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Thread: Do 'racially pure' Latinos really exist in substantial numbers? (Whether White, Black or Amerindian)

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    Default Do 'racially pure' Latinos really exist in substantial numbers? (Whether White, Black or Amerindian)

    After all, across the Continent it is not uncommon to find people with completely different skintones and facial features from one another even within the same family (including mine). Yet according to Kratz, White Latin Americans tend to be much more endogamous than Europeans and White Americans, which is highly questionable because:

    (1) The demographics, history and culture of Latin America viz-a-viz North America and Europe would make it nearly impossible to be so anyway. Even if it were really true that White Latin Americans are very ethnocentric - and for some it is indeed true - the point is that living in countries where Whites (not to be confused with lighter-skinned Mestizos, Triracials and Mulattoes) are very much a minority would mean that they would thus have a pretty limited range of partners to choose from. As evidence, look at East Asians in the US and Brazil - Japan, Korea and China are some of the most ethnocentric nations on the planet, yet in those two aforementioned countries (and probably others too) they marry out at an extraordinarily high rate.

    (2) As I said, in any case many apparently 'White' Latin Americans have many darker-skinned people within their own families, which shows that there has been plenty of mixing throughout the centuries, however hidden or taboo it may have been at some point. In addition, many if not most Black and even Amerindian Latin Americans have some other racial admixture to them too.

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    Racially pure Amerindians are probably the least in numbers of the three as most seem to have some Euro or African mixture. I think racially pure White Latinos exist in the highest numbers in places like Uruguay, Southern Brasil or Argentina.

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    Blancos y Amerindios sí, hay todavía muchos elementos puros.

    Negros no, apenas en Colombia y números marginales en otros países del orden del 1-2% como Venezuela, Brasil, Perú o Cuba. De hecho los negros de países como República Dominicana o Panamá son en su mayoría "importaciones" de Haití o del Caribe inglés, los cuales no son latinos en sentido estricto.

    Kratz tiene razón, los blancos (los de verdad) latinoamericanos son muy endógamos en la mayoría de Latinoamérica, a lo sumo emparejan con castizos. Sí hay más mestizaje donde la clase media y baja blanca todavía es abundante como en Argentina, Uruguay o Brasil, pero en cuanto menguen por mestizaje o menores tasas de natalidad que los ya mezclados, entre las clases altas blancas restantes el mestizaje quedará reducido a una mínima expresión anecdótica como sucede en el resto de Latinoamérica. Kratz además vive en Perú, donde este fenómeno es muy marcado y evidente. De hecho las clases medio-altas o altas de origen mezclado tienden a casarse más con extranjeros (norteamericanos o europeos) que con blancos del propio país, salvo las excepciones de Brasil y Argentina de nuevo.

    Tu familia precisamente es ejemplo de lo que dice Kratz, casarse con europeos para perpetuar la europeidad y el estatus de la familia, incluso para mejorarlo, simplemente tu existencia le da la razón.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maguzanci View Post
    Racially pure Amerindians are probably the least in numbers of the three as most seem to have some Euro or African mixture. I think racially pure White Latinos exist in the highest numbers in places like Uruguay, Southern Brasil or Argentina.
    While needless to say White Latinos whose parents or grandparents came from Europe are going to be fully White, the point is I am not sure the same is true for 'colonial' Whites who trace their ancestors back to the Independence era or even earlier - most of them would have at least a little Amerindian or Black admixture.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Duffmannn View Post
    Blancos y Amerindios sí, hay todavía muchos elementos puros.

    Negros no, apenas en Colombia y números marginales en otros países del orden del 1-2% como Venezuela, Brasil, Perú o Cuba. De hecho los negros de países como República Dominicana o Panamá son en su mayoría "importaciones" de Haití o del Caribe inglés, los cuales no son latinos en sentido estricto.

    Kratz tiene razón, los blancos (los de verdad) latinoamericanos son muy endógamos en la mayoría de Latinoamérica, a lo sumo emparejan con castizos. Sí hay más mestizaje donde la clase media y baja blanca todavía es abundante como en Argentina, Uruguay o Brasil, pero en cuanto menguen por mestizaje o menores tasas de natalidad que los ya mezclados, entre las clases altas blancas restantes el mestizaje quedará reducido a una mínima expresión anecdótica como sucede en el resto de Latinoamérica. Kratz además vive en Perú, donde este fenómeno es muy marcado y evidente. De hecho las clases medio-altas o altas de origen mezclado tienden a casarse más con extranjeros (norteamericanos o europeos) que con blancos del propio país, salvo las excepciones de Brasil y Argentina de nuevo.

