Isn't white privilege based solely on what you look like?

[Chocolate_Hound]

So I've been hearing a lot of turmoil about "white-passing" individuals on being "invisible POC" and whatnot.

But isn't white privilege based solely on what you look like? I mean, haven't people been literally lynched and whatnot for their skin color? I can't imagine a "white-passing" person who's waltzed through life and achieved social success having the right to call themself a POC. If they've been treated better for their fair skin, to the hindrance of the others, then isn't that the definition of white privilege?

If these white-passing people walk abroad, virtually everyone will assume they're white. People will treat them better due to their fair skin. It doesn't matter where they're from. The vast majority of people aren't gonna scan over your genetics and interrogate your racial origin. To most of the world, you will be seen as white. I have known "white-passing" people who've been harassed in POC enclaves for their fair skin. People really overestimate the extent to which people give a shit where you're from.

I mean if you are asked to describe a white-passing person to an investigations department, would you not describe them as a white Caucasian? Does actual origin matter in these scenarios?

The more I think about it, the more that "white-passing" just seems like an excuse for racists to exclude clearly white individuals for socio-political reasons. There are a crap ton of white people living outside of Europe, supremacists just don't want to admit this, because it goes against their belief in a mythical white race. Social "perception" is no match against demographic fact. Own up to it.

If you have fair skin and Caucasoid features, you're WHITE, and you benefit from white privilege. PHENOTYPE reigns supreme in America. I can't help but chuckle when these jackasses act like their race is an opinion and try to lump themselves in with actual POC. It feels like cheating.

[Colonel Frank Grimes]

I can say with confidence that there is no White privilege. There is, however, victim privilege. Decades of associating Whiteness with evil and non-Whiteness with being moral and cool have led to many people not wanting to be White.

This is why so many White people have a fetish for claiming distant Native American ancestry. I remember on 23andme there were people upset their results didn't reveal native American ancestry. Anything that makes them less White (i.e. a victim) is a plus.

Even the whole George Floyd death reveals White privilege doesn't exist. There have been a number of incidents where police negligence and abuse led to the murder of White men and no one cared but when a drug addict who robbed a pregnant woman years ago with a gun dies it's all anyone can talk about when it clearly wasn't racially motivated. Police abuse only matters when you're a minority.

I'll also point out that 'attractiveness privilege' exists. Regardless of your race if you're attractive people will generally treat you better and that shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.

[Mortimer]

If you assume white privilege is real, then it is a degree, they are privileged compared to someone who cannot pass as white, but disadvantaged compared to someone whos origins are white as well. Because you are judged by your origins as well not only your looks, usually a 5 minute talk is enough to reveal who you are even if on first sight or just by look you dont look like that.

[Turul Karom]

So I've been hearing a lot of turmoil about "white-passing" individuals on being "invisible POC" and whatnot.

But isn't white privilege based solely on what you look like? I mean, haven't people been literally lynched and whatnot for their skin color? I can't imagine a "white-passing" person who's waltzed through life and achieved social success having the right to call themself a POC. If they've been treated better for their fair skin, to the hindrance of the others, then isn't that the definition of white privilege?

If these white-passing people walk abroad, virtually everyone will assume they're white. People will treat them better due to their fair skin. It doesn't matter where they're from. The vast majority of people aren't gonna scan over your genetics and interrogate your racial origin. To most of the world, you will be seen as white. I have known "white-passing" people who've been harassed in POC enclaves for their fair skin. People really overestimate the extent to which people give a shit where you're from.

I mean if you are asked to describe a white-passing person to an investigations department, would you not describe them as a white Caucasian? Does actual origin matter in these scenarios?

The more I think about it, the more that "white-passing" just seems like an excuse for racists to exclude clearly white individuals for socio-political reasons. There are a crap ton of white people living outside of Europe, supremacists just don't want to admit this, because it goes against their belief in a mythical white race. Social "perception" is no match against demographic fact. Own up to it.

