Are maternal instincts real?/Do mothers actually love their children?

[InmostLight]

From which communitarian/collectivist societies are your co-workers? From what I know, westerners are the least likely to abandon their children. The poorer the country, the higher the abandonment rate is usually. As far as I know Iran in the country with the highest abandonment rate. They have the biggest number of children abandoned in carboard boxes.

That's interesting! My background is rural US American, and these folks I mentioned were from the Middle East, SS Africa, and India. However, the majority of my exposure to international folks is through a university setting, so I'm only being exposed to the wealthy and well-bred ones.

[Tooting Carmen]

From which communitarian/collectivist societies are your co-workers? From what I know, westerners are the least likely to abandon their children. The poorer the country, the higher the abandonment rate is usually. As far as I know Iran in the country with the highest abandonment rate. They have the biggest number of children abandoned in carboard boxes.

I do agree that there is too much sentimentality about the supposedly "stronger family values" of Third World countries. This being said, however, in the West relatives are separate and distant from each other mostly out of choice (child must move out by the age of 25 etc, albeit with rising house prices this is changing), whereas elsewhere in the world relatives often separate due to forced circumstances like war, hunger or extreme poverty.

[InmostLight]

What obstacle for a natural birth exactly is a connective tissue disorder? An elevated aneurisma event risk in connection with the blood pressure tops? If not, there could be thought of maybe performing some of the natural birth stages before making the c-section. This is now admittedly no mature idea but more a brainstorming.

There's an increased risk of precipitate labor (I think this is like 80% for my case) and premature birth in the third trimester (60% if I remember correctly). Basically the pelvic floor muscle of women with collagen-affecting diseases, as well as the other skin and muscles in the area, is too weak and floppy to support the baby on its way out. In my specific case, I additionally have a deformity in my lower spine which makes my hips and lower back extremely stiff, and since it's caused by my bones being stuck together where they shouldn't be, I can't just yoga my way out of it. Having a displaced tailbone is not fun, and if I could get one from sitting on a plane too long, I can't imagine what a baby tearing out of me at full speed would do

[Seya]

That's interesting! My background is rural US American, and these folks I mentioned were from the Middle East, SS Africa, and India. However, the majority of my exposure to international folks is through a university setting, so I'm only being exposed to the wealthy and well-bred ones.

In general this situation happens when the woman has poor sexual education or/and it comes from a country where abortion/family planning is not allowed. And this is more frequent in poor countries, very conservative countries or countries with totalitarian regimes that try to bust their population rapidly.

[Occiput in Starlight]

I wonder whether more mothers or more fathers contribute to disorder in their (adult) children's personalities.

[Celestia]

I think that abuse and neglect of children has a high correlation with alcohol and drug dependency.
Those horrific stories are usually linked to drug addicts. Hardcore drugs most definitely can alter someone’s natural instinct and personality.

As far as being able to tell if a woman would make a good mother or not, I think that’s a a bit unfair.
I suppose if I were a guy, I would make that judgement on how responsible the woman is. I don’t think I would want to have children with someone who parties all of the time but I also believe children can change both parents for the better.

As for being naturally nurturing, I can use myself as an example. I am not the most compassionate person, and I never really cared for others children but once I had my own, they became my entire world. There really isn’t anything I wouldn’t do for my kids. I’d like to think most women are like that whether they are natural caregivers or not.

[rothaer]

(...) My doctors say I'll have to get a c-section once pregnant (...)

This is the most popular and relaxing way for the doctors. Maybe try to get a second opinion on this, evaluating particularly the risks for you (not the uncomfort for the doctors). I can, of course, not assess if it's well founded, but I'm a little bit irritated by that wheelchair argument that you seemingly have been told. It makes the impression of an exaggeration. It reminds me of a dentist that wanted to pull out an one time inflammated wisdom tooth of mine. When I did not agree he became energetic and said it could go up the jaw in the head and I could get a brain sepsis and that would be one of the rare cases in dentistry when you could die. I then told this clown that I take the risk to die by a brain sepsis and if he now please could prescribe antibiotika, which was the only reason why I at all was there. He felt offended but gave me antibiotika and that tooth, like my three other wisdom teeth, was never again a topic.

[Occiput in Starlight]

Good post, Celestia.

[InmostLight]

This is the most popular and relaxing way for the doctors. Maybe try to get a second opinion on this, evaluating particularly the risks for you (not the uncomfort for the doctors). I can, of course, not assess if it's well founded, but I'm a little bit irritated by that wheelchair argument that you seemingly have been told. It makes the impression of an exaggeration. It reminds me of a dentist that wanted to pull out an one time inflammated wisdom tooth of mine. When I did not agree he became energetic and said it could go up the jaw in the head and I could get a brain sepsis and that would be one of the rare cases in dentistry when you could die. I then told this clown that I take the risk to die by a brain sepsis and if he now please could describe antibiotika, that was the only reason why I at all was there. He felt offended but gave me antibiotika and that tooth, like my three other wisdom teeth, was never again a topic.

Thanks for the comforting thoughts! It can take years and years to work through the referral system and get an appointment with a connective tissue disorder specialist-- even seeing my current guy again is now a two year wait-- but it might be wise to at least seek out experiences from similarly-disordered mothers via support groups and whatnot. I'm sure you're right that it can always be done, but it's still awful scary!

[Tooting Carmen]

There is definitely also a paternal instinct - I have seen plenty of big macho men get incredibly gooey and sentimental whenever babies are around (and not just their own either).