Who are the purest Aryans?

[Heretik]

Perhaps you are too stupid to get it. Perhaps this will reach your mind:
Nordic race = "proto-Indo-European"
"proto-Indo-European" = Aryan
=>
Nordic = Aryan

Yes... six million innocent Jews were slaughtered by people who believed "proto-Indo-Europeans" called themselves Aryan and that they were originally "Nordic" Never again!!!

No, seriously, what the fuck are you talking about?

[aherne]

Actually he was well chosen, because he would have really fit into the Kurgan standard-type variation!

It is the actor Clancy Brown:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erjMZ...eature=related

Typical skull:


Scythians:




Note the very prominent nose - often even more prominent and narrower than in some Corded Ware samples actually, that is really striking for that time in particular and points to a more Southern-warmer orientation, relations to other Aurignacoid forms. Yet they often very robust and had frequently broader face, like today's "Anglo-Saxon" variants or more robust Iranids f.e.

Maybe the samples are skewed, maybe the reconstructions aren't perfect, but the last two figures certainly do not look Scythian at all. Only this one does:


I've noticed that modern people with similar features (including the two Romanians I've exemplified) have light-brown hair, rose skin and blue eyes, which coincides with Roman accounts of how Scythians looked like.

Here is how true Scythians looked like:

[aherne]

Tocharians (an Aryan-derived people which also included foreign elements, ommitted in this gallery of early Aryans):

[Osweo]

the last two figures certainly do not look Scythian at all.

You were there? Was there NO variation among them? Were they all clones from some Hyperborean spaceship?! Heh, I bet I don't look 'English' to you. But I AM!

Here is how true Scythians looked like:

[and some kings etc....]

A modern comparison, would be taking a magazine of fashion models and a few photos of the Royal Family, to say how 'the English' look...

[aherne]

You were there? Was there NO variation among them? Were they all clones from some Hyperborean spaceship?! Heh, I bet I don't look 'English' to you. But I AM!

A modern comparison, would be taking a magazine of fashion models and a few photos of the Royal Family, to say how 'the English' look...

This is a good counterargument, but my point remains. Even though the two reconstructed figures do not look Scythian, they can be Scythian, just that they are un-characteristic.Besides, racial anthropology as well as genetics prove that Scythians had MUCH LESS variation than English people, since they only had one ethnic origin(Aryan) with very minor outside influences. Englishmen are incomparably more complex in origins...

[Matritensis]

Englishmen are incomparably more complex in origins

You say that because we know how England and the English were formed,whereas we have much less information about obscure or prehistoric peoples.90% of history is prehistory,about which we know really next to nothing.I suspect that there are genetic connections in Europe and central Asia that we cannot even imagine.Maybe with the improvement of genetics we'll have some day a clearer picture.

[Agrippa]

Maybe the samples are skewed, maybe the reconstructions aren't perfect, but the last two figures certainly do not look Scythian at all. Only this one does:

They both deviate but rather in a more disharmonious way (first has a reduced midface, second a larger nose), but otherwise they are almost completely the same as the individual you accepted.

I mean the variation between those three is really a minor one compared to every modern European population I know of. No modern European population is more homogenous than these 3 individuals. The two you don't like are just not that ideal - I got this images from Eastern European posters, I can't prove all of them, but I know some from German works as well and from my perspective I simply can't say why they should be that untypical, they are just less harmonious.

But probably some Eastern European members can help to translate the comments of these - and if possible other images I could post, would interest me too actually, because I can't translate it.

Also consider that the Scythians were a people which had tremendous span of time and space - I mean from Central Europe to Mongolia, over thousand years Irano-Scythians can be recorded - minimum!

So it is just obvious they must have had a strong variation and if considering that, they are actually very homogenous most of the time, if there are no obvious admixtures or the stronger deviation in the mentioned Sarmatian groups...

[aherne]

They both deviate but rather in a more disharmonious way (first has a reduced midface, second a larger nose), but otherwise they are almost completely the same as the individual you accepted..

Actually, the only thing they have in common is that they are White. The first looks East Baltid, whereas the second looks like a Middle Easterner. Here is what Coon has to say about Scythians.

