Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 14

Thread: There Is No Hell!

  1. #1
    New Member
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Last Online
    02-11-2013 @ 10:58 PM
    Meta-Ethnicity
    USA
    Ethnicity
    USA
    Country
    United States
    Gender
    Posts
    10
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 0
    Given: 0

    0 Not allowed!

    Default There Is No Hell!

    Paul’s usage of the Greek word for body is “soma.” “Soma” is not something external to a man himself, something he has, it is what he is. Indeed, “soma” is the nearest equivalent to our word personality. To believe in the resurrection of the “soma,” means to believe that my human self, the human being that “I” am, will be restored to life again. I will not be someone different from who I am now, but I will be exclusively myself. God has committed himself to preserving my individuality, personality, and character. The term body “soma” is simply a synonym for “person.” The goal of God’s redemption is not the destruction of his first creation, but its restoration to its original perfection. This is why the Scripture speaks of the resurrection of the body “soma” rather than of the creation of new beings. Both death and resurrection affect the total person “soma.” The resurrected persons “soma” will be the same individuals as those who existed previously on earth.


    Being created in the image of God means that we must view ourselves as intrinsically valuable and richly invested with meaning, potentially and responsibilities. We are to be and to do on a finite scale, what God is and does on an infinite scale. By virtue of being created in the image of God, human beings are capable of reflecting his character in their own life; animals possess none of these qualities. What distinguishes people from animals is the fact that human nature inherently has godlike possibilities. Omniscience omnipotence, or omnipresence, none of these other divine attributes have been ascribed to man as part of the image of God. We have been created to reflect God in our thinking and actions, but the physical sustained by God and dependent upon him for our existence in this world and in the world to come. Developing a godly character in this present life, this will be our personal identity in the world to come. It is the character or personality that we have developed in this life, that God preserves in his memory.


    Breath of life and the living soul; man’s soul is in his blood and indeed his blood is his soul. He is kept in being [alive] as a living soul by the inhalation of oxygen out of the air. Man’s soul depends on this intake of oxygen and the blood, but the cessation of breathing results in the death of the soul, because the blood, which is equated with the soul, no longer receives the oxygen that is so vital for life. Breathing is seen as a manifestation of the sustaining power of God. Man became a living soul does not mean that at creation his body was endowed with an immortal soul, a separate entity, distinct from the body. Rather, it means that as a result of the divine inbreathing of the “breath of life” into the lifeless body, man became a living, breathing being. The heart began to beat, the blood to circulate, the brain to think, and all the vital signs of life were activated. A living soul means a living being. Not through the implantation of an immaterial, immortal soul into his material, mortal body, but through the animating principle of life “breath of life” conferred on him by God himself.


    In the Old Testament, the word “sheol” is the underground depository of the dead. There are no immaterial, immortal souls in sheol, simply because the soul does not survive the death of the body. Nowhere in the Old Testament is the abode of the dead regarded as a place of punishment or torment. The concept of an infernal ‘hell’ developed in Israel only during the Hellenistic period. The condition of the dead in sheol, the realm of the dead, is one of unconsciousness, inactivity, a rest or sleep that will continue until they are resurrected. The prospect that one day a vast number of people will be consigned to the everlasting torment of hell is most disturbing. Traditionalists read “eternal punishment” as “eternal punishing.” When the adjective “aionios” meaning eternal or everlasting, is used in the Greek with nouns of action, it has reference to the result of the action, not the process. The wicked will not be passing through a process of punishment forever, but will be punished once and for all with eternal results. The destruction of the wicked is eternal “aionios,” not because the process of destruction continues forever, but because the results are permanent. “Eternal” often refers to the permanence of the result, rather than the continuation of a process. It is evident that the fire that destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah is eternal, not because of its duration, but because of its permanent results.


    “And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire” (Jude 23a). The fire to which Jude refers is obviously the same kind of fire that consumed Sodom and Gomorrah. It is evident that the fire that destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah is eternal, not because of its duration, but because of its permanent results. It is important to note that the Greek word “aionios” literally means “lasting for an age.” Roman emperors being described as “aionios”; what is meant is that they held their office for life. Unfortunately, the English words “eternal” or “everlasting” do not accurately render the meaning of “aionios”, which literally means “age-lasting.” The notion of the eternal torment of the wicked can only be defended by accepting the Greek view of the immortality and indestructibility of the soul, a concept which is foreign to Scripture. Everlasting torture is intolerable from a moral point of view, because it pictures God acting like a bloodthirsty monster who maintains an everlasting Auschwitz for his enemies, whom he does not even allow to die. Consider the moral implications of the traditional view of hell, which depicts God as a cruel torturer who torments the wicked throughout all eternity. The thought of such a torment being deliberately inflicted by divine decree, is totally incompatible with the idea of God as infinite love.


