Croatian man killed in Ireland "for speaking Croatian"

[Grace O'Malley]

Human beings are corrupt by nature so in every kind of guild or business there's always going to be some sort of abuse: from politics to prostitution.

Humans run the gamut. There are some humans that are the dregs but then there are humans that are so inspiring and do genuinely try to help humanity. It's not like you want to emulate the biggest scumbags on the planet. There are a lot of people out there that are incredibly decent and good. No not all humans are corrupt. Surely you know people that you admire and there are plenty of poor people as well that are salt of the earth times and genuinely good. If most people were corrupt we would be finished as a species. No most people are good and decent and I say this as someone who is fascinated by true crime so I'm not naïve either. I've also met my share of narcissists and sociopaths but they are a minority and most people are decent human beings.

[Incal]

Humans run the gamut. There are some humans that are the dregs but then there are humans that are so inspiring and do genuinely try to help humanity. It's not like you want to emulate the biggest scumbags on the planet. There are a lot of people out there that are incredibly decent and good. No not all humans are corrupt. Surely you know people that you admire and there are plenty of poor people as well that are salt of the earth times and genuinely good. If most people were corrupt we would be finished as a species. No most people are good and decent and I say this as someone who is fascinated by true crime so I'm not naïve either. I've also met my share of narcissists and sociopaths but they are a minority and most people are decent human beings.

TBH the list of people I admire gets tinier each year and while I reckon there's been and you can still find astonishing human beings, they are an insignificant minority. Most people who call themselves good in reality are just pretending to be good I've learned.

Edit: I have to make a correction though, the word I was looking for was corruptible instead of corrupt. My bad.

[Grace O'Malley]

On the other hand I dont find it at all suprising that many females that are not prostitutes to have a general aversion to prostitutes to be strange it is rather expected because logically prostitutes take both the potential money and male attention away from women in society but that was not even my point . To my point mostly the response was not addressing my point but going everywhere around it and restating the point that i already acknowledged that there is also exists trafficked and coerced prostitution but i was discussing women like the ones in the youtube videos i posted if you watched them.

Oh oszkar really? Women are against prostitution because prostitutes take both the potential money and male attention away from women in society. You can't really believe that? You think that women that are against prostitution are that way because they look at prostitutes as competition?

Simple question but not had an answer. Would you like your daughter or wife to work as a prostitute?

And so it has always been. Prostitution is laced with mortal peril: women who sell sex are 18 times more likely to be murdered than women who don’t, according to one study. Yet these women have throughout history been cast as second-class citizens, not worthy of the same concern as other victims.

How best to prevent violence against those selling sex, the vast majority of whom are women, is a question that has long divided feminists. For some, it is about decriminalising the selling and buying of sex, which in England and Wales would mean dropping criminal offences such as kerb crawling, soliciting and running a brothel. There will always be prostitution, so the argument goes, so best to keep it out in the open. Others agree that the selling of sex should be decriminalised in all circumstances and think women should be provided with ample support to get out of prostitution, but argue that the buying of sex, an almost exclusively male activity, should always be a crime.

The full decriminalisation argument is driven by a belief that it is possible to sufficiently strengthen the agency of those who sell sex to transform it into “sex work”, like any other job. You can see what makes it an appealing frame, powered by an archetype that has evolved from the Pretty Woman male saviour narrative, to the sex-positive woman sticking two fingers up at a socially conservative society by making bags of money doing something she loves. Sex work is a choice that should be respected and we should destigmatise it by decriminalising the men who buy it and regulate it to make it safer. Women railing against this are depicted as prudes constrained by their own squeamishness about sex.

There are two reality checks that bring these theoretical arguments crashing down to earth. The first is that for every woman or man selling sex who regards it as a positive choice, and there are some, there are many more who have been trafficked or exploited and are effectively enslaved to criminal networks, working for a pittance, or for drugs to forget the trauma of being forced into selling yourself to be penetrated again and again, or for nothing at all.

In one investigation into sex trafficking, Leicestershire police reported that 86% of the women in brothels they visited were Romanian; in Northumbria, it was 75%. Numerous studies have shown just how dangerous prostitution is: a majority of women selling sex have experienced severe and repeated violence, with more than two-thirds suffering from PTSD at levels comparable to war vetera ns. Women who are actually or effectively being forced into selling sex have little voice in policy debates, although there are prominent survivor networks that argue for abolition.

