Impaler's father results

**Impaler** · 01-22-2022, 03:51 PM

I think he is very West Asian admixed. His full Roma relative was high in West Asian. I saved some of his results from G25 calculators:

Modern Average Scaled:

Target: Father_scaled
Distance: 2.2664% / 0.02266417 | ADC: 0.25x RC
40.0 Roma_Bilbao
24.8 Gagauz
17.0 Azeri_Turkey
15.2 Russian_Smolensk
2.0 Roma_Barcelona
1.0 Papuan

K64 Supreme:

Target: Father_scaled
Distance: 2.4548% / 0.02454796
32.4 East_Slavic
14.0 Sardinian
13.8 Iran
13.8 South_Caucasus
11.2 South_India
9.8 North_Italy
3.8 West_Levant
1.2 Melanesian

World K134:

Target: Father_scaled
Distance: 2.5258% / 0.02525762
29.8 Polish-Ukrainian-Belarusian
22.0 Armenian-Assyrian
17.6 Basque
8.4 Chenchu-Relli
8.4 Crete-Kos
7.2 Trabzon-Laz
5.2 Gupta
1.0 Papuan-Kosipe-Koinanbe
0.2 Bulgarian-Romanian-Moldovan-Macedonian
0.2 Qiang-Tibetan

Regional Supreme:

Target: Father_scaled
Distance: 2.3585% / 0.02358516
30.0 Middle_East:Assyrian
26.2 Eastern_Europe:Russian_Smolensk
21.2 Southern_Europe:Spanish_Asturias
14.6 South_Asia:Uttar_Pradesh
3.8 Southern_Europe:Greek_Central_Macedonia
3.6 Southern_Europe:Italian_Bergamo
0.6 Middle_East:Turkish_Central

AncestryDNA Supreme:

Target: Father_scaled
Distance: 2.1640% / 0.02163956
28.6 Eastern_Europe_&_Russia
20.4 Italy
14.2 Turkey_&_the_Caucasus
13.4 Iran/Persia
12.0 Northern_&_Western_India
10.2 Sardinia
1.2 Melanesia

Gencove:

Target: Father_scaled
Distance: 2.1313% / 0.02131253
34.6 East_European
27.8 Anatolia_Caucasus_Iranian_Plateau
17.8 South_West_European
15.2 Central_Indian_subcontinent
3.2 Central_Asia
1.0 Océania
0.4 North_central_Asia

**Impaler** · 01-22-2022, 03:53 PM

YourDNAPortal:

Turkic K11:

Admix 4 Oracle:
Italian_North 25
Russians_C 25
Tajik_Ishkasim 25
Turkish_Adana 25

Admix 10% - min:
Cossacks_Kuban 20
Brahmin 10
Cypriot 10
Druze 10
English 10
Kryashen_Tatars 10
Kurd_SE 10
North_Ossetians 10
Sardinian 10

Kurdish K10:

Admix 4 Oracle:
Albanian 25
Norwegian 25
Pathan 25
Sicilian 25

Admix 10% - min:
Italian_North 30
Algerian 10
Burusho 10
French 10
Lezgin 10
Pathan 10
Romanian 10
Ukrainian 10

AncientNearEast13:

Admix 4 Oracle:
Balochi 25
Jewish_Libyan25
Lithuanian 25
Sicilian 25

Admix 10% - min:
Hungarian 20
Scottish 20
Bengali 10
Druze 10
Iran_ChL 10
Jewish_Moroccan 10
Jewish_Yemenite 10
Romanian 10

MDLP K27:

Admix 4 Oracle:
North_Italian 25
Roma 25
Turkmenian 25
Ukrainian 25

Admix 10% - min:
Mordovian 20
Bosnian 10
Cretan 10
Dharkar 10
Kabardinian 10
Romaniann 10
S1 Oetzi 10
Slovakian-Roma 10
West-Sicilian 10

**Leto** · 01-22-2022, 04:00 PM

K13

Impaler_father,18.46,16.26,12.76,17.83,19.82,1.08, 9.95,0,2.00,0,1.47,0.38,0

Target: Impaler_father
Distance: 1.9169% / 1.91688252 | ADC: 0.25x RC
36.0 Greek_Istanbul
33.7 Roma_Wallachia
16.1 Austrian_Burgenland
9.4 Pamiri_Tajikistan
4.8 Turkish_Deliorman

Obviously the Pamiris are only superficially similar to the Roma because of both South Asian and European admixture.

**Mr.G** · 01-22-2022, 04:09 PM

Really awesome to finally unravel the mystery of your results.

Here is a quick model I made. I ran my father's theoretical coordinates too, as I thought they might pick of a little Roma, but they did not. I was playing with some German pops earlier, so I left them in the source and you scored a little.

