto, Trás os Montes and Beiras and listen to people who even pronounce something similar at the end of the word "poiz", bonz, mauz etc ... Regional Portuguese is very rich in sounds.
    Never noticed it to be honest. I am reading out loud the words you said and they all sound like "sh" at the end to me. If I try to read to read them with a "z" and the end...well, I did it and my wife looked at me and asked "entăo, 'tá-te a dar alguma coisa?"
    YDNA: R1b-L21 > DF13 > S1051 > FGC17906 > FGC17907 > FGC17866


  9. #9
    Member Hawkguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Last Online
    01-12-2023 @ 11:19 PM
    Ethnicity
    Brazilian
    Country
    Brazil
    Gender
    Posts
    244
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 177
    Given: 105

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    In addition, some places in Brazil there is no "SH" sound, for example Minas Gerais and Săo Paulo. The Italian and Native influence formed the language of these regions, especially in Săo Paulo. The South with German, Italian immigrants. And castellano's influence on Brazilian states that are neighbors of hispanic countries.

  10. #10
    Alma portuguesa Damiăo de Góis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Last Online
    03-23-2024 @ 09:55 PM
    Meta-Ethnicity
    Romance
    Ethnicity
    Portuguese
    Country
    Portugal
    Y-DNA
    R1b-DF27
    mtDNA
    J1c1
    Gender
    Posts
    22,316
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 13,742
    Given: 3,217

    2 Not allowed!

    Default

    I pronounce pais (parents) with a sort of SH sound like most if not all portuguese do as Brás said. However like Pedro Ruben is saying some northern people pronouce it differently like the first old man in the video (the way he says "balőes") or the last guy on the video (the way he says "dois"). However not all speak like that in the north:


Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 30
    Last Post: 07-14-2023, 07:55 PM
  2. Replies: 18
    Last Post: 02-28-2021, 02:33 PM
  3. Replies: 52
    Last Post: 07-09-2020, 11:09 PM
  4. Replies: 14
    Last Post: 12-12-2019, 12:57 PM
  5. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 05-02-2009, 12:27 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •