Has there been genetic studies done on the remains of any Moorish inhabitants from Al-Andalus?

[andrzej]

Historically we know that most of the Moors were native converts to Islam, so the majority of them aren't going to differ from Spaniards or Portuguese people, but I'm just curious of any genetic studies on the remains of people from that era?

[Beowulf]

Hello, I think there is avalaible some G25 samples from that period and some gedmatch kits as well (there is even a thread for them)

i only have this one now


Al- Andalus,0.0807196,0.1425973,0.0213387,-0.0267552,0.0343398,-0.0141537,-0.0099878,0.0001922,0.0278322,0.02609,0.0011097,0. 0037467,-0.0040013,-0.0112048,0.0084032,0.0006298,0.0013799,-0.0068833,-0.0100453,0.0010317,-0.001466,-0.0077489,0.0030196,-0.0049402,0.0003692


Target: Al-Andalus
Distance: 1.8825% / 0.01882545
36.4 TUR_Barcin_N
24.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
20.4 TUR_Tepecik_Ciftlik_N
10.4 MAR_Taforalt
7.2 WHG
0.4 Dinka
0.4 Yoruba


compared with modern distance:

Distance to:	Al-Andalus_MA
0.02165825	Spanish_Canarias
0.04263051	Portuguese
0.04279173	Spanish_Extremadura
0.04593082	Sicilian_West
0.04638572	Spanish_Andalucia
0.04724963	Spanish_Murcia
0.04795179	Maltese
0.04839924	Spanish_Galicia
0.05011696	Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon
0.05104337	French_Corsica
0.05264482	Spanish_Eivissa
0.05305656	Spanish_Alacant
0.05357429	Spanish_Menorca
0.05384661	Italian_Umbria
0.05399186	Italian_Tuscany
0.05420569	Ukrainian_Zhytomyr_o
0.05440264	Italian_Emilia
0.05449633	Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha
0.05452375	Italian_Lazio
0.05480900	Italian_Marche

[Benyzero]

Gallop currently researching it

[andrzej]

Gallop currently researching it

Alright, cool.

Hello, I think there is avalaible some G25 samples from that period and some gedmatch kits as well (there is even a thread for them)

i only have this one now


Al- Andalus,0.0807196,0.1425973,0.0213387,-0.0267552,0.0343398,-0.0141537,-0.0099878,0.0001922,0.0278322,0.02609,0.0011097,0. 0037467,-0.0040013,-0.0112048,0.0084032,0.0006298,0.0013799,-0.0068833,-0.0100453,0.0010317,-0.001466,-0.0077489,0.0030196,-0.0049402,0.0003692


Target: Al-Andalus
Distance: 1.8825% / 0.01882545
36.4 TUR_Barcin_N
24.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
20.4 TUR_Tepecik_Ciftlik_N
10.4 MAR_Taforalt
7.2 WHG
0.4 Dinka
0.4 Yoruba


compared with modern distance:

Distance to:	Al-Andalus_MA
0.02165825	Spanish_Canarias
0.04263051	Portuguese
0.04279173	Spanish_Extremadura
0.04593082	Sicilian_West
0.04638572	Spanish_Andalucia
0.04724963	Spanish_Murcia
0.04795179	Maltese
0.04839924	Spanish_Galicia
0.05011696	Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon
0.05104337	French_Corsica
0.05264482	Spanish_Eivissa
0.05305656	Spanish_Alacant
0.05357429	Spanish_Menorca
0.05384661	Italian_Umbria
0.05399186	Italian_Tuscany
0.05420569	Ukrainian_Zhytomyr_o
0.05440264	Italian_Emilia
0.05449633	Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha
0.05452375	Italian_Lazio
0.05480900	Italian_Marche

That's interesting! So it's safe to say that they were basically native Iberians with minor North African admixture if they cluster with Canarians? At least basing on an individual I guess. I'm curious why the Ukraine Zhytomyr before pops up before other Spanish regions. Do you think its due to Saqaliba admixture? A lot of slaves came from Kievan Rus. Also, do you know what year this person lived in?

