Is North Slavic genetics considered boring compared to South Slavic

[Dirdepo]

As i read, core of this culture were Dacians, Sarmatians, Goths and other tribes who lived near the Black Sea. When i suggested that Southern Ukrainians have genetic admixture from Goths, Sarmatians, Scythians, our genetic experts said that they didn't left much traces in Ukraine and Southern Ukrainians are almost purely Slavic.

Right, you know that Romanians few centuries back were Catholic. So they will always be associated with Poland Commonwealth and Hungarian Empire whether they like or not, and not former Ottoman colonies or Russian colonies where Orthodoxy has its origins. Also to speak on this you have to understand former borders of states and people that have sometimes shifted between the borders and other events that promoted outside peoples to be assimilated within these borders.

You are correct regarding Sarmatian, Thracian, Gothic summary of Sântana de Mureș-Chernyakhov culture, I just have to make that other point also.

[Peterski]

Tomenable "This is another reason why the loss of Lviv was more painful to the Polish people than the loss of Lviv"

Dumb af ^ read that shit lmao

My mistake, I fixed it.

Lviv ... than ... Vilnius

[Insuperable]

Romans settled some East Mediterranean people.
Thats probably how I get mine 1.13% Red Sea component in K13.

Red Sea was most probably already present without these settlers.

[Varda]

Red Sea was most probably already present without these settlers.

Medieval sample Slavic_Viking_Russian_Gnezdovo_V272 score 3.37 Red Sea, and sample Slavic_Sungir6_Early_Medieval_Russian_I2a 0.53

[Jankec]

Yeah, I read somewhere that Lviv had Polish majority.

If we go by medieval claim, then capital of Serbian empire in 14th century use to be Skoplje, todays capital of N.Macedonia.
But we dont need anything from N. Macedonia.

Its silly that Lithuania got Vilnius, thanks to Soviets who brutally opressed poor Lithuanians. What an opression!

Skopje was part of medieval Serbian empire, but Serbs probably didn't live there, as well as they didn't live in parts of northern Greece and Albania.

[Varda]

Skopje was part of medieval Serbian empire, but Serbs probably didn't live there, as well as they didn't live in parts of northern Greece and Albania.

Skoplje was part of medieval Serbia from 1282. to 1392.

In Macedonia exist several toponyms related with Serbian name like Srbinovo, Srbjani, Srbica, Srpci etc. which means that Serbs were minority there. Because toponyms on some territory related with ethnic name is usually from some ethnicity which is in minority and want to emphasize own specificity and and prevent assimilation. Like Rusko Selo and Češko Selo in Serbian part of Banat. Rusko Selo was founded by Rusyn settlers from Zakarpattia in 18th century and Češko Selo by Czech settlers in 19th century. Both settled in region where they minority and named settlements with own ethnic name.
Interesting in western Macedonian in 18th and 19th century was relatively common male personal name Srbin. Because of that present day Macedonians have surname Srbinovski. Only in Macedonia existed male name Srbin which literally means Serb.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srbinovo

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srbjani

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srbica_(Kičevo)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srpci

[Crn Volk]

Skoplje was part of medieval Serbia from 1282. to 1392.

In Macedonia exist several toponyms related with Serbian name like Srbinovo, Srbjani, Srbica, Srpci etc. which means that Serbs were minority there. Because toponyms on some territory related with ethnic name is usually from some ethnicity which is in minority and want to emphasize own specificity and and prevent assimilation. Like Rusko Selo and Češko Selo in Serbian part of Banat. Rusko Selo was founded by Rusyn settlers from Zakarpattia in 18th century and Češko Selo by Czech settlers in 19th century. Both settled in region where they minority and named settlements with own ethnic name.
Interesting in western Macedonian in 18th and 19th century was relatively common male personal name Srbin. Because of that present day Macedonians have surname Srbinovski. Only in Macedonia existed male name Srbin which literally means Serb.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srbinovo

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srbjani

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srbica_(Kičevo)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srpci

There was Serb presence in Macedonia much earlier than that, however they did not remain

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unkn...trando_Imperio

Those 18th-19th century 'Serbs' were Serbianized locals rather than actual Serbs, as the propaganda war in Ottoman Macedonia was in full swing then and Serbs were quite successful.

There was also Serb colonisation post 1913



Most of this was however reversed post 1945

[Varda]

There was Serb presence in Macedonia much earlier than that, however they did not remain

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unkn...trando_Imperio

Those 18th-19th 'Serbs' were Serbianized locals rather than actual Serbs, as the propaganda war in Ottoman Macedonia was in full swing then and Serbs were quite successful.

There was also Serb colonisation post 1913

Serbian toponyms are most common in western Mscedonia, but in eastern also exist. For example former name of Brežani in Pirin Macedonia was Srbinovo https://bg.wikipedia.org/wiki/Брежани

[Vega7]

But these Belarusian-like samples are not the minority among Early Medieval West Slavs. I already counted 12 such samples. That's a lot. How many Early Medieval West Slavic samples do we have in total? Do not count for example VK samples from Gotland because many of them could be Balts. Count only samples that were undoubtedly Slavs.

For me the explanation is that genetically Belarusian-like Medieval West Slavs were those who were still unmixed, while other Medieval West Slavs were those who were already mixed with Celto-Germanic and other populations.

Today such Belarusian-like individuals no longer exist among West Slavs (or are very rare) because foreign admixtures have already spread quite evenly throughout the population, and also because of ongoing mixing during the Late Middle Ages onwards, until the 20th century.

The sample I saw posted was from Germany around 1000 AD. I don't think it's logical that a person from that region, albeit slavic speaking, would be reflective of the slavs of 500 years prior in what was probably Ukraine.

These discussions are always plagued by people with their own agendas. But you would have to find people from around 500-600 AD from a region that the slavs more likely originated in. Slavs likely immediately assimilated neighbouring people as soon as they left their homeland.

[Vega7]

Probably also part of Western Slavic homeland. In some anciant maps Veneds (Western Slavs) are placed to the North of Pripet river, but those maps again are not accurate. In modern maps they are placed to the south of Pripet.

I think this is the least conservative estimation of the original slavic homeland. Basically, the forested regions between the Dniepr, Dniestr, and Pripet rivers and stretching into southeastern Poland.



Some have it continuing further east and west. Although this I guess would have been a bit later after an initial expansion.




The most conservative would be something like this:

Purple = Baltic
Left brown (center of image) = Proto-Prague-Korchak. Corresponding to 3rd-4th century Northwestern Ukraine
Right brown = Kiev Culture. Corresponding to 5th century North Central Ukraine as well as bits of Belarus and Russia

This last image is based on I believe older archaeological findings and I am not sure if they just haven't excavated areas further south or why specifically it positions the slavic origins a bit further north than the 1st image and certain other theories.