Traditional Komi wedding

[Nanushka]

I was rather hoping the forum board member Jumala would post onto this thread, because he says he is a Komi and a Veps mix from Saint Petersburg, since I have only got a lot of unanswered questions and vague “me thinks” about things, but really, I do not know.

I don’t think our relative nations called themselves Chudes, it was mainly what Russians called them.

In some maps ‘Chudes’ are placed near Esonians, but really are they Vepsians? Vepsians, or tribes closely related to them, who also lived near Lake Onega at some point and even moved up to the Arkhangelsk area and to that Komi Udortsy district during the Novgorod rule era?

Blond like many Estonians, but with eyes that could be so light they do look abnormal, eerie.
One of my (supposedly, originally from Vepsian stock), great gran’s eyes looked a bit like that in the photo.
So, what else could the nickname ‘white-eyed chude’ mean if not that?

Chude are one of my main interests in Finn-Ugric area. Some years ago I watched a movie called Ofelas (Pathfinder) that told a Saami legend in which a young Saami shaman struggled to protect other Saami from the attack of a group of Chude. Two of my fav tribes and it was an awesome movie! When I asked my fiance about them (as bad guys) he said Finnic groups fought one another for a thousand year before settling. Here is the trailer:



I hope Jumala comes around to give some more info about them

Good point Aila, indeed no similarity of that Komi guy to the Indian, in terms of facial features.
On the other hand, here's an example of two texbook Uraloids. Notice the dark complexion.
And it's also the features of that Komi guy that shift into their direction, although in a diluted form.

Amazingly mongoloid with that dark skin complexion, shorter skulls and nasal-shape, shifting from Uralid to even Yenisey. They look like they have had little Finn-Ugric admixture yet while most of the Komi, Vepsian and others look proper Finnics. These guys in the photos might be from Bashkirs or Nenets?

Haha Buusra, you know, in the lovely thread Ellethwyn posted about Saami, I must have been looking for the textbook Uralic face Alenka posted on this thread

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...orthern-Norway
Also, there was another face there, which caught my attention, a man in the middle @ 1:35
Like, is that just the photo, or did he actually have those light, light ‘white-eyed-chude’ eyes, which would have so stood out if you had met him in person?

I have seen it, his eyes are so light blue that they seem white It must be a common trait among nordic persons as you said. Especially in old black and white photos very light eyes look white, I have a photo of my great-grandfather who had light blues eyes and I have always thought he was white-eyed too: )

[Nanushka]

We didn’t have scarfs identical to that, but even in my grandparent’s time, once a woman got married, she would always wear a scarf on her head.
Everything was done, prim and proper like.

Beautiful info, so this must be still an ongoing tradition in Finn-Ugric area

There is an area in Russia, which was sacred to both pre-Saami and ancient pre-Veps like peoples:
https://weirdrussia.com/2015/02/04/m...aara-mountain/

I loved the photos, environment and the whole story! I know about the Seita and Noita! I am just like a moth to the flame when I see such info, places and rituals, it intrigues my anthropological interest. Especially mountain worshipping, related spirits and deities fascinate me, I have saved these pieces of info, thank you

[travv]

Not Mongoloid not Northern. Anyway Komi people are 3/4 wogs and 1/4 VURians.

[Aila]

Chude are one of my main interests in Finn-Ugric area. Some years ago I watched a movie called Ofelas (Pathfinder) that told a Saami legend in which a young Saami shaman struggled to protect other Saami from the attack of a group of Chude. Two of my fav tribes and it was an awesome movie! When I asked my fiance about them (as bad guys) he said Finnic groups fought one another for a thousand year before settling.

Just because Russians called almost all Eastern Finnic tribes ‘Chudes’, that doesn’t mean we were the tshudde or čuđđe, which means an enemy or adversary in Saami language:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chud

Looking into my own ancestry, what I can tell, just the opposite had been true.

I’ve seen the movie, and there is an Australian film called “The Tracker”, which I think was modelled after the Pathfinder plot:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IV3LvS_M6M

It is also an excellent movie, but culturally, it doesn’t fit imo. as not all indigenous cultures are the same nor act the same way.
If I remember correctly, there was a noita Akameeli who fought enemies in the Pathfinder fashion, he is not on my Saami side family tree, but is on a Finnish cousin’s.

I hope Jumala comes around to give some more info about them

Heh.

[Aila]

I have seen it, his eyes are so light blue that they seem white It must be a common trait among nordic persons as you said. Especially in old black and white photos very light eyes look white, I have a photo of my great-grandfather who had light blues eyes and I have always thought he was white-eyed too: )

Awesome photo! That generation looked so distinguished and stoic and the white eyes would have been striking.
Not sure if it is commonly a Nordic trait, but it was a Veps trait.

I would really like to hear and learn more about Avars, perhaps you could start a thread?

[aherne]

Textbook Uraloid reaches almost Amerindian level of skintone.

Are you crazy??? Google for Komis/Udmurts: they are super light people:

https://www.circumarctic.com/image/d...omi/Komi-1.jpg

That guy is a gypsy, no doubt or maybe a soviet import from Tajikistan

[aherne]

These look like Dolgans or Kets: pure arctic mongoloids... Komis:

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a4/d1...737aa62a26.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a2/a6...8aaf022e6d.jpg
https://en.syktsu.ru/wp-content/uplo...00-700x300.jpg
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-iUFFyLubE...i-permjaki.jpg

They are a very North European looking people. Dark skin doesn't exist there, nor does black-ish hair!

[Alenka]

Amazingly mongoloid with that dark skin complexion, shorter skulls and nasal-shape, shifting from Uralid to even Yenisey. They look like they have had little Finn-Ugric admixture yet while most of the Komi, Vepsian and others look proper Finnics. These guys in the photos might be from Bashkirs or Nenets?

Those two guys are Khanty.

[Alenka]

That guy is a gypsy, no doubt or maybe a soviet import from Tajikistan

He doesn't even look like a Gypsy, nor does he look like a Tajik.
By what chance would a Gypsy even hang out with Komis?
That's extremely unlikely considering the demographics there.
Komi Republic and Perm Krai aren't Romania, sorry to say.

[Alenka]

Are you crazy??? Google for Komis/Udmurts: they are super light people:

https://www.circumarctic.com/image/d...omi/Komi-1.jpg

Komis:

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a4/d1...737aa62a26.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a2/a6...8aaf022e6d.jpg
https://en.syktsu.ru/wp-content/uplo...00-700x300.jpg
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-iUFFyLubE...i-permjaki.jpg

They are a very North European looking people. Dark skin doesn't exist there, nor does black-ish hair!

Maybe instead of Googling you should take a look at anthropological data collected by professionals.
Komis are much more likely to be dark haired rather than blonde.

Komi-Permyaks are only 0.7% light blonde, 2.6% blonde, and 11.2% dark blonde.
This adds up to only 14.5% light hair.
Komi-Zyrians are only 1.2% light blonde, 1.2% blonde and 16.1% dark blonde.
This adds up to only 18.5% light hair.

Spoiler!

Source: https://antropologia--fizyczna-pl.tr...en&_x_tr_hl=sl
Karin Mark, Zur Herkunft der finnisch-ugrischen Völker vom Standpunkt der Anthropologie, 1970
Chart translated into english by Peterski: https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...eir-neighbours