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Thread: Bell Beaker examples

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Horten View Post
    16% for Albania, for Albanians in general: about 20%. That's not important though, we're discussing phenotype not Y-DNA. If the case was Y-DNA you would have been right, however. And in that case, Albanians are characteristically close to the Bell Beakers in many ways, especially the Cranium is quite similar to that of the Bell Beakers. Probably due to the selection of Dinaroid traits that had perhaps been introduced by the Bell Beakers but which is also favourable for a mountainous area, at least the same evolutionary tendencies.
    Man wake up! The CI can change in a couple of generation. DNA is what really matters.

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    IRON PILL Panopticon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Capelli View Post
    Man wake up! The CI can change in a couple of generation. DNA is what really matters.
    Sure. But how hard is it to get that Albanians show Dinaroid features similar to Bell Beakers? Are you vaccinated against contextual comprehension? The only argument is that the phenotypes among Albanians are similar to the phenotypes of the Bell Beakers. Agrippa seems to claim that at least. This does not imply a strong genetic continuation between the two, however.

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    Veteran Member Anthropologique's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ameno View Post
    Dienekes quoted him.I suppose he is laughable to you too.

    Anyway,R1b in Western Europe is because of founder effect/genetic drift they didn't left much of autosomal impact.In WestAsia/Northern Mesopotamia the diversity is higher and the clades are older.So it is obviously that they will resemble more the early Bell Beakers.
    Well, Dienekes uses him for comparative purposes. I really doubt he agrees with much of what Coon wrote.

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    Veteran Member Ibericus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ameno View Post
    Anyway,R1b in Western Europe is because of founder effect/genetic drift they didn't left much of autosomal impact.
    It's imposible to not left autosomal impact, when we are talking about 60-70% of paternal lineages in Western Europe ! In fact, there is a high correlation between R1b and the autosomal components like Western-Euro or Atlanto-Med

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    Veteran Member Anthropologique's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Horten View Post
    Sure. But how hard is it to get that Albanians show Dinaroid features similar to Bell Beakers? Are you vaccinated against contextual comprehension? The only argument is that the phenotypes among Albanians are similar to the phenotypes of the Bell Beakers. Agrippa seems to claim that at least. This does not imply a strong genetic continuation between the two, however.
    Where's the evidence?

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    Veteran Member Ibericus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Horten View Post
    Sure. But how hard is it to get that Albanians show Dinaroid features similar to Bell Beakers? Are you vaccinated against contextual comprehension? The only argument is that the phenotypes among Albanians are similar to the phenotypes of the Bell Beakers. Agrippa seems to claim that at least. This does not imply a strong genetic continuation between the two, however.
    But if Bell Beakers are so similar to Albanians, why they weren't part of the Bell Beaker Culture ? Sounds surrealistic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthropologique View Post
    Well, Dienekes uses him for comparative purposes. I really doubt he agrees with much of what Coon wrote.
    He quoted only the part of description of Bell Beaker remains.Anyway i didn't quote solely Coon or implying something.You are free to disclaim anything.

    And i disagree with you R1b==Atlantic.It is obviously that they were WestAsian intruders so their autosomal diluted by time by breeding with local womens.

    By the way i don't agree that Albanians would be the closest to Bell Beakers.That is far fetched IMO.

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    Bell Beaker had nothing to do with Albania or other Balkan regions. It was mainly a Western European cultural phenomenon.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthropologique View Post
    Where's the evidence?
    Archaeological evidence. Bell Beaker remains were primarily Dinaroid-Cromagnoid.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthropologique View Post
    Bell Beaker had nothing to do with Albania or other Balkan regions. It was mainly a Western European cultural phenomenon.
    Bell Beaker populations did actually penetrate into the Balkans. No, it was not part of the Bell Beaker culture, but that Bell Beaker element did travel to the Balkans. Along with it came that basically Dinaroid-Cromagnoid element of the Bell Beakers. It is worth to mention that while the Bell Beakers also came to the Balkans, the Bell Beakers also were in Central Europe through which that Bell Beaker element has further influenced the Balkans.

    http://www.bris.ac.uk/archanth/staff/heyd/Krakow1.pdf

    Quote Originally Posted by Ibericus View Post
    But if Bell Beakers are so similar to Albanians, why they weren't part of the Bell Beaker Culture ? Sounds surrealistic.
    They were influenced by it. I explain that above and I included a pdf which speaks of archaeological evidence of Bell Beaker presence in the Balkans.

    To lay this down. The original statement was that Albanians are the population that is the closest to the old Bell Beakers in phenotype. The Bell Beakers were basically Dinaroid-Cromagnoid, therefore the premise is that for the Albanians to be close to the Bell Beakers by phenotype they would have had to be a basically Dinaroid-Cromagnoid population, which they are.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Horten View Post
    Bell Beaker populations did actually penetrate into the Balkans. No, it was not part of the Bell Beaker culture, but that Bell Beaker element did travel to the Balkans. .
    Man, you are contradicting yourself. If the Bell Beaker populations penetrated into the Balkans, that means the Bell Beakers was not related to balkans.

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