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Thread: To what extent do you agree with any of the following three statements?

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    Default To what extent do you agree with any of the following three statements?

    (1) "The problem with wealth distribution globally is not so much that the poor are too poor, but that the rich are too rich".

    (2) "The problem with race relations globally is not so much that Blacks are treated too poorly, but that Whites are treated too well and are held up on a pedestal".

    (3) "The problem with gender relations globally is not so much that women's sexuality is too restricted, but that men's sexuality is not restricted enough".

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    From my perspective, I don't agree with (3) at all and the other two only partially. I despise OWD and the desire by some people to 'whiten' their families and even their nations as a kind of end in itself. And yes, there is too much inequality both within and especially between countries, and people with the kinds of wealth and lifestyles as Richard Branson and Bill Gates, however much they like to dress it up with hipster language, are ultimately as wasteful and destructive as they are exploitative.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tooting Carmen View Post
    (1) "The problem with wealth distribution globally is not so much that the poor are too poor, but that the rich are too rich".

    (2) "The problem with race relations globally is not so much that Blacks are treated too poorly, but that Whites are treated too well and are held up on a pedestal".

    (3) "The problem with gender relations globally is not so much that women's sexuality is too restricted, but that men's sexuality is not restricted enough".
    (1) Agreed.

    (2) Joseph de Maistre put it marvelously when he said that the French constitution was made to rule Frenchmen, not Inuits or Hottentotes. Which also lead us to the problem of policing in the States, as in, there will be always be problems because the same regime to police and invigilate white people can't be the same as the one to do so with Hispanics and Blacks (which I agree with the WN's, require a "tougher love" approach, hence my longing for military rule here in Hispaniola, or at least the illustrated despotism that Joaquín Balaguer had).

    (3) My answer is that restricting men's sexuality too much can, and often, backfire in a really nasty way. Hence why I think prostitution will never be able to be eliminated, since it is the perfect remedy to prevent the losers in the mating game from falling through the cracks and become potential insurgents.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andullero View Post
    (1) Agreed.

    (2) Joseph de Maistre put it marvelously when he said that the French constitution was made to rule Frenchmen, not Innuits or Hottentotes. Which also lead us to the problem of policing in the States, as in, there will be always be problems because the same regime to police and invigilate white people can't be the same as the one to do so with Hispanics and Blacks (which I agree with the WN's, require a "tougher love" approach, hence my longing for military rule here in Hispaniola, or at least the illustrated despotism that Joaquín Balaguer had).

    (3) My answer is that restricting men's sexuality too much can, and often, backfire in a really nasty way. Hence why I think prostitution will never be able to be eliminated, since it is the perfect remedy to prevent the losers in the mating game from falling through the cracks and become potential insurgents.
    Aren't your answers to (2) and (1) at least in part contradictory? After all, most military regimes in Latin America and elsewhere come into power precisely to maintain the power and wealth of the rich and traditional elites. (Granted, you get the occasional Omar Torrijos or Juan Velasco, but they are a minority and I don't think their effects were that long-term. For that matter, Peron wasn't actually a military ruler as such when he was President of Argentina).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tooting Carmen View Post
    Aren't your answers to (2) and (1) at least in part contradictory? After all, most military regimes in Latin America and elsewhere come into power precisely to maintain the power and wealth of the rich and traditional elites. (Granted, you get the occasional Omar Torrijos or Juan Velasco, but they are a minority and I don't think their effects were that long-term. For that matter, Peron wasn't actually a military ruler as such when he was President of Argentina).
    Not all of them. Very few outside observers care to remark that Rafael Trujillo not only came from the heart of the populace, but also revenged himself on the old elite by curtailing their economic power and making new men of his own. The same applies even more to Francois Duvalier, who had the extra impetus of racial animus on top of the economic one in his war against the mulatto elite on that side of the island. He also routinely tolerated communist activity in order to blackmail Uncle Sam into not bothering him too much about the human.rights issue.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andullero View Post
    Not all of them. Very few outside observers care to remark that Rafael Trujillo not only came from the heart of the populace, but also revenged himself on the old elite by curtailing their economic power and making new men of his own. The same applies even more to Francois Duvalier, who had the extra impetus of racial animus on top of the economic one in his war against the mulatto elite on that side of the island. He also routinely tolerated communist activity in order to blackmail Uncle Sam into not bothering him too much about the human.rights issue.
    But did the policies of Trujillo and Duvalier lead to a real redistribution of wealth and improved access to public services, or did they merely substitute the old elites for their newly-created ones? (Ironically, the same was largely true in Communist nations too - the nomenklatura etc).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tooting Carmen View Post
    But did the policies of Trujillo and Duvalier lead to a real redistribution of wealth and improved access to public services, or did they merely substitute the old elites for their newly-created ones? (Ironically, the same was largely true in Communist nations too - the nomenklatura etc).
    In Trujillo's case, only partially, and mostly tied to the land issue (as in, under his rule the agrarian reform would begin, and would be later completed by Balaguer), while in Duvalier's case it was all about making room for blacks in the elite class, pretty much like the fathers of his country during the independence struggle (as in, never really wanting to overthrow slavery, just put themselves as masters in the place of the French).

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    I must add an adendum to (1), the problem with the rich it isnt so much their wealth, but the influence they exert on the political process of their countries in question, which usually end up retarding true institutional progress from being made.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andullero View Post
    mostly tied to the land issue (as in, under his rule the agrarian reform would begin, and would be later completed by Balaguer)
    I wonder what our ultra-rightist SilverKnight would have to say about that? He claims to adore Trujillo, but would he like such a socialist policy like that?

    as in, never really wanting to overthrow slavery, just put themselves as masters in the place of the French.
    What do you mean?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andullero View Post
    I must add an adendum to (1), the problem with the rich it isnt so much their wealth, but the influence they exert on the political process of their countries in question, which usually end up retarding true institutional progress from being made.
    It is both that are a problem (particularly from an environmental perspective).

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