Do you have a non-Al Andalus Spaniards breakdown by any chance?

[Beowulf]

Alright, cool.




That's interesting! So it's safe to say that they were basically native Iberians with minor North African admixture if they cluster with Canarians? At least basing on an individual I guess. I'm curious why the Ukraine Zhytomyr before pops up before other Spanish regions. Do you think its due to Saqaliba admixture? A lot of slaves came from Kievan Rus. Also, do you know what year this person lived in?

Do you have a non-Al Andalus Spaniards breakdown by any chance?

Hello , first of all the Zythomyr sample is an outlier sample i think it was ashkenazi (idk why didn't labelled as one), Also yes they seems to be mostly of Iberian ancestry with some higher NA admixture but i think it arrived more in roman era times, there are some samples from visigothic period in Granada with the same genetic make-up, the sample i used by disgrace i don't know from wich year is it dated but is an averaged sample from various samples.

If i remember well this sample was from medieval Girona:

Northeast_Medieval_Iberian,0.1141078,0.1454745,0.0 33941,-0.0063792,0.0375455,-0.001046,0.0001175,0.0031728,0.0259233,0.033076,-0.0032475,0.003859,-0.0118182,-0.0116978,0.0027482,-0.0012927,6.5e-05,-0.0040538,-0.00088,-0.0025325,0.004336,0.000371,-0.0001847,-0.0011747,-0.0003592




Iberia_Northeast_c.8-12CE
Distance: 2.9011% / 0.02901075
56.4 TUR_Barcin_N
29.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
10.2 WHG
3.4 MAR_Taforalt
0.2 TUR_Tepecik_Ciftlik_N

It's very similar to modern Iberians.

Distance to:	Northeast_Medieval_Iberian
0.01288874	Spanish_Eivissa
0.01560141	Spanish_Murcia
0.01576327	Spanish_Baleares
0.01580169	Spanish_Menorca
0.01621973	Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha
0.01730776	Spanish_Alacant
0.01738049	Spanish_Andalucia
0.01751813	Portuguese
0.01759235	Spanish_Mallorca
0.01767313	Spanish_Extremadura

[Jingle Bell]

Yeah, they were very identical to earlier iberians of Roman Era, the Al-Andalus/Late MA Iberian samples not surprisigly clusters with the Roman Era ones, some are even less NA shifted than the Al Andalus ones, NA geneflow started getting intense in Iberian prob around late IA/Early Roman Era (Punic, and NA's slaves/mercenaries/legionaries from Rome), also Levantine & East-Central Med profiles (Roman/,Greek settlers), the difference that some Al Andalus samplea have a Arabian/SSA shift which was for sure absent in peninsula, but they also disappeared in posterior iberians from Late MA (Reconquista/Expulsion) so yeah iberians changed few since Late Roman era.

[HelloGuys]

The moorish muslim people who were different from native iberians and Berbers were studied in Iñigo Olalde's 2019 study (The genomic history of the Iberian Peninsula over the past 8000 years).

They were modeled in qpAdm in 2-way and 3-way like this:



But from time to time there were genetic profiles like these 2:



The next ones are the native iberians (No matter if they were muslim or catholic):

[Jingle Bell]

Yeah, they were very identical to earlier iberians of Roman Era, the Al-Andalus/Late MA Iberian samples not surprisigly clusters with the Roman Era ones, some are even less NA shifted than the Al Andalus ones, NA geneflow started getting intense in Iberian prob around late IA/Early Roman Era (Punic, and NA's slaves/mercenaries/legionaries from Rome), also Levantine & East-Central Med profiles (Roman/,Greek settlers), the difference that some Al Andalus samplea have a Arabian/SSA shift which was for sure absent in peninsula, but they also disappeared in posterior iberians from Late MA (Reconquista/Expulsion) so yeah iberians changed few since Late Roman era.

