why is western Balkans more Slavic than eastern Balkans?

[ixulescu]

Comparing the averages on updated K13 Vahaduo. When I say Romania I mean weighted average of all regions.
Romanians are closest to Montenegrins and vice versa, very similar genetically.

PS Montenegro has real Romance Vlach tribes deep into medieval and possibly until later.

That's because sampling is not done right. Montenegro is similar to Wallachia, not Romania. Most Romanian samples are from Wallachia, but Wallachia is the least populated region of Romania (compared to the other 2 major provinces).

[Jana]

That's because sampling is not done right. Montenegro is similar to Wallachia, not Romania. Most Romanian samples are from Wallachia, but Wallachia is the least populated region of Romania (compared to the other 2 major provinces).

No, it's not. Montenegro is more Slavic and northern shifted than Wallachia that is closest to Bulgaria.
Most similar region of Romania to Montenegro is Transylvania.

Also when I say average is weighted, it means % of population of each region are taken into account. Neither are most samples from Wallachia. Romania has gigantic sample size thanks to Ion and so far most smaples have been from historical Moldova as far as I see. Irrelevant in any case, weighted average makes sure every region is represented according to it's population in total make up of the country.

Croatian, Serbian and Hungarian averages are weighted and I'd guess Romanian too as Ion is very detail oriented.

[Roy]

No, it's not. Montenegro is more Slavic and northern shifted than Wallachia that is closest to Bulgaria.
Most similar region of Romania to Montenegro is Transylvania.

Also when I say average is weighted, it means % of population of each region are taken into account. Neither are most samples from Wallachia. Romania has gigantic sample size thanks to Ion and so far most smaples have been from historical Moldova as far as I see. Irrelevant in any case, weighted average makes sure every region is represented according to it's population in total make up of the country.

Croatian, Serbian and Hungarian averages are weighted and I'd guess Romanian too as Ion is very detail oriented.

Is such weighted data present for Poland? I can't find it anywhere.

[ixulescu]

No, it's not. Montenegro is more Slavic and northern shifted than Wallachia that is closest to Bulgaria.
Most similar region of Romania to Montenegro is Transylvania.

Also when I say average is weighted, it means % of population of each region are taken into account. Neither are most samples from Wallachia. Romania has gigantic sample size thanks to Ion and so far most smaples have been from historical Moldova as far as I see. Irrelevant in any case, weighted average makes sure every region is represented according to it's population in total make up of the country.

Croatian, Serbian and Hungarian averages are weighted and I'd guess Romanian too as Ion is very detail oriented.

As far as I remember Ion had 500+ samples from Wallachia and about 350+ from Transylvania together with Moldova (the Romanian part). His sample set is Wallachian heavy, like all Romanian sample sets so far. A proper Romanian set for computing averages should have a 45% / 35% / 20% split among Transylvania / Moldova / Wallachia samples.

Even with this Wallachian bias, the Romanian samples span Serbia, Bosnia and Bulgaria and the average falls right between Serbia and Bulgaria (which are pretty close anyway). With proper sampling the Romanian average would fall closer to Serbian average.

[War Chef]

Western Balkan isn't very fertile at all and Slavic settlers there adopted Vlach/sheperding way of life.

Ummm what? The southern Pannonian plains have some of the best agricultural yields on earth. Vojvodina especially.

Wallachian plain for example is much more fertile.

Wallachian plain is OFF LIMITS.
Byzantine territory. Slavs beware or you'll be hacked to pieces by Justinian's elite Foederati.

+north of the Danube is raided by Nogai tribesman and assorted steppic filth. Not a good place to settle.

[Jana]

As far as I remember Ion had 500+ samples from Wallachia and about 350+ from Transylvania together with Moldova (the Romanian part). His sample set is Wallachian heavy, like all Romanian sample sets so far. A proper Romanian set for computing averages should have a 45% / 35% / 20% split among Transylvania / Moldova / Wallachia samples.

