In which country is the link between race/ethnicity and social class stronger: USA or Australia?

[Tooting Carmen]

It seems to me your fundamental axiom or assumption/premise is incorrect. Comparing the USA to Australia or other countries such as England is apples in oranges in terms of social class. Also, you seem to be suggesting its cause is racism rather than average low IQ of blacks and to a lesser extent Hispanics-- the latter of which is not even a race.

For instance, I don't know much about the australian class system but in England the middle classes are only loosely linked to how much cash you have while in America the middle classes are defined by how much cash you have (not necessarily on your person think more abstractly), what kind of job you do and what kind of education you have.

In America you be a plumber or even complete bum but if talk about philosophy (the upper classes study useless stuff such as philosophy at colleges such as Harvard and Yale), wear certain kinds of clothes of certain kinds of fit, style, and fabric. You talk without double negatives and write with proper grammar and punctuation. Don't speak a lot. Call a Tuxedo a dinner jacket, and you are thin etc.. etc.. then they (the upper classes) will consider you more upper class than a middle class American who went to a state school and is a doctor (an MD rather than PHD).

In other words class is a complex phenomena that is idiosyncratic to each nation. Australian culture and American culture may be closer to each other than American and English culture but to assume they operate on the same social class system is mentally daft or stupid.

Aren't you contradicting yourself in the 2nd and 3rd paragraphs? After all, like you initially said, it is in England where class has as much if not more to do with education, speech and behaviour than money, whereas in the US it is mostly about money, yet you then say how a plumber who speaks well and talks about philosophy could be considered upper-class in the US!

[Creoda]

Aboriginals are grossly over-represented in Australian jails, to an extent that surpasses even African-Americans.

That is more of a reflection on them and their incompatibility with our society and laws. There is no way that the relationship between Abo's and Whites here is anywhere near as toxic as that between Whites and Blacks in America. Very few Whites here have ill-feeling towards Aborigines (most have genuine sympathy/pity) and that's in large part because of their relative docility. The crimes they're generally imprisoned for are petty, public drunkenness, or domestic violence. They aren't rioting, looting, raping/murdering (outsiders), drive-by shooting etc, and they aren't anywhere near as loud or political on average.

And for all of the US' own sins, I cannot think of a scandal quite on the same level as The Stolen Generation.

Even if you believe in that narrative, I'd have thought Slavery would be much worse. Whatever you want to say about the so-called Stolen Generation (which officially went on for the best part of a century, so not a generation), it was a lot more well-meaning than the slave trade.

Then there were those riots in Sydney a few years ago involving fights between Anglos and Lebanese.

So what. That was 16 years ago, nobody died and there was hardly any damage. US has racially charged riots most summers, and plenty of death and destruction. Paris seems to have black/Arab hordes rioting and burning every summer, and London looked like Planet of the Apes at times during the BLM riots last year.

While I agree that Australia's issues are a lot more hidden and subtle than the US', it doesn't mean they aren't there. (Don't get me wrong - I generally get on pretty well with Aussies, and tbh I usually prefer you guys over Americans).

You ought to.

[Tooting Carmen]

That is more of a reflection on them and their incompatibility with our society and laws. There is no way that the relationship between Abo's and Whites here is anywhere near as toxic as that between Whites and Blacks in America. Very few Whites here have ill-feeling towards Aborigines (most have genuine sympathy/pity) and that's in large part because of their relative docility. The crimes they're generally imprisoned for are petty, public drunkenness, or domestic violence. They aren't rioting, looting, raping/murdering (outsiders), drive-by shooting etc, and they aren't anywhere near as loud or political on average.

Point taken.

Even if you believe in that narrative, I'd have thought Slavery would be much worse. Whatever you want to say about the so-called Stolen Generation (which officially went on for the best part of a century, so not a generation), it was a lot more well-meaning than the slave trade.

Point taken, except that while slavery in the US ended by the first half of the 19th century, the practice of kidnapping and forcibly relocating Aboriginal children went on in some places as recently as the 1980's.

So what. That was 16 years ago, nobody died and there was hardly any damage. US has racially charged riots most summers, and plenty of death and destruction. Paris seems to have black/Arab hordes rioting and burning every summer, and London looked like Planet of the Apes at times during the BLM riots last year.

Point taken.

You ought to.

Yeah, I would consider migrating to Australia before the US, and not just because of the race issue either. I generally find you lot to be more fun and laid-back and simultaneously more intellectual than them.

[Tooting Carmen]

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