"Altaic" people originate in modern-day East China - new groundbreaking study

[Chelubey]

I have no idea about any ethnonyms in Kazakhstan

Because iranian hydronyms are absent there. Very strange?

Majority rule here is mostly just based

If 60% of Kazakhstan's hydronyms were Iranian and 40% Turkic - would it mean that there were no Turkic people in Kazakhstan?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saka_language

I do not know why the Khotanese Iranian language is called Saka. The residents of Khotan called themselves "Khotanese", and called their language "Khotanese" - this is reflected in their writings. There are no Sakas in their writings. The Indian Saka probably spoke the language of the local people : one of the Indo-Aryan dialects.

[Dr_Maul]

If 60% of Kazakhstan's hydronyms were Iranian and 40% Turkic - would it mean that there were no Turkic people in Kazakhstan?

No but currently when it comes to these groups there is 30% Iranian and 70% unknown for the most part, or at most 5% non-Iranian others... that is why it is academic consensus. And I am not here to debate Sakas just giving an example

[Dr_Maul]

If 60% of Kazakhstan's hydronyms were Iranian and 40% Turkic - would it mean that there were no Turkic people in Kazakhstan?

No but currently when it comes to these groups there is 30% Iranian and 70% unknown for the most part, or at most 5% non-Iranian others... that is why it is academic consensus. And I am not here to debate Sakas just giving an example

[Deniz]

Chelubey What do you think about Klyesov s thoughts about Yamnaya?Can you explain it what is he saying?And Do you accept the other things?Especially last 3 4 minutes.

[Chelubey]

Chelubey What do you think about Klyesov s thoughts about Yamnaya?Can you explain it what is he saying?And Do you accept the other things?Especially last 3 4 minutes.

He says that R1b were not IE. I would not take his theories seriously. He is a good specialist, but a biased interpreter.

[Deniz]

He says that R1b were not IE. I would not take his theories seriously. He is a good specialist, but a biased interpreter.

Yeah ı m thinking same with you but he says yamna type r1b and their people never went to Europe he is right but his language theories a little bit extreme for now.What do you think their criticism about the Iranic theories?

[Chelubey]

Yeah ı m thinking same with you but he says yamna type r1b and their people never went to Europe he is right but his language theories a little bit extreme for now.What do you think their criticism about the Iranic theories?

He does not criticize the Iranian theory, but admits that some of the Scythians probably spoke Turkic language according to the subclades.

[Sterling Archer]

https://www.cambridge.org/core/journ...6904CA62168A15
Some observations on the transeurasian language family, from the perspective of the Farming/Language Dispersal Hypothesis:

Korea:

Jangsuk Kim and Jinho Park (Reference Kim and d Park2020) raise the question of whether Transeurasian languages initially spread into the Korean Peninsula with the millet-cultivating Chulmun Neolithic culture around 3500 BC, or with the rice-cultivating Mumun late Neolithic and Bronze Age culture about 1500 BC. Martine Robbeets (Reference Robbeets, Robbeets and Savelyev2017) has favoured a Chulmun genesis of Proto-Japano-Koreanic, with an arrival of the ancestral language in Korea c. 3500 BC, followed by a separation between the Koreanic and Japanic subgroups at about 2000 BC (as shown in Robbeets & Bouckaert, Reference Robbeets and Bouckaert2018: fig. 8). However, Kim and Park favour a much younger, Mumun, arrival of Japano-Koreanic languages because of the strong and sharp appearance of the Mumun culture, with rice, in the Korean archaeological record.

Turkic:

The later section in this article deals with Turkic expansion during the first millennium BC from a possible forest/steppe boundary homeland in eastern Mongolia. The Proto-Turkic vocabulary had terms for both domesticated crops (broomcorn millet, wheat and barley) and animals (horse, cattle and sheep). One might wonder why this section on Turkic is included in an article that is otherwise mostly about the Palaeolithic, but the reason seems to be that Proto-Turkic is claimed to have had connections with the northern Eurasian forests, like the Japanese Upper Palaeolithic. Clearly, it had an agricultural and pastoralist basis that renders it as a potential example of the Farming/Language Dispersal Hypothesis. As such, it demonstrates that the hypothesis need not always relate to the very first farmers to inhabit any particular geographical situation – food producing populations can migrate at any time if they have a growing population and little opposition.

Tungusic:

Two articles cover questions of Tungusic origins and ancestral genetics. Chuan-chao Wang and Martine Robbeets (Reference Wang and Robbeets2020) discuss the homeland of Proto-Tungusic, placing it in the Lake Khanka region of the lower Amur Valley in the Russian Far East. They regard the break-up of Proto-Tungusic as an Iron Age phenomenon, dating between 600 BC and AD 700, and associated with millet farming. The biological population itself, however, appears already to have been in the Amur region for at least 8,000 years, and this is established from ancient DNA analysis in an adjacent paper by Yinqiu Cui and many collaborators (Cui et al., Reference Cui, Zhang, Ma, Fan, Ning, Zhang and Robbeets2020). They use ancient DNA from a Neolithic site in Heilongjiang to suggest that the Amur people of the Zaisanovska archaeological culture around Lake Khanka (southern Primorye) were ancestral to modern Tungusic speakers, and that millet farming spread into Primorye from Hongshan cultural sources (3500–3000 BCE) in the West Liao Valley.

Japan:

This archaeology section in this article reinforces the widespread view that Jomon people were mainly hunter–gatherers who practised minor cultivation until rice and millets were introduced from the Mumun culture in Korea at about 900 BC. This introduction of agriculture commenced the Yayoi culture of Japanese late prehistory, and was also the putative context for the introduction of the ancestral Japonic language(s) into Japan, from Korea. The arrival of the Yayoi into Jomon Japan was thus a specific case of farming/language dispersal.

[Roy]

So they were not from Altai, such a shame.