Even with this Wallachian bias, the Romanian samples span Serbia, Bosnia and Bulgaria and the average falls right between Serbia and Bulgaria (which are pretty close anyway). With proper sampling the Romanian average would fall closer to Serbian average.

No, it's not. Montenegro is closest to Transylvania, which means Transylvania is closest to Romanian overall average and that it's most likely weighted.

Distance to: Montenegrin

1.15477270 Romania_Transylvania
1.60567743 Romania_Oltenia
1.73427218 Romania_average
1.77617567 Romania_Moldavia_South
1.82980873 Bosniak_Sandzak
2.42014462 Romania_Banat
2.55589515 Romania_Wallachia
2.58418266 Romania_Crisana
3.00828855 Bulgaria_Southwestern
3.15732482 Moldova_South
3.17811265 Bulgaria_Northwestern
3.19181766 Serb_Serbia_South&East
3.50455418 Serb_B&H_Herzegovina
3.63436377 Romania_Muntenia
3.67420740 Romania_Dobruja
4.07659171 Serb_Croatia_Dalmatia
4.09677922 Bulgaria_average
4.44165510 Serb_Serbia
4.44631308 Serb
4.46167009 MacedonianNorth
4.60428062 Serb
4.67138095 Bulgaria_Northcentral
4.78760901 Serb_Croatia_Lika
4.83541105 Serb_Serbia_West&Central
4.92123968 Serb_Serbia_Vojvodina

Romanian average falls between Serbia and Bulgaria? Yes, and Montenegrin does also.

[Jana]

Ummm what? The southern Pannonian plains have some of the best agricultural yields on earth. Vojvodina especially.

Ireelevant, Panonnia isn't western Balkans and Serbs didn't settle there but into dinaric alps.

[Jana]

Romanian average is obviously weighted and not Wallachian heavy at all. If it was, Romanians would be closest to Bulgarians but they aren't.
They are closest to Motenegrins who are closest to Transylvanians, who are kind of in between Moldovans and Wallachians.



Wallachian average is closest to Bulgarians and not Montenegrins at all:

Distance to: Romania_Wallachia

0.96591925 Bulgaria_Southwestern
1.16438825 Romania_Oltenia
1.16798973 Romania_Muntenia
1.30694300 Romania_Banat
1.44820579 Moldova_South
1.51307634 Romania_Dobruja
1.78980446 Bulgaria_average
1.86678869 Romania_average
2.05046336 Bulgaria_Northwestern
2.17453443 Bosniak_Sandzak
2.34738152 Bulgaria_Northcentral
2.55589515 Montenegrin
2.56489766 Romania_Transylvania
2.84177761 Bulgaria_Southcentral
3.00024999 MacedonianNorth
3.10119332 Romania_Moldavia_South
3.67209749 Bulgaria_Northeastern
4.26851262 Pomak_Nevrokopi
4.30619321 Serb_Serbia_South&East
4.49921104 Macedonian_NorthWest
4.58983660 Romania_Crisana
4.60319454 Macedonian_East
4.69250466 MACEDONIAN_AVERAGE
4.77854580 Serb_B&H_Herzegovina
4.86025719 Macedonian_Central

Don't spread nonsense further, thanks.

[War Chef]

Ireelevant, Panonnia isn't western Balkans and Serbs didn't settle there but into dinaric alps.

Then why Kosovars Albanians kicked them out of Dinaric Alps recently?
Slavs are a agricultural people. Even Croatia is 50% non-mountainous farm-land:



https://www.fginsight.com/news/news/...ve-water-76906

Mountains = shepherding = Vlachs

[Jana]

^^^^early Croatian state originated in dinaric zone. Same for Serb, Bosnian and Montenegrin state. Early Slovenian state originated in alpine zone.
SW Slavs living in dinaric zone and doing sheperding are more Slavic than eastern Balkanites from fertile plains.