View Poll Results: Most multi-ethnic Celtic country?

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  • Wales

    5 45.45%
  • Scotland

    3 27.27%
  • Northern Ireland

    1 9.09%
  • Republic of Ireland

    2 18.18%
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Thread: Most multi-ethnic Celtic country?

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stahlbestie91 View Post
    I`d say Germany and Spain. If you count Galatians, too then surely Turkey.
    Spain is not a Celtic nation, our connection is an ancient one. Even the presumed "exotic" (let me put an emphasis on presumed) haplogroup E is found in Spain and peaks in Asturias, León and Galicia....the Celtic places. Galician today is definitely not a Celtic language (and this is why Galicians are not officially a member of the Celtic Nations recognized by the Celtic League), it is Romance. And genetically speaking, Galicians closest relatives today are the Portuguese & Leonese, and the people more related to the British Isles are the French and Belgian from Atlantic coast, although Iberians are related but in a secondary category. It is believed that there may have been an Atlantic connection and that perhaps the Celtic language was a form of lingua franca used up and down the Atlantic seaboard for trade. Although obviously what we do know is that Celtic speaking people were absolutely present in Galicia and the Iberian peninsula in general. Galicians and Asturians do embrace a "Celtic" identity in their regional culture (there are festivals like the Festival de Ortigueira, etc although how much of this is real and not just pastiche, mmmm), yes, because they are the (partial) descendants of Brythonic settlers from Brittany and Kernow and the inhabitants of Gallaecia (Galicia + Northern Portugal) were speakers of a Q-Celtic language similar to modern Goidelic languages. Also, the so called "Castro culture" is probably the prototype of the oldest celtic culture known, and there were Castros all over Western and Northern Spain, and there were many city names ended in "briga" and "dunum" that were typically Celtic, for example Segobriga (Segovia).

    Celtic languages were spoken on the peninsula up through the Roman occupation, after that Latin was slowly adopted by the local population. Although, at one point in history 3/4 of the Iberian peninsula was Celtic and the Mediterranean coast was Iberian, the Iberians were the first people the Romans met and that’s why they called it the Iberian Peninsula. At the end of the day Galicians are, like other Iberians, a mixture of various pre medieval groups, Celtiberians, Romans, Visigoths, and for better or worse the Moors (although in a more cultural than purely genetic sense obviously), etc...although I don't even really think Celtic is a thing, its just a linguistic/cultural/religious label. No one in Scotland or Ireland ever identified as "Celtic," and we don't have any evidence that the continental "Celts" ever identified that way either....the only written sources we have that discussed these peoples are written by Classical authors, and whether the term "Celtic" is valid even in that context (or was simply a general designation for people outside of Rome) is questionable. The use of the term is based off links to language groups, and the suggestion that perhaps Celtic people migrated. If we accept the hypothesis that there wasn't any migration, and that Celtic wasn't the language of a particular group and instead was used by a variety of different groups, then what solid reasons do we have for identifying Ireland, Scotland, the Isle of Man, Wales, Cornwall & Brittany with "Celtic?" Why would we link them....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tooting Carmen View Post
    I'd say Wales, mainly because of Cardiff and its long tradition of immigration in the Bay area in particular. (Newport and Swansea are also much less White than they used to be). In addition, over a quarter of Wales' population was born outside the country (mostly in England). On the other hand, of course Northern Ireland and to a lesser extent Scotland have more internal ethno-religious diversity, so I suppose it depends on what you see as more important.
    This is a tedious math question in disguise and I have no intention doing the math right now as I am not a morning person

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    Quote Originally Posted by IberianAlex View Post
    Spain is not a Celtic nation, our connection is an ancient one. Even the presumed "exotic" (let me put an emphasis on presumed) haplogroup E is found in Spain and peaks in Asturias, León and Galicia....the Celtic places. Galician today is definitely not a Celtic language (and this is why Galicians are not officially a member of the Celtic Nations recognized by the Celtic League), it is Romance. And genetically speaking, Galicians closest relatives today are the Portuguese & Leonese, and the people more related to the British Isles are the French and Belgian from Atlantic coast, although Iberians are related but in a secondary category. It is believed that there may have been an Atlantic connection and that perhaps the Celtic language was a form of lingua franca used up and down the Atlantic seaboard for trade. Although obviously what we do know is that Celtic speaking people were absolutely present in Galicia and the Iberian peninsula in general. Galicians and Asturians do embrace a "Celtic" identity in their regional culture (there are festivals like the Festival de Ortigueira, etc although how much of this is real and not just pastiche, mmmm), yes, because they are the (partial) descendants of Brythonic settlers from Brittany and Kernow and the inhabitants of Gallaecia (Galicia + Northern Portugal) were speakers of a Q-Celtic language similar to modern Goidelic languages. Also, the so called "Castro culture" is probably the prototype of the oldest celtic culture known, and there were Castros all over Western and Northern Spain, and there were many city names ended in "briga" and "dunum" that were typically Celtic, for example Segobriga (Segovia).