Target: Impaler_father
Distance: 617.2960% / 6.17295955 | ADC: 0.5x
51.4 Romanian_Muntenia
48.6 Roma_Wallachia

Target: Impaler
Distance: 654.6666% / 6.54666608 | ADC: 0.5x
75.0 Romanian_Muntenia
22.2 Roma_Wallachia
2.8 German_Rhineland-Palatinate

Target: Mr.G_father
Distance: 271.7947% / 2.71794675 | ADC: 0.5x
61.4 Hungarian_Transylvania
26.6 Hungrian_Transdanubia
11.2 German_Rhineland-Palatinate_East_of_Rhine
0.8 German_South_Hesse

Code:

Hungrian_Transdanubia,32.22,31.69,14.10,7.11,10.52,1.02,0.61,0.41,0.91,0.59,0.42,0.22,0.10
Hungarian_Transylvania,28.08,29.17,15.62,8.20,11.98,1.72,1.24,0.42,2.15,0.76,0.27,0.13,0.13
Roma_Balkans,9.73,9.53,12.55,16.84,18.44,2.86,26.43,1.28,0.92,0.27,0.61,0.45,0.09
Roma_Wallachia,10.87,10.98,13.02,16.12,19.24,2.66,23.01,1.43,0.72,0.21,1.21,0.39,0.14
Romanian,23.71,26.24,17.13,10.25,17.33,1.90,0.64,0.60,1.07,0.54,0.38,0.11,0.10
Romanian_Banat,23.88,25.79,17.43,10.47,17.42,1.87,0.49,0.57,1.19,0.45,0.26,0.11,0.06
Romanian_Crişana,25.14,27.30,16.89,9.51,16.54,1.32,0.69,0.43,0.91,0.60,0.44,0.12,0.10
Romanian_Dobruja,22.26,25.09,17.69,10.81,18.50,2.16,0.71,0.71,1.15,0.45,0.30,0.06,0.10
Romanian_Maramureş,26.03,28.85,16.08,9.29,14.55,1.83,0.84,0.74,0.77,0.46,0.42,0.07,0.06
Romanian_Muntenia,22.61,24.55,17.51,11.08,18.76,2.11,0.62,0.62,1.03,0.54,0.35,0.12,0.09
Romanian_North-Moldavia,24.89,30.80,15.19,9.09,14.27,1.69,0.84,0.56,1.37,0.53,0.47,0.17,0.13
Romanian_Oltenia,23.41,24.91,18.15,10.55,18.10,1.83,0.51,0.71,0.87,0.38,0.37,0.08,0.12
Romanian_South-Moldavia,24.02,26.72,16.79,9.78,17.00,2.06,0.64,0.58,1.14,0.64,0.37,0.10,0.16
Romanian_Transylvania,24.22,26.32,17.35,9.92,17.02,1.80,0.57,0.56,1.10,0.59,0.38,0.09,0.10
Romanian_Wallachia,22.69,24.74,17.64,10.95,18.58,2.07,0.62,0.65,1.01,0.49,0.35,0.11,0.10
German_County_Glatz,35.77,31.04,14.63,8.13,7.64,0.3,0,1.02,0,0.72,0,0.72,0 
German_East_Prussia_Central,46.40,36.05,9.33,1.39,2.77,2.18,0,0.12,0.19,0.31,0.99,0.18,0.09 
German_Hamburg,50.83,28.92,8.41,3.93,4.04,1.33,1.32,0,0.62,0.15,0,0.45,0 
German_Hither_Pomerania,43.825,32.395,11.415,5.735,3.815,0.35,0.545,0.72,0.44,0.475,0.05,0.24,0
German_Lower_Saxony_North,49.55,27.97,10.58,6.26,2.15,0.25,1.64,0.39,0.16,0.19,0.54,0.32,0.00
German_Lower_Saxony_South,48.78,25.87,11.39,6.78,3.82,0.44,1.48,0.00,0.51,0.31,0.04,0.12,0.45 
German_Lower_Silesia,34.34,36.33,12.87,6.99,6.65,0,0.6,0,0.31,0.85,0.34,0.47,0.23 
German_Mecklenburg_Center/East,42.39,32.89,11.32,5.1,5.27,0.54,0.89,0,0,1.13,0,0,0.47
German_Mecklenburg_West,45.13,33.44,9.22,6.21,3.28,0.16,0.49,0.62,0.34,0.34,0.33,0.43,0.00 
German_North_Bohemia,38.27,31.61,13.93,5.63,7.42,0.38,0.90,0.53,0.10,0.41,0.50,0.00,0.31 
German_North_Hesse,43.69,22.35,14.83,4.48,10.49,1.78,0,0.69,0,0.86,0.22,0,0.6 
German_North_Rhine,43.36,21.95,15.88,7.62,8.34,0.62,0.96,0.13,0.23,0.17,0.38,0.23,0.13 
German_Saarland,43.50,20.17,18.47,5.85,9.04,1.30,1.03,0.00,0.20,0.12,0.04,0.17,0.09 
German_Schleswig-Holstein,50.35,26.87,11.48,4.44,3.57,0.78,0.52,0.27,0.18,0.83,0.39,0.09,0.24 
German_South_Hesse,41.78,21.94,17.52,5.66,8.80,1.50,0.66,0.33,0.41,0.56,0.46,0.11,0.27 
German_Rhineland-Palatinate,42.44,20.12,17.36,5.05,11.26,1.57,0.27,0.15,0.65,0.45,0.39,0.11,0.20
German_Rhineland-Palatinate_East_of_Rhine,46.37,21.92,13.75,6.97,7.95,2.21,0.46,0.00,0.00,0.03,0.00,0.20,0.15 
German_Westphalia,48.90,25.72,11.45,6.87,3.44,0.81,1.08,0.20,0.26,0.57,0.25,0.06,0.39 
Upper_Silesia,33.01,43.21,9.27,6.4,5.21,0.26,0.67,0,1.04,0.31,0.58,0,0.06

