Is it me or do Czechs have narrower/longer faces than Poles/Ukrainians?

[Watersater79]

Narrower yes, anecdotally I've found that they have much more Norics and generally more Dinaricized individuals than Poland and Ukraine, they are kind of similar to many Austrians in that regards.

Ukrainians have a lot of Mediterranean influenced types and they can have long faces as well but it tend to be broader as well due to more Turanid and Tatar influences. Poles tend to get their broad "round" faces from having more Neo-Danubian, Ladogan and East Baltic influences.

Facially they are closer to Poles, but metrically they really do seem identical to Austrians. Concerning Ukrainians and Poles the biggest difference I have actually noticed (metrically), is the fact a great swathe of Poles have pretty squarish jaws, whilst Ukrainians are 'softer' featured. Although Ukrainians are primarily 'east Slavic' metrically they seem far closer to Poles than Russians anyway; most Russians seem to have long(ish) faces from what I have seen. East Asians really are broader-faced than Europeans (as a whole), but Poles/Ukrainians are the exception to the rule.

[Token]

Czechs are metrically and morphologically nearly identical to Bavarians.

[Watersater79]

Czechs are metrically and morphologically nearly identical to Bavarians.

In fairness, I couldn't find anything on Czechs from research done by Coon and co. No doubt, they are identical to Hungarians as well (bearing a bizygomatic width of 140 mm).

[Abriekman]

Facially they are closer to Poles, but metrically they really do seem identical to Austrians. Concerning Ukrainians and Poles the biggest difference I have actually noticed (metrically), is the fact a great swathe of Poles have pretty squarish jaws, whilst Ukrainians are 'softer' featured. Although Ukrainians are primarily 'east Slavic' metrically they seem far closer to Poles than Russians anyway; most Russians seem to have long(ish) faces from what I have seen. East Asians really are broader-faced than Europeans (as a whole), but Poles/Ukrainians are the exception to the rule.

It's funny how you put Ukrainians and Poles into one group and separate Russians like they're somewhat different. The reality is that those 3 nations have a lot of subgroups and any phenotypic differences are more on a regional level than on a national one.

[Watersater79]

It's funny how you put Ukrainians and Poles into one group and separate Russians like they're somewhat different. The reality is that those 3 nations have a lot of subgroups and any phenotypic differences are more on a regional level than on a national one.

For a large population, Russians are pretty homogeneous, at least from a genetic point of view.

[Abriekman]

For a large population, Russians are pretty homogeneous, at least from a genetic point of view.

Average Belgorod Russian is genetically closer to Ukrainians from the nearest regions than to Russians from more distant regions.

Distance to: Russian_Belgorod
0.01067123 Ukrainian_Chernihiv
0.01226239 Ukrainian_Dnipro
0.01285139 Ukrainian_Zhytomyr
0.01339899 Ukrainian_Rivne
0.01519559 Russian_Kursk
0.01530175 Ukrainian_Sumy
0.01716287 Russian_Smolensk
0.02176764 Ukrainian_Lviv
0.02810494 Ukrainian_Zakarpattia
0.04461045 Russian_Kostroma
0.05599463 Russian_Krasnoborsky

The same goes for Kursk Russians

Distance to: Russian_Kursk
0.00983945 Ukrainian_Dnipro
0.01263886 Ukrainian_Chernihiv
0.01409716 Ukrainian_Rivne
0.01598858 Russian_Smolensk
0.01648473 Ukrainian_Sumy
0.01756881 Ukrainian_Zhytomyr
0.02873897 Ukrainian_Lviv
0.03478442 Ukrainian_Zakarpattia
0.03479463 Russian_Kostroma
0.04640149 Russian_Krasnoborsky

As you can see the distance of average Western Russian to average Ukrainian samples from some regions is even 4 times closer than to Russians from the north, which is quite significant. But while they are close to Ukrainians that live close to them, they are relatively distant to those from Zakarpattia ( Western Ukraine ), those Ukrainians are closer to Hungarians and Croats than to anyone else.

I could show you a couple more but I think you understood my point now.

[Watersater79]

Bump

[Russki]

Average Belgorod Russian is genetically closer to Ukrainians from the nearest regions than to Russians from more distant regions.

Distance to: Russian_Belgorod
0.01067123 Ukrainian_Chernihiv
0.01226239 Ukrainian_Dnipro
0.01285139 Ukrainian_Zhytomyr
0.01339899 Ukrainian_Rivne
0.01519559 Russian_Kursk
0.01530175 Ukrainian_Sumy
0.01716287 Russian_Smolensk
0.02176764 Ukrainian_Lviv
0.02810494 Ukrainian_Zakarpattia
0.04461045 Russian_Kostroma
0.05599463 Russian_Krasnoborsky

The same goes for Kursk Russians

Distance to: Russian_Kursk
0.00983945 Ukrainian_Dnipro
0.01263886 Ukrainian_Chernihiv
0.01409716 Ukrainian_Rivne
0.01598858 Russian_Smolensk
0.01648473 Ukrainian_Sumy
0.01756881 Ukrainian_Zhytomyr
0.02873897 Ukrainian_Lviv
0.03478442 Ukrainian_Zakarpattia
0.03479463 Russian_Kostroma
0.04640149 Russian_Krasnoborsky

As you can see the distance of average Western Russian to average Ukrainian samples from some regions is even 4 times closer than to Russians from the north, which is quite significant. But while they are close to Ukrainians that live close to them, they are relatively distant to those from Zakarpattia ( Western Ukraine ), those Ukrainians are closer to Hungarians and Croats than to anyone else.

I could show you a couple more but I think you understood my point now.

In this table both Belgorod and Kursk are represented by the Desna-Seym type. They show a strong commonality with other Russians despite clustering closer to Ukrainians.

[Watersater79]

Czechs are metrically and morphologically nearly identical to Bavarians.

Can you please find me the link to this, Token?