Islam Debate Thread

[Graywolf]

How you describe genies dude?
And as a muslim most probablt u believe keramehs of evliyah's ( miracles of scholar-saints) why they stopped doing them after invention of camera?
And why your god lets Israel kill your brothers? Why doesnt he punish them?
How come a virgin gives birth a baby? IVF?

[Mejgusu]

Islam is a part of my culture, but not the only or a dominant element. Also i dont feel anything for every other Muslim, cultural, historical and ethnical commonalities are more important for me. Just an example: Am i sad about Uyghurs(or other non-Turkics like masacre of Bosniaks)? Yes. Do I care about Palestinians? No.

[Rethel]

First of All we don't worship any prophet including (Muhammed PBUH)

Yes, you do. You are even killing people for painting him. This is worshiping.
Duh! You have to even confess Mahomet (let he burn in hell)* in shahada equaly with allah (whatever it means).
Duh2! You are gloryfying him every time when you say his name, saying some spell.

*I will write it evey single time, if you will not stop write this spell right after his name.

I don't even know how did you come up with this.

You don't know shahada?

what piece of paper?

You belive that koran is eternal, whay makes him equal to God.
You treat it in some way which is similar to worshipping it.

piece of stone? you mean Kaaba? no , we don 't worship it either

Not at all. making a pilgrimage to this, circulating amoing it, kissing it, hoping that it will destroy your sins, and praying to it five times a day... especially if the same did arab pagans before Mahomet (let he burn in hell), and it was an "idol" of Allat or whomever, is not worshipping? Are you kidding me?

2- Yes , you worship a man called Jesus.

And how I worship him?

Jehovah's Witnesses and before them Arianism said he wan't a god , just a normal man , a prophet.

And here you are wrong.

Ceterum censeo Meccam delendam esse.

[Rethel]

I cant see ignorant thing here There are common things in among these religions

A car has wheels.
A bicycle has wheels.
Roller skates have wheels.

Conclusion?
They are the same.

This is your way of thinking.

[Rethel]

Hand of Mariam not Faitma..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamsa

The hamsa (Arabic: خمسة‎ khamsah) is a palm-shaped amulet (...)
The Hamsa is also variously known as the Hand of Fatima after the daughter of the [false] prophet Muhammad,

muslims used it as symbol to protect from envy and so on.

I am happy that you finally agreed on this.

Ceterum censeo Meccam esse delendam.

[itilvolga]

He wouldn't be Pan-Islamists if he lived today. He wasnt just pan-Islamist also he was Turanist btw . Pan-Islamism was the best doctrine at the time to use against British and espescially if your father in law was Caliph. He died in the sake of libeeration of Turks. He finished the tyrrany of Abdulhamid II and brought liberty to empire. Modernised the army brought Prussian model. He was as romantic to die in a far away geography for the sake of his race and he was the Commander in Chief of the army which 2 of my grandparents martyred and 3 of them became veteran. These are some reasons. And becoming muslim or pan-islamist doesnt lower his value on my eyes. I hope It will satisfy your curiosity.

On the contrary, Pan-Islamism was the most unsuccessful doctrine during 20th century, even though Brits were the enemy or your father-in-law was the Caliph. He wasn't a Turanist, he used the term "Turan" only to describe Central Asia, or the East of Iran, not to describe his ideology in his letters for an instance but mentioned uniting all Muslims under the same state several times. The Committee of Union and Progress had predominantly Pan-Turkist pashas but Enver wasn't one of them. He wasn't against, but it doesn't change his ideas. Otherwise you are right, he embraced Pan-Islamism more and more with the ultimate goal of moving against imperialist Brits. Thanks for replying. I thought you were confused when I saw that you considered yourself as atheist but made a speech of tengrism, and harshly criticized Islam while having Enver Pasha's portrait in your avatar. I still do though, but it doesn't matter.

[Rethel]

It's not Satanic nor we worship Kaaba , again it's a place of pilgrimage

An idol worshipped by pagan Arabs is not satanic... interesting... and kissing, pilgriming to it, bowing down towards it and praying five times a day is not worship... interesting also... just typical mahometan denial of reality...

BUT, if it is not satanic, go there and be repeating through megaphone circling around it:

"Jehovah is the only true God, Yahweh alone".
"The Bible it the true word of God".
"Yesua was teaching the truth".

I wonder, how many times you'll be able to do it...

Ceterum censeo Meccam delendam esse.

[Graywolf]

He couldnt embrace Pan-Turkism openly while he was the de-facto head of a multiracial Empire. (He had Christian Gagauz Turk ancestry i remind you btw.) Pan- Islamism was including %99 of Turks at the time so there wasnt a meaning of embracing Pan-Turkism at the time. You can read his letter to his uncle for liberating Baku. He congrulates his uncle for liberating a 'small port city of Mighty Turan Empire'. Which he named Pan-Islamic empire as Turan. This also gives us clues. And about being Atheist while embracing Tengri. I dont believe in any god but I am not a godless man without any morals or customs.I dont want to be classified with hippies and commies either. My purpose is believing in the truth (atheism) while preserving my culture and identity. God is in our minds. May TENGRI protect TURK and glorify them.

[itilvolga]

He couldnt embrace Pan-Turkism openly while he was head of a multiracial Empire. And Pan- Islamism was including %99 of Turks at the time so there wasnt a meaning of embracing Pan-Turkism at the time. You can read his letter to his uncle for liberating Baku. He congrulates his uncle for liberating a 'small port city of Mighty Turan Empire'. Which he named Pan-Islamic empire as Turan. This also gives us clues. And about being Atheist while embracing Tengri. I dont believe in any god but I am not a godless man without any morals or customs.I dont want to be classified with hippies and commies either. My purpose is believing in the truth (atheism) while preserving my culture and identity. God is in our minds. May TENGRI protect TURK and glorify them.

Bla bla bla for Enver, I like him and already know his ideas and role in the history. We just approach him differently.
But the thing that I don't get is, how do you say "May Tengri protect Turks and glorify them" and consider yourself an atheist at the same time. You give possibility to Tengri protecting ang glorifying Turks but also don't believe in God or a higher power or in a spiritual force of any kind since that's the description of being an atheist. Isn't it contradictory? I hope I don't create a negative atmosphere though, I am not an Islamist but a believer who criticize her own beliefs regularly due to being against to dogmaticalness and my purpose isn't judging you.

[Graywolf]

Bla bla bla for Enver, I like him and already know his ideas and role in the history. We just approach him differently.
But the thing that I don't get is, how do you say "May Tengri protect Turks and glorify them" and consider yourself an atheist at the same time. You give possibility to Tengri protecting ang glorifying Turks but also don't believe in God or a higher power or in a spiritual force of any kind since that's the description of being an atheist. Isn't it contradictory? I hope I don't create a negative atmosphere though, I am not an Islamist but a believer who criticize her own beliefs regularly due to being against to dogmaticalness and my purpose isn't judging you.

I noticed your concern to not offend me and you are curious i see. Im telling you again and I am surprised that we couldnt communicated yet. I am Atheist. Aint no GOD. My define of god is an Idea created by people carrying same blood to live together, to die for each, preserve their identity and culture. I want to make this commonsense continue. And there is no solid God to glorify nor to protect us except us (believers of Tengri ideology). I define myself as an Atheist adopted Tengriism Customs. I DONT BELIEVE ANY KIND OF CREATOR OR PROTECTOR OR A POWER.