    Tu familia precisamente es ejemplo de lo que dice Kratz, casarse con europeos para perpetuar la europeidad y el estatus de la familia, incluso para mejorarlo, simplemente tu existencia le da la razón.
    Ironically, my mother is one of the very few in her family to have married a foreigner (aside from a cousin living in Spain who married a Spaniard, I cannot think of anyone else who has), and it certainly wasn't for reasons of status or 'whitening' or any nonsense like that. It is a big extended family, mind you. What's more, while it is true that none of my relatives or their partners look Black, at the same time we have the full range from White to Indo-Mestizo among both (and believe it or not, some of my darkest-skinned relatives are also some of my wealthiest). And even the fact there are no Black-looking people in the family is mostly to do with the fact that they live mainly in Bogota and Boyaca, neither of which have large Black populations. (Many European cities have far more Black people than both, and I say that with not a hint of irony or jest).

    Once again, while I don't deny Latin America's racial divides, I still think both you and Kratz do exaggerate them and lack any nuance or balance over the issue. The fact is that most Latin Americans (except MAYBE in Argentina or Uruguay, though even there I have my doubts) are mixed-race, which means that you see a range of combinations, facial traits and colours within the same families and friendship circles, since genetics work in very unpredictable ways. In any case, the real issue (which is only very partially correlated to race itself) in the region is socioeconomic inequality - there are deeply impoverished peasants with blonde hair and blue eyes, and more than a few prosperous dark-skinned people.

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    They must be a tiny minority except isolated indigenous tribes in the Amazon.

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    Hay puros de los 3 bandos, y si mantienes un margen de >90% de pureza, pues incrementaria un poco mas. He visto amerindios puros en Venezuela, negros puros los hay en Caracas, muchos venidos de Colombia o Trinidad y Tobago, y blancos puros los hay, mi familia son ejemplo de ello.

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    En Panamá si hay algunos blancos, indígenas y negros puros. Pero como dijo Duffmannn en el caso de los negros son anglocaribeños. El negro colonial suele ser Griffe, zambo o Triracial oscuro. Y los mulatos coloniales son Triraciales Mulatoides como yo
    En el caso de los indígenas en las comarcas la mayoría son puros pero hay algunos Indomestizos en ellas
    Y los blancos son de clase alta y algunos inmigrantes Venezolanos, americanos y europeos. Aunque la clase alta y media alta tiene algunos castizos y Triraciales tirando a Cuarterones
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    Quote Originally Posted by axel.aleman View Post
    En Panamá si hay algunos blancos, indígenas y negros puros. Pero como dijo Duffmannn en el caso de los negros son anglocaribeños. El negro colonial suele ser Griffe, zambo o Triracial oscuro. Y los mulatos coloniales son Triraciales Mulatoides como yo
    En el caso de los indígenas en las comarcas la mayoría son puros pero hay algunos Indomestizos en ellas
    Y los blancos son de clase alta y algunos inmigrantes Venezolanos, americanos y europeos. Aunque la clase alta y media alta tiene algunos castizos y Triraciales tirando a Cuarterones
    Exactly proving my point - most Blacks in Panama are in fact dark Mulattoes and Triracials, while many if not most Whites are recent immigrants, as opposed to the colonial 'Whites' who in many cases are in fact light-skinned Mestizos and Triracials.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocinante View Post
    Hay puros de los 3 bandos, y si mantienes un margen de >90% de pureza, pues incrementaria un poco mas. He visto amerindios puros en Venezuela, negros puros los hay en Caracas, muchos venidos de Colombia o Trinidad y Tobago, y blancos puros los hay, mi familia son ejemplo de ello.
    I bet if you combined all pure Whites, Blacks and Amerindians together they'd be no more than 10% of Venezuela's population. (Colombia even less I'd say, since it didn't have anything like the post-war immigration from Europe that Venezuela had).

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