About how Scythians portrayed themselves in art:

They show a well-defined type of heavily bearded, long-haired men with prominent, often convex, noses. The browridges are moderately heavy, the eyes deep set. These faces are strikingly reminiscent of types common among northwest Europeans today, in strong contrast to those shown in the art of the Sumerians, Babylonians, and Hittites, which are definitely Near Eastern. The face, therefore, is definitely Nordic, while the body build looks often thick-set and very muscular, but this may be due to the clothing, which includes baggy trousers and jackets with full sleeves. The pointed caps which they wear and the long hair make it impossible to form a useful opinion of their head form, but this is unnecessary, since we may soon discover it from reference to the cranial material. Persian representations of Saka show exactly the same type, depicted by the followers of an entirely different school of art, and hence this type cannot have been an unfounded convention.

So the default type was "Nordic", a term used by Coon to describe Aryan race and its offspring.

About types present among Scythians:

There is, in the anthropometric literature, sufficient data to permit the reconstruction of the Scytho-Sarmatian cranial type or types. The most extensive group, and that which may be used as a basic series, is Donici's collection of seventy-seven Scythian crania from kurgans of Bessarabia, which was one of the favored Scythian pasture lands during the height of their domination.57 (See Appendix I, cot 37.) The fifty-seven male crania of this series are not homogeneous, but fall into two types, a long-headed and a round-headed, with the former greatly in the majority.

One of the peculiarities of the Scythian skulls is a low mesene upper facial index, lower than that of the Kelts or of the Minussinsk people. Donici has shown, however, that this low upper facial index is mostly associated with the brachycephalic element in the group, and the same is true of many of the chamaeconch and mesorrhine skulls. When the brachycephalic element is eliminated, therefore, one finds these skulls to be narrower faced, and narrower nosed, and to fit more nearly into a central European Nordic category. Other series of Scythian crania from southern Russia and from the Caucasus show the same general characteristics as that of Donici's type series, but are in most cases purely dolichocephalic, which leads one to suppose that the brachycephalic element in the Rumanian skulls may have been at least partly of local origin.58

Mind you the ethnocultural border between Aryans and Danubians before the migrations (around 3500 BC) was the Dnepr river, so it is perfectly feasible for Scythians west of this ancient border to be partly of indigenous type (just as Slavs or Germanics of same age were also showing accretion of older elements).

About what their type was:

We have seen that the Scythians and Sarmatians, although they undoubtedly included in their ranks many individuals of different political affiliations, formed nevertheless a quite constant principal racial type, which was essentially Iranian and a form of Nordic. In its characteristic low vault, as in other dimensions, it specifically resembled the earlier eastern European and central Asiatic Nordic form. It was essentially a member of the racial cluster associated with the spread of Satem Indo-European speech in both eastern Europe and Asia.

Which vindicates my oppinion that "Nordic" is just a Semitically-Correct identifier for people inheriting ancestral "Indo-European" racial type.

[Agrippa]

Actually, the only thing they have in common is that they are White.

Compare them with racial types outside of the Cromagnid influenced Nordid-Mediterranid spectrum and you see the difference.

The first looks East Baltid

What is Eastbaltid about her? She has a very long head and prominent-slightly convex nose! She might have a stronger Cromagnoid input, but is actually rather Nordoid/Nordid-Mediterranid.

whereas the second looks like a Middle Easterner. Here is what Coon has to say about Scythians.

That guy looks Iraniomorph, but so do many Eastnordids to this day and he has a long head, strong profile and despite the enlarged nose is rather Nordid-Mediterranid/Irano-Nordoid as well. Don't let the haircut and depiction confuse you - even the nasal shape is not untypical, only enlarged.

Actually they both have a longer head, especially postauricular, than the variant which you called typical.
You said:

Only this one does:

Yet he is the most Dinaroid individual of those three! Looking at the cranium in particular, the other two are more Nordoid/Nordid-Mediterranid/Irano-Nordoid metrically-morphologically.

[Bloodeagle]

Maybe the samples are skewed, maybe the reconstructions aren't perfect, but the last two figures certainly do not look Scythian at all. Only this one does:


I've noticed that modern people with similar features (including the two Romanians I've exemplified) have light-brown hair, rose skin and blue eyes, which coincides with Roman accounts of how Scythians looked like.

Here is how true Scythians looked like:

What about this chap?