Using averages:

IA:Spain_IA,0.1258262,0.1492827,0.0583851,0.0049625,0.0602349,-0.0044623,-0.0022645,0.0031048,0.0336535,0.0464537,-0.0050636,0.0132018,-0.0238533,-0.0138374,0.0089698,0.0056533,0.006626,0.0005185,0.0040911,-0.0026263,0.0052294,-0.0004945,-0.0051203,-0.0136163,-0.0022753
IA:Spain_IA_Celt,0.1252055,0.1477595,0.066939,0.0121125,0.0604725,0.0046015,-0.002585,0.0040385,0.026179,0.033896,-0.0002435,0.0095165,-0.0165015,-0.0088075,0.009772,-0.0012595,-0.0099745,-0.000317,0.002514,-0.0046275,0.008485,0.0037715,-0.006347,-0.0103625,-0.0072445
IA:Spain_Hellenistic_oLocal,0.1252055,0.138112,0.0539285,0.0337535,0.0381605,0.0039045,0.001175,0.006461,0.017487,0.0222325,-0.0050345,0.0019485,-0.0208125,-0.01968,0.015133,0.0077565,0.012582,0.002407,0.002828,0.0060025,0.0084225,-0.0003705,-0.003389,0.0097605,0.0010175
IA:Spain_LIA,0.126723,0.1533447,0.060088,0.0024763,0.059806,0.000744,-0.00047,0.005461,0.035178,0.0490823,-0.0056297,0.0059447,-0.0244797,-0.0141293,0.0104053,-0.0026077,-0.0078667,0.0054477,-0.005908,-0.0014173,0.0136423,-4.13E-05,-0.0110103,-0.0125317,8.00E-05
Roman:Portugal_Conimbriga_Roman.SG,0.113254,0.146236,0.050911,0.007752,0.0486245,0.001952,0.00423,0.0016155,0.0330305,0.0309805,-0.0025985,0.0082425,-0.019623,-0.0108725,0.0146575,0.005436,0.001499,0.004244,0.002514,0.003064,0.006426,0.001422,-0.003636,-0.0091575,0.0025145
Roman:Portugal_Miroico_LateRoman.SG,0.0984572,0.1428512,0.0355123,-0.0088825,0.0444697,-0.0058567,-0.0054052,0.0023075,0.0305082,0.0322557,-0.0036808,0.007968,-0.0091178,-0.0163312,0.0095458,0.0004642,0.0001957,-0.0019423,-0.0102235,0.0005212,0.0028285,-0.0021637,0.0010473,-0.0044583,0.0009182
Roman:Portugal_MonteDaNora_LateRoman.SG,0.0830907,0.1445437,0.0235073,-0.0230407,0.0336473,-0.0090173,-0.010262,-0.0005383,0.0289743,0.02934,-0.002057,0.0016487,-0.004757,-0.0084407,0.009817,-0.002961,-0.0033467,-0.0059543,-0.0080027,0.001334,-0.001872,-0.0056057,0.0041903,-0.0041773,-0.00012
Al-Andalus:Spain_Islamic,0.0967497,0.1452207,0.0296042,-0.0178188,0.0366733,-0.0066467,-0.0057183,-0.0017692,0.0246452,0.0283378,0.0004873,0.0081677,-0.0091427,-0.015666,0.006899,0.00579,0.0045852,-0.008847,-0.0114385,-0.0002083,0.0020797,-0.002267,0.0017257,-0.0035142,0.0007785
Al-Andalus:Spain_Islamic_Almohade,0.068294,0.147252,0.027153,-0.025194,0.035699,-0.014781,-0.011045,0.004615,0.031292,0.036083,0.003085,0.004646,-0.008028,-0.013074,0.006243,-0.005701,0.005998,0.000253,-0.013575,-0.001251,-0.006863,-0.025349,0.008997,-0.003012,-0.004071
Al-Andalus:Spain_Islamic_Zira,0.084229,0.1416665,0.0092395,-0.0272935,0.0273895,-0.0188255,-0.0071675,0.0021925,0.024236,0.024784,0.0014615,-0.003297,-0.003345,-0.002408,0.009297,-0.0025855,-0.001043,-0.003674,-0.00905,0.0070035,-0.0018715,-0.010696,0.001048,-0.0047595,0.000599
Al-Andalus:Spain_NazariPeriod_LateMuslim,0.030732,0.139128,0.024513,-0.040052,0.039084,-0.023706,-0.022091,-0.004154,0.029451,0.021322,-0.005521,0.008093,-0.005054,-0.012386,0.0076,-0.003845,0.007953,-0.006841,-0.019483,-0.004377,-0.013851,-0.013849,-0.003821,-0.010363,-0.002754
Al-Andalus:Spain_NazariPeriod_Muslim,0.0782532,0.1414128,0.017819,-0.0356107,0.027774,-0.0158965,-0.013102,0.0016155,0.0294512,0.0265152,0.001827,0.0012362,0.0008178,-0.0079478,0.0070235,-0.000232,-0.0031292,0.0018055,-0.0040852,-0.0014385,0.0023397,-0.008223,0.0009553,-0.0044282,0.0043707
Roman:Spain_Roman,0.088782,0.147252,0.03017,-0.025517,0.044008,-0.021753,-0.001645,0.003923,0.029247,0.037176,-0.002923,0.001499,-0.005798,-0.010872,0.00665,-0.004641,-0.012256,-0.005828,-0.01081,0.00025,-0.000499,-0.007666,0.003204,-0.007471,-0.005389