    Celtic languages were spoken on the peninsula up through the Roman occupation, after that Latin was slowly adopted by the local population. Although, at one point in history 3/4 of the Iberian peninsula was Celtic and the Mediterranean coast was Iberian, the Iberians were the first people the Romans met and that’s why they called it the Iberian Peninsula. At the end of the day Galicians are, like other Iberians, a mixture of various pre medieval groups, Celtiberians, Romans, Visigoths, and for better or worse the Moors (although in a more cultural than purely genetic sense obviously), etc...although I don't even really think Celtic is a thing, its just a linguistic/cultural/religious label. No one in Scotland or Ireland ever identified as "Celtic," and we don't have any evidence that the continental "Celts" ever identified that way either....the only written sources we have that discussed these peoples are written by Classical authors, and whether the term "Celtic" is valid even in that context (or was simply a general designation for people outside of Rome) is questionable. The use of the term is based off links to language groups, and the suggestion that perhaps Celtic people migrated. If we accept the hypothesis that there wasn't any migration, and that Celtic wasn't the language of a particular group and instead was used by a variety of different groups, then what solid reasons do we have for identifying Ireland, Scotland, the Isle of Man, Wales, Cornwall & Brittany with "Celtic?" Why would we link them....
    Todos somos haplogrupo E de corazon, querido amigo. Que se jodan los celtarras del norte.

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    Quote Originally Posted by IberianAlex View Post
    Spain is not a Celtic nation, our connection is an ancient one. Even the presumed "exotic" (let me put an emphasis on presumed) haplogroup E is found in Spain and peaks in Asturias, León and Galicia....the Celtic places.
    Yes, a part of the Celtic genes in those areas (or why not simply call it Iberian) is occupied by the North African

    Spoiler!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stahlbestie91 View Post
    I`d say Germany and Spain. If you count Galatians, too then surely Turkey.
    Are they Celtic? Some ancient Celtic ancestry but now they aren't Celtic. Tooting Carmen should have just said Insular Celtic countries to clarify. The reason for that moniker is due to languages spoken now or in the recent past. Of the modern "Celtic" countries they still have spoken Celtic languages (not Cornish) although they could become dead languages if things don't improve. I am interested in the discussion about what and who are Celts? It is a complex question as well if you think about it. If you look at genetics though all those populations are quite different so obviously there is a lot of other ancestry there other than Celtic. The big one as well is who are the Celts? Not enough ancient genomes at present to answer this.
    Last edited by Grace O'Malley; 05-18-2021 at 11:01 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mantuano View Post
    Todos somos haplogrupo E de corazon, querido amigo. Que se jodan los celtarras del norte.
    You are R1b Celtarra, bastard and traitor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Defcon2 View Post
    You are R1b Celtarra, bastard and traitor.
    I am actually more afro-iberian than you, i am 1/32 R1b Celtarra and 31/32 E1b Afro-Iberian.

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    Wales.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stahlbestie91 View Post
    I`d say Germany and Spain. If you count Galatians, too then surely Turkey.
    Neither Spain nor Germany are Celts. At least what is considered modern Celtic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Watersater79 View Post
    We will have to wait until the results of the 2021 Census, but seemingly over the last ten years, Scotland has seen greater migration than Wales or at least it's population has grown faster.....
    Over the last few years, Mohammed has topped the list as the most popular baby name in the Glasgow area.....
    Wales definitely has a longer history of Commonwealth migration, though
    As has been mentioned, the Yemeni community in Cardiff is pretty longstanding
    I'm counting English as a separate ethnicity here, and Wales had 21% English born residents in the 2011 census (could be higher now) and 27% foreign born in total (surely higher now) not to mention all the people with English parents/grandparents in the border region. If you're just talking about non European immigrants then its a different question and I would probably say Scotland.

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