What did the Proto-Indo europeans look like?

[x-class]

What did the Proto-Indo europeans look like?

[Logan]

?

http://www.kavehfarrokh.com/2010/06/22/


http://www.proto-germanic.com/2011/0...c-caspian.html

http://www.buildinghistory.org/dista...genetics.shtml

[Sforza]

What did the Proto-Indo europeans look like?

Europid with asiatic influences, since they were populating the Euro-asiatic steppes they would most probably look the part (something between Ukrainians and Scytho-Iranians).

Don't fret though, the genetic map of Europe was altered only slightly by the PIE people. On the other had the ethno-cultural background of the Europeans was taken by storm from those horse riding, iron wielding warrior tribe of the Holocene.

[Agrippa]

Those Scythians, Tocharians and related people are no Proto-Indo-Europeans, but Indo-European branches of a later time, with possible other influences.

The group which is clearly early Indo-European is the Corded Ware Culture, other candidates might be Kurgan/Ocre Grave culture (Kurgan theory) and possibly early South Eastern European, Central European and North Caucasian-steppe cultures.

Summing that up, the basic type of the early Indo-Europeans seem to have been somewhere between robust Mediterranid and Proto-Nordoid/Nordoid, with Proto-Nordoid becoming more dominant, especially in the Northern main branches (Corded), Cromagnoid influences were present too, especially further East, in the Kurgan group, but usually part Mediterranicised/part Nordicised and more progressive, so robust-Cromagnoid, broader, but at the same time strongly Europid, sharp-refined featured (midface-nose in particular) = "Kurganoid".
The Mediterranid tendencies are often hard to distinguish from Nordid, even harder from Proto-Nordoid strains, so if we don't know the pigmentation of the living, we can't say for sure quite often going after the skeletal remains.

The Corded Ware people showed relations to other people before them, like some variants among the TBK and Northern LBK in particular.

Basically, I would imagine the typical early Indo-European as a darker Nordoid/lighter Mediterranoid with possible Cromagnoid and very robust features, tall (for his/her time), (sinewy-) leptomorphic to lepto-mesomorphic, classic herder-warrior type, strong Europid, sharp features. That's what you get in practically ALL candidate cultures, especially if looking at the bigger picture and summing it up.

Light or dark hair, uncertain, but essentially similar to these Russians:

Corded Nordoid:


Somewhat darker Nordoid:


Robust Nordid:


Very robust, part Cromagnoid Nordid:


Darker and more robust Nordid, possible Cromagnoid and Dinaroid tendencies:


Part Cromagnoid Nordoid:


Robust Mediterranid/Atlanto-Pontid:


Classic facial features, at least on this picture:


Nordid, Iraniomorphic tendencies:


Nordoid:


Classic Nordid:


Robust Atlanto-Pontid with Cromagnoid tendencies:


Remember, the greatest uncertainty is actually the pigmentation, morphology wise, these Russians are great representatives for the general variation.

Dinaroid-Pamirid tendencies showed up later, in certain Sarmatian groups. In the earlier groups certain primitive tendencies appeared individually too, especially Mesognathy and broader noses. But those traits became soon a minority element.

Nordoid/Proto-Nordoid/robust Mediterranoid skulls from Corded Ware graves in Germany (after Heberer):

[x-class]

snip

Thank you very much very useful information there.

[x-class]

Europid with asiatic influences, since they were populating the Euro-asiatic steppes they would most probably look the part (something between Ukrainians and Scytho-Iranians).

Don't fret though, the genetic map of Europe was altered only slightly by the PIE people. On the other had the ethno-cultural background of the Europeans was taken by storm from those horse riding, iron wielding warrior tribe of the Holocene.

So you mean that there was mongoloid influences among them?

[Agrippa]

So you mean that there was mongoloid influences among them?

The Eastern branches in particular seem to have mixed up with some Mongoloid strains early on.

In a Scythian noble grave there was a Mongolid man with a fake beard, so he was accepted as one of them, but for being one of them, he had, at least at his burial, look like an Indo-Europeans, which, for the most time in the early period, seems to have meant a full beard.

So the Indo-European/Europid appearance was the standard, but some Mongoloids, more often females of course, were accepted in the contact zone, which resulted in the cultural-technological transfer, the formation of the Turkic groups and finally the downfall of the Eastern steppe Indo-Europeans, defeated by their former "students" and with the help of some refugees it seems, because in the high ranked graves of the Turkic groups, Indo-Europeans were found, which seem to have taught them the "Scythian ways" and used them to defend opponents probably - like it was so often the case in history, using foreign groups for political internal disputes, and in the process of doing so, threatening the whole own group with this treachery...

[bluesky]

are all the indo european people of europe the same people now? like the slavs and germans and the romance? They are right? because i was starting to wonder if so why do we look so diffrent?

[Lábaru]

are all the indo european people of europe the same people now? like the slavs and germans and the romance? They are right? because i was starting to wonder if so why do we look so diffrent?

Europeans are not Indo-europeans, racially speaking, only in part and that part varies in percentage.

[bluesky]

Europeans are not Indo-europeans, racially speaking, only in part and that part varies in percentage.

WHAT?! so you mean that we arent indo-european? what are we then? why do we speak indo-european languages? because we were invaded by the indo-europeans? NO WAY!