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...makes-it-worse

Men that use prostitutes are not men that I would want to be associating with. Of course there would be many men that aren't going to make it known that they use prostitutes but I do not think men that pay for sex are going to be good husband material. There is no way you can respect yourself and respect women if you use prostitutes. Of course men that use prostitutes view them as disposable and use words like sluts, whores, hookers etc but they somehow think that what they are doing is fine. They are intimately involved with women they pay sex for and could be the woman's 15th customer. The whole industry is rotten and no it is not because I view prostitutes as competition.

I have a daughter and if she was a cleaning houses I would be proud of her. That is good and honest work. A lot of people also make a very good living out of cleaning. Some people have had very lucrative businesses doing cleaning. Yes I would be happy if my daughter cleaned houses. I would absolutely not want her to prostitute herself.

[oszkar07]

You are making all of the excuses here, you sound like a punter.

Not judging you, but if you have a conflict of interest, then we should know about it.

perhaps you sound like one of those that like to have her cake and eat it too, or in other words have it both ways so long as it suits you.

im not but i get sick of hypocrisy because to anyone with half a working brain it is obvious that there are women that do that work of their own accord as well as the ones who dont.

as for my comments in the previous quote that you quoted they are not excuses if anything they are shining a light on the hypocritical thinking and rationalising of people whom are complicit in activities of the sex game/industry but somehow pretentiously shift the blame like saying well if it wasnt for the creepy men then women wouldn't have to do this work. The truth is that if you are not trafficked and you dont want to do such work ... guess what = no one is making you.

Yes, there are a lot of young dumb hoes. A civilised society protects them from themselves, the same with drug addiction.

good luck with that and btw show me one nation that won the war on drugs and dont start bringing up the very strict middle east countries like UAE SA etc because they do all of that stuff in the shadows and in fact the places where there is the most covered up women and strict laws around sex Arab muslim countries guess what are also the countries that have the highest amount of online Porn viewers.

we are going around in circles , ultimately my point was beside the trafficked and coreced there are many women that do that stuff there own free will and i guess my 2nd point concerned societal stigma around the first point which seems to include by some of society that some women and quite a lot actually do that stuff willingly but that this is denied that some people prefer to see it that all those women are unwilling victims or as you put it need to be taken care of like ....

i imagine you singing "somebody come get her she's dancin like a stripper ", then a couple of goons come take her away to the dumb hoe hooker concentration camp, good luck with that .

[Grace O'Malley]

TBH the list of people I admire gets tinier each year and while I reckon there's been and you can still find astonishing human beings, they are an insignificant minority. Most people who call themselves good in reality are just pretending to be good I've learned.

Edit: I have to make a correction though, the word I was looking for was corruptible instead of corrupt. My bad.

I admire my parents and some of my relatives. Decent and good people. My father was an incredibly decent and moral man who had great respect for women. I know some incredibly kind and wonderful people that I could never be like them. I know a couple of women who for their holidays goes to places like Cambodia to help villagers and build wells and facilities etc. These are just ordinary people that I work with.

[Blondie]

Same thing, they are all part of organised crime, money laundering, etc.
Yeah right. You think I was born yesterday? Drug use is widespread in porn and prostitution, is a common motivation.

Thats why i said we must ban every job. Tons of other thing is connecting to mafisos and drugs. Why would we stop at sex industry?

[Incal]

Thats why i said we must ban every job. Tons of other thing is connecting to mafisos and drugs. Why would we stop at sex industry?

While we are at it, we should also ban cars because the other day a drunk driver killed someone in my town. Oh, and hospitals too since they couldn't save the victim.

[Blondie]

That's all just spin. They are hardly going to say I feel degraded and this is seedy and derogatory work. I find it hard to believe that you think this is a positive choice for any woman to make? Not that I watch porn but the woman are treated like dirt. Isn't that where the choking epidemic has come from and other seedy practices? In the end do you think people are going to give women respect that work in porn and prostitution? You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.
It also has a negative affect on society and is a big factor in women being looked on as sex objects i.e. dehumanised. There are plenty of studies out there about the negative affects of porn on society. It is very negative for women in particular.
Prostitution and pornography absolutely devalue women and there is nothing positive about these industries. They are both disgusting.

The problem is, not every woman share your opinion that this job is degraded. Or they say its degraded ok but i will get tons of money, so i will do this. Btw many other job is degraded, for example working at the dump.
I did not say porn and sex work is positive thing. I have negative opinion in general, i also talked about the negative influence of porn and this porn addicted generation in other threads. But you have no right to limit human rights, yes sucking a penis for money is part of human rights and personal freedom.
Btw many woman loves if the guy treats her as sex objects so what?

[oszkar07]

Oh oszkar really? Women are against prostitution because prostitutes take both the potential money and male attention away from women in society. You can't really believe that? You think that women that are against prostitution are that way because they look at prostitutes as competition?