As is visible after IA, iberian suffered little shift, and Al-Andalus still overlap with Roman Iberia

[HelloGuys]

The moorish muslim people who were different from native iberians and Berbers were studied in Iñigo Olalde's 2019 study (The genomic history of the Iberian Peninsula over the past 8000 years).

They were modeled in qpAdm in 2-way and 3-way like this:



But from time to time there were genetic profiles like these 2:



The next ones are the native iberians (No matter if they were muslim or catholic):

And compared to this another admixture model in qpAdm in 3-way (But labelled just as Spanish and Amazigh):



I don't know the origin of the study and/or author (So I can't confirm if it is indeed by Reich Lab/Harvard).

[HelloGuys]

Using averages:

IA:Spain_IA,0.1258262,0.1492827,0.0583851,0.0049625,0.0602349,-0.0044623,-0.0022645,0.0031048,0.0336535,0.0464537,-0.0050636,0.0132018,-0.0238533,-0.0138374,0.0089698,0.0056533,0.006626,0.0005185,0.0040911,-0.0026263,0.0052294,-0.0004945,-0.0051203,-0.0136163,-0.0022753
IA:Spain_IA_Celt,0.1252055,0.1477595,0.066939,0.0121125,0.0604725,0.0046015,-0.002585,0.0040385,0.026179,0.033896,-0.0002435,0.0095165,-0.0165015,-0.0088075,0.009772,-0.0012595,-0.0099745,-0.000317,0.002514,-0.0046275,0.008485,0.0037715,-0.006347,-0.0103625,-0.0072445
IA:Spain_Hellenistic_oLocal,0.1252055,0.138112,0.0539285,0.0337535,0.0381605,0.0039045,0.001175,0.006461,0.017487,0.0222325,-0.0050345,0.0019485,-0.0208125,-0.01968,0.015133,0.0077565,0.012582,0.002407,0.002828,0.0060025,0.0084225,-0.0003705,-0.003389,0.0097605,0.0010175
IA:Spain_LIA,0.126723,0.1533447,0.060088,0.0024763,0.059806,0.000744,-0.00047,0.005461,0.035178,0.0490823,-0.0056297,0.0059447,-0.0244797,-0.0141293,0.0104053,-0.0026077,-0.0078667,0.0054477,-0.005908,-0.0014173,0.0136423,-4.13E-05,-0.0110103,-0.0125317,8.00E-05
Roman:Portugal_Conimbriga_Roman.SG,0.113254,0.146236,0.050911,0.007752,0.0486245,0.001952,0.00423,0.0016155,0.0330305,0.0309805,-0.0025985,0.0082425,-0.019623,-0.0108725,0.0146575,0.005436,0.001499,0.004244,0.002514,0.003064,0.006426,0.001422,-0.003636,-0.0091575,0.0025145
Roman:Portugal_Miroico_LateRoman.SG,0.0984572,0.1428512,0.0355123,-0.0088825,0.0444697,-0.0058567,-0.0054052,0.0023075,0.0305082,0.0322557,-0.0036808,0.007968,-0.0091178,-0.0163312,0.0095458,0.0004642,0.0001957,-0.0019423,-0.0102235,0.0005212,0.0028285,-0.0021637,0.0010473,-0.0044583,0.0009182
