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Thread: Are Bosnians the descendants of the Pechenegs?

  1. #31
    Veteran Member CommonSense's Avatar
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    Actually, I've seen many Turkish comments with similar remarks around the net, but only now I get that they're all drawn from the same Deretić-like theorists that obviously aren't anonimous in Turkey.

  2. #32
    Veteran Member Varda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaspias View Post
    No, they are not.

    The Medieval Turkic influence on Bosnians is mainly from the interactions with Hungarians. Surname Kotromanic indicates the Turkic origin derived from "Kodaman" which means "power holder" in modern-day Turkish, probably a nickname given to Prijezda by the Hungarian side. However, there were also Pechenek/Cuman raids seen in modern-day SE Serbia and Vojvodina. In this sense, the target population here should be Serbs, not Bosnians. Attempt to Turkify Bosnians just because they are Muslims is not a useful approach, because the key of Islamization lies on Bogomilism, not Turkic tribes.

    To turn back, the term Torlak also present in the Turkic thesaurus. In addition, a few Turkic haplogroups are present in Vojvodina and SE Serbia. What I'm pointing out that Bosniaks were an isolated group of old Bogomils and had nothing to do with Turkic people. On the other hand, some groups might melt out among Serbs, specifically Vojvodina Serbs and Shopi's who Bulgarians claim to be of Pechenek origin. But the further analysis that focuses on those groups should be carried out to come up with a conclusion, those are just little signals.

    Also, I should state that a good chunk of Pecheneks was distributed all over Anatolia with the purpose of assimilating and use as border guards against Seljuk raids, the other part was already assimilated in Thrace and Macedonia. So, what has been pointed above just indicates a group of Pechenegs were active in there, not all population.

    Finally, although plenty of "outlier" results can be seen in Eastern Balkans, one could safely say both autosomal and haplogroups of Bosniaks show no exotic shift.
    Serbs with haplogroup Q, from Serbian dna project.

    Antonijević Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Velika_Plana

    Bojović Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radoševo

    Vasilić Q-M378, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vranjak,_Modriča

    Dobrašinović Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gornje_Zaostro

    Došljak Q-BZ300, from here https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veliđe

    Đoković Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivanjica

    Đukić Q-BZ300, from here https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ravni_(Kolašin)

    Marković Q-L713, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jarkovac

    Nedić Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dubnica_(Sjenica)

    Petrović Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zaječar

    Spasojević Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dobri_Do,_Kuršumlija

    Stanković Q-BZ300, from here https://sh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gračanica_(Andrijevica)

    Stevanović Q-YP1600, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zagoni_(Bijeljina)

    Tresač Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ostra_(Čačak)

    Čađenović Q-BZ300, from here https://sh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brskut

    Šaranac Q-L713, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prokuplje

    Šoškić Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ulotina

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varda View Post
    Serbs with haplogroup Q, from Serbian dna project.

    Antonijević Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Velika_Plana

    Bojović Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radoševo

    Vasilić Q-M378, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vranjak,_Modriča

    Dobrašinović Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gornje_Zaostro

    Došljak Q-BZ300, from here https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veliđe

    Đoković Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivanjica

    Đukić Q-BZ300, from here https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ravni_(Kolašin)

    Marković Q-L713, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jarkovac

    Nedić Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dubnica_(Sjenica)

    Petrović Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zaječar

    Spasojević Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dobri_Do,_Kuršumlija

    Stanković Q-BZ300, from here https://sh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gračanica_(Andrijevica)

    Stevanović Q-YP1600, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zagoni_(Bijeljina)

    Tresač Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ostra_(Čačak)

    Čađenović Q-BZ300, from here https://sh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brskut

    Šaranac Q-L713, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prokuplje

    Šoškić Q-BZ300, from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ulotina
    In Poreklo,

    #103849 -> Ореовец/Македонски Брод
    #106234 -> Сремска Митровица
    #103655 -> Јарковац/Сечањ
    #105163 -> Суботица
    #104521 -> Прокупље

    105163 has the Turkmen clade, the rest has L713 which draws a hotspot in Vojvodina and Banat. I apparently miss the Oreovec though, it is interesting too.

  4. #34
    Veteran Member Varda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaspias View Post
    In Poreklo,

    #103849 -> Ореовец/Македонски Брод
    #106234 -> Сремска Митровица
    #103655 -> Јарковац/Сечањ
    #105163 -> Суботица
    #104521 -> Прокупље

    105163 has the Turkmen clade, the rest has L713 which draws a hotspot in Vojvodina and Banat. I apparently miss the Oreovec though, it is interesting too.
    Surname of guy from Суботица is Hromček, he is probably Hungarian or Slovak. Some goes for guy from Сремска Митровица, his surname is Žambok.
    Guy from Ореовец/Македонски Брод is Macedonian.

    Јарковац/Сечањ and Прокупље are Serbs.
    Last edited by Varda; 01-24-2021 at 11:45 AM.

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