View Poll Results: Does hair dye or eye contact change them?

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Thread: hair/eye color and phenotype

  1. #11
    In the forest of mine Inese's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarl View Post
    From what I know, Celtic, and particularly Slavic and Baltic populations have highest frequencies of green eyes.
    No not many people in Baltic countrys have green eyes.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarmata View Post
    I thought that blue eyes are rather common(if not just typical) amongst Slavs, from my personal observations I think that Green-eyes are rather rare amongst Poles/Slavs.
    And you were right. Blue eyes reach about 50% frequency among Poles. Green eyes are rare, and come always second or thrid in every Euro population. However, the relative frequencies are highest among Slavs and Balts according to my literature. Then come the Irish.

    Green eyes reach 20% frequency among the Poles - thats very high.

    Quote Originally Posted by Inese View Post
    No not many people in Baltic countrys have green eyes.
    Well I've got a study by Julian Talko-Hryncewicz on several hundred Letts and Lithuanians, printed in 1912, in Imperial Russia. They blatantly have the highest green eye frequency (over 20%), along with Poles.

    Look, I do not want to undermine your image of Latvia as the "Nordic Heartland". Same study states that Balts are visibly more blonde and fair than Slavs. But, I'd be grateful if you could list me any credible source on Baltic eye pigmentation.

    This peculiar Baltic combination - (almost) Scandinavian-like hair and skin colour means combined with somewhat darker eyes was also noted by Coon:

    The eye color of the Letts as a whole is predominantly light, with pure blues and grays totalling one-third, and predominantly light shades reaching between 57 per cent and 59 per cent; pure brown eyes arc very rare, but. darkmixed eyes are not uncommon. On the whole, the hair color tends to be proportionately lighter than eve color.
    1. Pure blues (15-16) reach 25%, and together with pur grays grays (13-14 on the Martin's scale) they total 33.3%

    2. Total light eyes = 57-59%

    3. Therefore, Blue-mixed and Light Green (10-12 on the same scale) = 57/59% - 33.3% = 24-26%

    Out of the remainin 15% - most are dark green and hazel (7-9 on the Martin's scale).


    This means that green eyes (excluding hazel) reach a frequency of approx 19-20% among Letts.

    P.S.

    Note that Balts have quite lesser freqs of brown eyes than Slavs.
    Last edited by Jarl; 07-12-2009 at 01:54 PM.

  3. #13
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  4. #14
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    Coon on Lithuanians:

    The vast majority of Lithuanians have mixed eyes; only 10 per cent have pure light irises (Martin #15-16), as compared to 25 per cent for Letts; at the same time pure brown eyes number but 3 per cent. On the whole, therefore, one cannot say of the Lithuanians, as of the Finns, Esths, Livs, and Letts. that they are as blond as Scandinavians, but they are still predominantly light. There are probably regional variations of which our present data give us little positive indication.
    So:

    1. Not many pale blue eyes (15-16), but not many brown eyes (1-4)either - majority fall in-between. That obviously means more green eyes. Whether hazel (7), dark green (8-9), or light green (10-12).

    2. Lighter than Poles, darker than Letts - which seems a natural consequence of the general South-to-North European pigmentation gradient.


    By the way, Coon also relied on Julian Talko-Hryncewicz study
    Last edited by Jarl; 07-12-2009 at 01:12 PM.

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    Green is the rarest eye color in the world and is most common in Northern-Europe, but still rare there. I have seen 6 Estonians(2 being pure Estonians) during my lifetime with green eyes. 0 Estonians with brown eyes. Latvia shouldn't be any different.

    There's also a saying here, I don't know if it's very popular, it sounds like this: "If the person doesn't have blue/gray eyes, then he/she isn't Estonian."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Karl View Post
    Green is the rarest eye color in the world and is most common in Northern-Europe, but still rare there. I have seen 6 Estonians(2 being pure Estonians) during my lifetime with green eyes. 0 Estonians with brown eyes. Latvia shouldn't be any different.

    There's also a saying here, I don't know if it's very popular, it sounds like this: "If the person doesn't have blue/gray eyes, then he/she isn't Estonian."
    Well, Scandinavia and Baltic-Finnic populations have the highes blue-eye frequency. That's natural. Isolation, small population size and hunter-gatherer lifstyle (in case of Finnics) promote drift and endogamy. However light-mixed eyes are not uncommon either. And than includes light gray-green or blue-green, and blue/gray with brown patches.

    As for green eyes - here we have a gradation. Beginning from hazel (or brown-green) at 7th degree on the Martin's scale, we go into green-proper. Dark green eyes (usually with small brown elements or aureolas) are usually associated with 8th and 9th degree. Then, 10-to-12, we've got light-mixed eyes. Grey-green, light blue-green, and blue/grey with brown/pigmented elements.


    P.S.

    One other thing. There should be a difference between Finnics and Balts, particularly Lithuanians. Even in spite of the historical assimilation of Finnic Livs by the Letts, in Livonia. All modern living Balts - are Eastern Balts, who until late Antiquity, or early Middle Ages, inhabited areas on the Upper Nemen, Dnieper and Dvina rivers, alongisde with their more Southerly, Slavic neighbours (with whom they mixed quite often, particularly during the Roman Period and early Middle Ages). However, the West Balts, or the Old Prussians, were by all likelihood, a very fair nation.


    But I oversimplified it a bit. Not all 9-to-12 shades are green. Some are blue-mixed.
    Last edited by Jarl; 07-12-2009 at 01:45 PM.

  7. #17
    In the forest of mine Inese's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarl View Post
    Well I've got a study by Julian Talko-Hryncewicz on several hundred Letts and Lithuanians, printed in 1912, in Imperial Russia. They blatantly have the highest green eye frequency (over 20%), along with Poles.

    Look, I do not want to undermine your image of Latvia as the "Nordic Heartland". Same study states that Balts are visibly more blonde and fair than Slavs. But, I'd be grateful if you could list me any credible source on Baltic eye pigmentation.
    Hello. I have no study about green eyes in Latvia but i was living in my country for most time of my life and i can tell you that i never knew much people with green eyes ----- never 20%!! Your old study who is 100 years old is wrong that is what i can tell you very sure okay?? A study is a study and living there is very more meaningful. Most people have shades of blue eyes or a little mixed, but my opinion is that green eyes have not more than 2-3% of Latvians!!

    And with green eyes i understand this


    This means that green eyes (excluding hazel) reach a frequency of approx 19-20% among Letts.[/b]
    Never!! Visit Latvia and look yourself if you dont trust me. Or listen to Karl!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Karl View Post
    Green is the rarest eye color in the world and is most common in Northern-Europe, but still rare there. I have seen 6 Estonians(2 being pure Estonians) during my lifetime with green eyes. 0 Estonians with brown eyes. Latvia shouldn't be any different.
    Yes total right and i have not seen more Latvians with green eyes like Karl in Estonian people. Maximum 10 people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Inese View Post
    And with green eyes i understand this
    Wow, those are very dark green eyes! Almost brown.

  9. #19
    In the forest of mine Inese's Avatar
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    No they are green for me!! But you are right when you add more melanin they will be brown!! Melanin is always bad it makes peoples eyes and skin swarthy. But okay some like it..... ^_^

    Other green eyes

    Last edited by Inese; 07-12-2009 at 02:47 PM.

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    Well, my eyes don't look like that at all.
    They look a bit like this, but with a bit very light green in them. (sorry for the stupid picture)


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