Why is German culture one revolving around guilt and shame?

[Zeno]

After one previous thread where I presented the topic, I, out of curiosity, roamed through the German-speaking internet seeing some videos on German history.

Almost all of them are about the Nazi era. Almost nothing for the German Empire, the Weimar Republic, and especially the Holy Roman Empire and the Thirty Years War, in comparison to the sheer number of entire documentaries about the Holocaust, the Nürnberg Trials, the individual Nazis...

It's like actual, constant brainwashing to promote guilt, ie the notion that the younger generation of ethnic Germans are responsible too for the crimes that were committed. And a recurring message is referring to the modern era in the lines of: "if you don't accept the millions of foreigners that are here, you also bear the same type of responsiblity as that of the Nazi war criminals".

It's insane.

And even basic, civic patriotism, like displaying the flag, are frowned upon, even though the symbolism has nothing to do with the Third Reich:

https://www.dw.com/en/germany-how-pa...-be/a-65809909

And even the "constitutional patriotism" bit, a constitution that was basically forged out forcibly during the occupation of the country, is being subjected to multiple considerations?

How far can you go in degrading yourself?

[Colonel Frank Grimes]

It revolves around the Holocaust. Normal people - of which the majority of Germans are - don't like the idea that groups of people were treated abhorrently and targeted for extermination (although how the Holocaust came about is very different than the popular narrative. I spoke about this elsewhere but the point is people were targeted for death and this is upsetting to normal people). This feeling of disgust towards psychopathy makes Germans to, well, feel bad and be fearful of nationalism since nationalism is linked to the Holocaust.

What I would say to the German people is that there is no such thing as collective guilt. If you believe in collective guilt, then you might as well believe other irrational shit like racial mysticism. You're responsible for your actions. You're not responsible for your father's actions, or grandpa's, or the many ancestors you have.

If a fag loser brings up the Holocaust in an attempt to make you feel shame, you tell them you didn't do anything wrong. You then make a joke about how your grandpa died in the concentration camp... by falling off the guard tower, lolz

No one respects weakness. Begging forgiveness for something you had nothing to do with is weakness. They want to see you squirm. An adult acknowledges historical realities. An adult apologies when he's wrong. An adult doesn't lick someone's balls.

[ugochaves]

After one previous thread where I presented the topic, I, out of curiosity, roamed through the German-speaking internet seeing some videos on German history.

Almost all of them are about the Nazi era. Almost nothing for the German Empire, the Weimar Republic, and especially the Holy Roman Empire and the Thirty Years War, in comparison to the sheer number of entire documentaries about the Holocaust, the Nürnberg Trials, the individual Nazis...

It's like actual, constant brainwashing to promote guilt, ie the notion that the younger generation of ethnic Germans are responsible too for the crimes that were committed. And a recurring message is referring to the modern era in the lines of: "if you don't accept the millions of foreigners that are here, you also bear the same type of responsiblity as that of the Nazi war criminals".

It's insane.

And even basic, civic patriotism, like displaying the flag, are frowned upon, even though the symbolism has nothing to do with the Third Reich:

https://www.dw.com/en/germany-how-pa...-be/a-65809909

And even the "constitutional patriotism" bit, a constitution that was basically forged out forcibly during the occupation of the country, is being subjected to multiple considerations?

How far can you go in degrading yourself?

The Jews made them so weak. They tried us too, but they couldn't, the Slavs turned out to be the strongest in the elite.

[Tooting Carmen]

I agree with much of what the OP says. Nevertheless, will he also extend this charity to the Turks, i.e. forgive them for the Ottoman Empire and how it affected Greece, as well as the 1974 invasion of Cyprus?

[Zeno]

I agree with much of what the OP says. Nevertheless, will he also extend this charity to the Turks, i.e. forgive them for the Ottoman Empire and how it affected Greece, as well as the 1974 invasion of Cyprus?

Very different circumstances and very different effects.

Don't vilely bring one topic on top of the other.

The Turkish invasion is something that has an active impact up to this moment we're speaking. 1/3rd of Cyprus is illegally occupied, almost all the Turkish soldiers who were drafted for the invasion are still alive and are proud for this atrocity and Greek Cypriots who have lost their homes are still alive.

Plus, most importantly: unlike the Germans... The Turks haven't recognised the Greek genocide. Or the Armenian. Or the Circassian genocide, for that matter.

Nothing of the above is true for Jews in Germany or in Europe in general.

Don't compare the incomparable.

[Tooting Carmen]

Actually, as I also said in the OP's other related thread, the only country I have come across that comes close to Germany in terms of obsessing over a dictatorship is Chile. There are always mass demonstrations to commemorate Pinochet's coup on 11th September, and you can even still see the bullet holes left on the Casa de La Moneda from when the Chilean Air Force bombed it.

[Mejgusu]

I agree with much of what the OP says. Nevertheless, will he also extend this charity to the Turks, i.e. forgive them for the Ottoman Empire and how it affected Greece, as well as the 1974 invasion of Cyprus?

As a Turk I think we are already doomed, I mean we are Turks, as if this wouldn’t be a punishment. Turks and Germans are different, Turks are proud of all committed genocides, Germans are ashamed. Even Germans exaggerate sometimes(and it isn’t not that exaggerated), at least they don’t deny their crimes.

Plus, most importantly: unlike the Germans... [B]The Turks haven't recognised the Greek genocide. Or the Armenian. Or the Circassian genocide, for that matter.[/B.

Of course Turkiye won’t recognize Armenian genocide, Turkiye isn’t a new nation but the legal successor of Ottoman Empire. The system changed, Turkiye wasn’t founded newly. If Turks would recognize Armenian genocide, which happened whether Turks like it or not, Armenia could legally sue Turkiye.
But I think Greece couldn’t do anything because they have official agreements, theoretically Armenians could get land from Turkey, Greeks not. Cyprus is a different case.

[Annihilus]

Very different circumstances and very different effects.

Don't vilely bring one topic on top of the other.

The Turkish invasion is something that has an active impact up to this moment we're speaking. 1/3rd of Cyprus is illegally occupied, almost all the Turkish soldiers who were drafted for the invasion are still alive and are proud for this atrocity and Greek Cypriots who have lost their homes are still alive.

Plus, most importantly: unlike the Germans... The Turks haven't recognised the Greek genocide. Or the Armenian. Or the Circassian genocide, for that matter.

Nothing of the above is true for Jews in Germany or in Europe in general.

Don't compare the incomparable.

I get this when I google Circassian genocide

The Circassian genocide, or Tsitsekun, was the Russian Empire's systematic mass murder, ethnic cleansing, and expulsion of 80–97% of the Circassian population, around 800,000–1,500,000 people. during and after the Russo-Circassian War (1763–1864). The peoples planned for removal were mainly the Circassians, but other Muslim peoples of the Caucasus were also affected. Several methods used by Russian forces such as impaling and tearing the bellies of pregnant women were reported. Russian generals such as Grigory Zass described the Circassians as "subhuman filth", and glorified the mass murder of Circassian civilians, justified their use in scientific experiments, and allowed their soldiers to rape women.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circassian_genocide

[Dušan]

I get this when I google Circassian genocide

He probably thought on Assyrian genocide since Assyrians, Armenians and Greeks are three nations that got destruction by Turkey.

[Dušan]

Germans should learn more how they tried to destroy Slavs in eastern Europe with their Generalplan Ost.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generalplan_Ost


For Jews, it is none of my bussiness.