**Impaler** · 01-22-2022, 04:24 PM

Originally Posted by Mr.G

I added some Iranian samples, the fit is lower:

Target: Father_K13
Distance: 3.8444% / 3.84438453 | ADC: 0.5x RC
54.2 Romanian_Muntenia
28.9 Roma_Wallachia
16.9 Persian_Eastcentral

**Jana** · 01-22-2022, 04:52 PM

Thanks for sharing, very interesting results! As far as I remember you papa looks Slavic, so no wonder Roma admixture may be unknown to him, especially if that particular tribe is assimilated.
Is his Romanian ancestry from Wallachia?

Is Greek coming from his side or your maternal side?

**Impaler** · 01-22-2022, 04:59 PM

Originally Posted by Stearsolina

Thanks for sharing, very interesting results! As far as I remember you papa looks Slavic, so no wonder Roma admixture may be unknown to him, especially if that particular tribe is assimilated.
Is his Romanian ancestry from Wallachia?

Is Greek coming from his side or your maternal side?

Yes, his Romanian side is from Buzau county, Wallachia.
My Greek is from maternal side.

By the way, this is his Y-DNA according to his STRs results
https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y18402*/

**Jana** · 01-22-2022, 05:27 PM

Originally Posted by Impaler

Yes, his Romanian side is from Buzau county, Wallachia.
My Greek is from maternal side.

By the way, this is his Y-DNA according to his STRs results
https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y18402*/

Looks like a Romani specific lineage of broadly Caucasus origin Y-DNA?

**Impaler** · 01-22-2022, 05:38 PM

Originally Posted by Stearsolina

Looks like a Romani specific lineage of broadly Caucasus origin Y-DNA?

Yes, right, ancient origins.

I am also on FTDNA Romany group and that's what they said about this specific subclade:

"As you see in the link the J-Y18402 tMRCA of 1000 years is just after the Romaní exodus from India or contemporary.

They could have been Zutt (Jat) cavalry or have been forced soldiers or logistic with the Ghaznavid army. We did multiple remarches and, clearly, the mutation is a known old Maykop culture mutation, in the actual region of Chechenia and Caucasus.

The main branch has the J-Y3612 “NAKHS people” sample.
That is just 2 mutations upstream our sub-branch: J-Y18402.

Those Nakho-Dagestanian came from the Kura-Araxes and Maikop trans-caucasian culture spreading north, from Dagestan on the Caspian sea, toward Grozni and then North of the present Sochi.

The Scandinavians & Balkan clans, which are all under J-Y3612, had a Y-DNA flow from those regions' populations. But J-Y3612 formed 7650 years ago so it was formed at the very end of Neolithic, near the region that is now North of Sochi, in Russia. From there, they surely moved North and possibly East. In-fact we can see that most men of J-Y3612 subgroups are still in Russia, Caucasus etc.

J-Y18402 “could” just be a Middle-age DNA flow into Romaní that originated from very ancient Russians herders / nomads or Caucasian people.
Anyway Y haplogroup J-Y18402 was generated 3450 years ago! So they had plenty time to spread and to be everywhere already in ancient times and, clearly, also East toward India and the North.

The very interesting fact is that MOST of the J-Y18402 tested people on YFull are actually from Romaní clans so this old paternal line from Dagestan / Maikop survives mainly in Romaní (for what we know until now)."

**Nurzat** · 01-22-2022, 05:39 PM

congrats and thanks for posting it! Roma mixed in Persia and in the Ottoman empire on the way to the Balkans so the lesser mixed ones (considering more recent times) score even more "West Asian" (not the best label for it) or Persian than Indian. so the West Asian and Persian must be from the Roma side as well. hard to draw precise lines when it's about very mixed populations like this one, but anyway it's even more interesting as it links you to an even broader region, so rich in history (I am quite passionate about the Orient, as Apricitans know

) can't wait to test my parents as well