If you have fair skin and Caucasoid features, you're WHITE, and you benefit from white privilege. PHENOTYPE reigns supreme in America. I can't help but chuckle when these jackasses act like their race is an opinion and try to lump themselves in with actual POC. It feels like cheating.

The United States vigilante mobs lynched Italians and Irish, too. You are wrong about the idea of what it even means to be "white" in this context. Any in-group eventually fights itself anyway without sustained outside pressure to ensure cohesion. It's part of the nature of humanity.

People who are so-called white passing are people who are indeed functionally white. This is something you are right about. However, the problems come when, in an all-white environment, if the white-passing kind have historical grudges against other whites. The classic example is Turks. You will be hard pressed for someone to call a Turk white if there's incentive to other them (despite the fact that some ethnic Turks look whiter than some Europeans). This is because for most of Western lore, Turks played the role of the antagonist (Crusades, Ottomans, etc.) Only recently post-WW1 and reform have they become "whiter" in the eyes of the world.

POC will never accept them as part of the Coalition of Color because they look too white. Hence, they exist in a limbo until society shifts for one reason or another. If anything, they would be easier accepted into white society than other society. The conflict comes where other whites rally around their shared national causes, but then the "other white" speaks up about theirs and it becomes historically awkward for them. This is present in many cases. If you want to see how whiteness of Turks fluctuated, look at the posters used during the Russo-Turkish wars (where Turks are shown almost as dark as Indians) vs how Turks are presented as allies and as full members of the Central Powers during WW1. Here are some Central Powers examples:

[Mortimer]

People who are so-called white passing are people who are indeed functionally white. This is something you are right about. However, the problems come when, in an all-white environment, if the white-passing kind have historical grudges against other whites. The classic example is Turks. You will be hard pressed for someone to call a Turk white if there's incentive to other them (despite the fact that some ethnic Turks look whiter than some Europeans). This is because for most of Western lore, Turks played the role of the antagonist (Crusades, Ottomans, etc.) Only recently post-WW1 and reform have they become "whiter" in the eyes of the world.

POC will never accept them as part of the Coalition of Color because they look too white. Hence, they exist in a limbo until society shifts for one reason or another.

Reminds me of Jews as well. But Im not even sure there is a coalition of colour, and who is in that coalition? I think Blacks do not like Asians for example, Mexicans do not like Blacks etc. Maybe it is a coalition lead by white liberals, not by non-whites.

[Turul Karom]

Reminds me of Jews as well. But Im not even sure there is a coalition of colour, and who is in that coalition? I think Blacks do not like Asians for example, Mexicans do not like Blacks etc. Maybe it is a coalition lead by white liberals, not by non-whites.

Coalition of Color is wishful thinking of internationalists/intersectionalists where they believe that by minimizing the conflicts that you mentioned and focusing on the majority population as the oppressor (typically whites), that they can eventually overcome them as a whole.

They're the same people who try to highlight any East Asian disobedience/failures/criminality in western nations in attempts to disprove model minority myths so that they feel more obliged to be a part of the defunct CoC. For Middle Easterners/Meds that are phenotypically dark enough to fit the bill with a Muslim-sounding name, they will pander to their religion to get them to join up. You are correct that this CoC concept is usually championed by white leftists.

[E1b1b]

Only a certain type of white people experience privilege and that’s rich white people. I don’t see how a white dude working next to a Mexican construction worker doing the same job and getting the same pay has any privilege. So ultimately there is only CLASS privilege

[bvnny]

Being white is like being fully-privileged, while being white-passing is just partially

Since most white-passing ppl are still seen as non-white for some groups most of the times, meaning that they still may feel "opressed" in a way (aside from the fact that some white-passing ppl end up facing identity crisis, as a result of being purely white-passing instead of white).

[Borealis]

Reality is that EVERYTHING is based on what you look like especially in the new world. So yes white passing folk can experience white privilege but also reverse racism.

[Mortimer]

Reality is that EVERYTHING is based on what you look like especially in the new world. So yes white passing folk can experience white privilege but also reverse racism.

They can experience racism too, not only reverse racism. But I agree they experience probably all of that.