Simple question but not had an answer. Would you like your daughter or wife to work as a prostitute?



https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...makes-it-worse

Men that use prostitutes are not men that I would want to be associating with. Of course there would be many men that aren't going to make it known that they use prostitutes but I do not think men that pay for sex are going to be good husband material. There is no way you can respect yourself and respect women if you use prostitutes. Of course men that use prostitutes view them as disposable and use words like sluts, whores, hookers etc but they somehow think that what they are doing is fine. They are intimately involved with women they pay sex for and could be the woman's 15th customer. The whole industry is rotten and no it is not because I view prostitutes as competition.

I have a daughter and if she was a cleaning houses I would be proud of her. That is good and honest work. A lot of people also make a very good living out of cleaning. Some people have had very lucrative businesses doing cleaning. Yes I would be happy if my daughter cleaned houses. I would absolutely not want her to prostitute herself.

Grace in short i have gone over what my initial point was which was simply that besides the trafficked and coerced sex workers you have a bunch of women that do that stuff willingly of their own accord or at least for a certain time frame they do , i guess easy money is the motivation, i hear you thinking whats easy about it but my point is that they choose to do it.

I believe that to be true,

if you disagree thats fine, if you think that "they know not what they do" thats fine, that perhaps someone has hypnotised them or a demon makes them do it or there is something else that somehow diminishes their responsibility and culpability in their decision making that somehow they are not 100 percent responsible for their decisions , thats fine , Cosmo believes they are outta control dumb hoes that need to be taken to the "Dancing like a Stripper" concentration camp for their own good. I guess thats fine too.

i have said what i believe and that is all, otherwise we can all have our own views.

[Grace O'Malley]

perhaps you sound like one of those that like to have her cake and eat it too, or in other words have it both ways so long as it suits you.

im not but i get sick of hypocrisy because to anyone with half a working brain it is obvious that there are women that do that work of their own accord as well as the ones who dont.

as for my comments in the previous quote that you quoted they are not excuses if anything they are shining a light on the hypocritical thinking and rationalising of people whom are complicit in activities of the sex game/industry but somehow pretentiously shift the blame like saying well if it wasnt for the creepy men then women wouldn't have to do this work. The truth is that if you are not trafficked and you dont want to do such work ... guess what = no one is making you.





good luck with that and btw show me one nation that won the war on drugs and dont start bringing up the very strict middle east countries like UAE SA etc because they do all of that stuff in the shadows and in fact the places where there is the most covered up women and strict laws around sex Arab muslim countries guess what are also the countries that have the highest amount of online Porn viewers.

we are going around in circles , ultimately my point was beside the trafficked and coreced there are many women that do that stuff there own free will and i guess my 2nd point concerned societal stigma around the first point which seems to include by some of society that some women and quite a lot actually do that stuff willingly but that this is denied that some people prefer to see it that all those women are unwilling victims or as you put it need to be taken care of like ....

i imagine you singing "somebody come get her she's dancin like a stripper then a couple of goons come take her away to the dumb hoe hooker concentration camp, good luck with that .

You don't even have to look at women that are trafficked. Speaking of women that you say do it willingly. Do you not think they prostitute themselves not because they want to willing do this but because they might have a load of bills piling up and know they can make money by letting men have sex with them? It's not because they enjoy it but because they can easily place an ad and there will be men that pay to use their bodies. Just because there are women that do this it doesn't mean that people should be condoning it and not speaking out about how it is a very dangerous industry and that if they are going to sell their bodies they will very likely have mental health issues from choosing this. What do you mean by hypocrisy? Hypocrisy to me would be someone like one of those religious types that lecture other people while they themselves are visiting prostitutes.

They are plenty of people that will willingly partake in all kinds of activities but just because some might be willing to do this doesn't mean we as a society should not be trying to stop people from engaging in activities that are harmful. There would be people selling children if it was legal. There would be people happy to own slaves if it was legal. There are people that would sell their kidney for money if the could. It does not mean it should be encouraged and supported just because some people want to engage in those activities.

In the end prostitution is exploitation and of course if people have money as in incentive there will be people that would sell their mother. It still doesn't mean it is something that we as a society should support. You can say it is the oldest professions etc but there are plenty of practices in the past that we now think are inhumane and morally wrong that we no longer do like sending children down to work in mines etc. Even in the recent past i.e. the 70s rape was not even taken seriously as a crime because for a lot of the past women were viewed as property and so did not have rights. It is morally wrong to pay for sex with a woman just like it is morally wrong to pay for some poor man's kidney. Where money is involved that doesn't mean the person providing the service is not being dehumanised and abused because they are selling their bodies for money.