Roman:Portugal_MonteDaNora_LateRoman.SG,0.0830907,0.1445437,0.0235073,-0.0230407,0.0336473,-0.0090173,-0.010262,-0.0005383,0.0289743,0.02934,-0.002057,0.0016487,-0.004757,-0.0084407,0.009817,-0.002961,-0.0033467,-0.0059543,-0.0080027,0.001334,-0.001872,-0.0056057,0.0041903,-0.0041773,-0.00012
Al-Andalus:Spain_Islamic,0.0967497,0.1452207,0.0296042,-0.0178188,0.0366733,-0.0066467,-0.0057183,-0.0017692,0.0246452,0.0283378,0.0004873,0.0081677,-0.0091427,-0.015666,0.006899,0.00579,0.0045852,-0.008847,-0.0114385,-0.0002083,0.0020797,-0.002267,0.0017257,-0.0035142,0.0007785
Al-Andalus:Spain_Islamic_Almohade,0.068294,0.147252,0.027153,-0.025194,0.035699,-0.014781,-0.011045,0.004615,0.031292,0.036083,0.003085,0.004646,-0.008028,-0.013074,0.006243,-0.005701,0.005998,0.000253,-0.013575,-0.001251,-0.006863,-0.025349,0.008997,-0.003012,-0.004071
Al-Andalus:Spain_Islamic_Zira,0.084229,0.1416665,0.0092395,-0.0272935,0.0273895,-0.0188255,-0.0071675,0.0021925,0.024236,0.024784,0.0014615,-0.003297,-0.003345,-0.002408,0.009297,-0.0025855,-0.001043,-0.003674,-0.00905,0.0070035,-0.0018715,-0.010696,0.001048,-0.0047595,0.000599
Al-Andalus:Spain_NazariPeriod_LateMuslim,0.030732,0.139128,0.024513,-0.040052,0.039084,-0.023706,-0.022091,-0.004154,0.029451,0.021322,-0.005521,0.008093,-0.005054,-0.012386,0.0076,-0.003845,0.007953,-0.006841,-0.019483,-0.004377,-0.013851,-0.013849,-0.003821,-0.010363,-0.002754
Al-Andalus:Spain_NazariPeriod_Muslim,0.0782532,0.1414128,0.017819,-0.0356107,0.027774,-0.0158965,-0.013102,0.0016155,0.0294512,0.0265152,0.001827,0.0012362,0.0008178,-0.0079478,0.0070235,-0.000232,-0.0031292,0.0018055,-0.0040852,-0.0014385,0.0023397,-0.008223,0.0009553,-0.0044282,0.0043707
Roman:Spain_Roman,0.088782,0.147252,0.03017,-0.025517,0.044008,-0.021753,-0.001645,0.003923,0.029247,0.037176,-0.002923,0.001499,-0.005798,-0.010872,0.00665,-0.004641,-0.012256,-0.005828,-0.01081,0.00025,-0.000499,-0.007666,0.003204,-0.007471,-0.005389

As is visible after IA, iberian suffered little shift, and Al-Andalus still overlap with Roman Iberia

Cool bro, but you would need at least berbers/northwest africans, modern iberians, levantines and SSA as references base because if not the samples you want to plot does not have a correct shift in the PCA.

Like this (But I have made one for the whole world lol):



Now I marked the IA, Al-Andalus and Roman to see them better:



I admit that it is better to use individuals rather than averages in a PCA, but this was the model I had on hand anyway it serves its purpose