    Many Christians will be sorely disappointed to discover that their beliefs in the afterlife are a delusion. When this happens, it will cause personal crisis to Christians accustom to believing that at death their souls break loose from their bodies and continue to exist either in Heaven or in the torment of Hell. Redemption is the restoration of the whole person, and not the salvation of the soul apart from the body. If at death the soul of the believer goes up immediately to Heaven to be with Jesus, one hardly can have any real sense of expectation for Jesus to come down to raise the dead believers that were in Jesus, and transform the living believers that are in Jesus. Traditionally, evangelical and other religious persuasions teach, that at the resurrection, their material bodies are reunited with their souls, thus intensifying the pleasure of Heaven or the pain of Hell. Why are evangelicals so adamant in refusing to reconsider the Biblical teachings on the restoration of the whole person? To abandon souls being reunited with their bodies, also entails abandoning a whole cluster of doctrines resulting form it. The total impact of dividing humans into body and soul has promoted all sorts of false dichotomies in Scripture. To be an “Evangelical” means to uphold certain fundamental traditional doctrines without questioning. Any one who dares to question the Biblical validity of a traditional doctrine can become suspect as a “heretic.” It is impossible to estimate the far-reaching impact that the doctrine of unending hellfire has had throughout the centuries in justifying religious intolerance, torture, and the burning of “heretics.” The rationale is simple: If God is going to burn heretics in Hell for all eternity, why shouldn’t the church burn them to death now?

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Last Online
    10-30-2013 @ 07:31 PM
    Location
    Kentucky
    Meta-Ethnicity
    white
    Ethnicity
    american
    Ancestry
    somewhere?
    Country
    United States
    Region
    Kentucky
    Taxonomy
    northwest european cm+ slight nordid
    Politics
    N/A
    Religion
    athiest
    Age
    28
    Gender
    Posts
    765
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 8
    Given: 0

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    you really need to read other books that are based on facts and such

  3. #3
    AstroPlumber arcticwolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Last Online
    09-21-2014 @ 12:30 AM
    Location
    Space
    Meta-Ethnicity
    Ugric
    Ethnicity
    Hun
    Country
    Hungary
    Politics
    CommonSense
    Religion
    Direct Reality
    Gender
    Posts
    8,893
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 4,197
    Given: 3,880

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    Well. The Atheists and their religion. There is nothing, no consequences to all their actions after they die. Wouldn't that be nice? If only the nature has cooperated. I know of no single thing material or non material that escapes the law of cause and effect. That we can't see past death yet proves nothing. Ignorance of the full picture is no proof. Atheists think that Theists is all there is, wrong. Buddhists don't believe in God, don't believe in anything, don't even use faith at all. Here is the reality, every single thought, word and action has consequences. There is nothing that can exist without underlying causes. Every cause HAS TO have an effect when the conditions are right for it to manifest itself.

    As to "There is no hell" I wouldn't be so sure. Ethics is like gravity, it is the law. Whatever humans understand of it or not has no effect whether it operates or not. Gravity does not care if you believe in it or not, neither does the law of ethics. They both are going to work without your consent or understanding. The consequences of your foolish ( evil ) actions will take place regardless what you believe, the cause has to have its effect. There is no running from it in space or time.

    Call it whatever you want, you'll experience the consequences of your actions. There is no way around it. Better make sure you know what you are doing and the ethical consequences of it, there is a hell to pay.

  4. #4
    Benevolent Member
    Apricity Funding Member
    "Friend of Apricity"

    Fortis in Arduis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Last Online
    03-17-2018 @ 02:18 PM
    Location
    Somerset
    Meta-Ethnicity
    Celto-Germanic
    Ethnicity
    English
    Ancestry
    England, Scotland, Pan-Germania and Spanish Gypsies (Gitanos)
    Country
    England
    Region
    England
    Taxonomy
    sub-nordic
    Politics
    Co-operative Economics, Direct Democracy
    Hero
    The Absolute
    Religion
    Advaita Vedānta
    Age
    36
    Gender
    Posts
    7,653
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 3,469
    Given: 8,126

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    Yes, and what was the stuff about bodies being living souls, which die a permanent physical death, and there being no such thing as the eternal soul? Bla bla bla...


    Lettuce, Gruyere, Bacon and Tomato Pride, WorldWide!!





  5. #5
    Veteran Member The Lawspeaker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Last Online
    11-05-2023 @ 04:45 AM
    Meta-Ethnicity
    Celto-Germanic
    Ethnicity
    Dutch
    Ancestry
    Brabant, Holland, Guelders and some Hainaut.
    Country
    Netherlands
    Politics
    Norway Deal-NEXIT, Dutch Realm Atlanticist, Habsburg Legitimist
    Religion
    Sedevacantist
    Relationship Status
    Engaged
    Age
    36
    Gender
    Posts
    70,127
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 34,729
    Given: 61,129

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    Who told you that ? Of course there is: see you downstairs.

    Regards,

    Satan



    Wake up and smell the coffee.


  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Last Online
    10-30-2013 @ 07:31 PM
    Location
    Kentucky
    Meta-Ethnicity
    white
    Ethnicity
    american
    Ancestry
    somewhere?
    Country
    United States
    Region
    Kentucky
    Taxonomy
    northwest european cm+ slight nordid
    Politics
    N/A
    Religion
    athiest
    Age
    28
    Gender
    Posts
    765
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 8
    Given: 0

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    [QUOTE=arcticwolf;1005756]Well. The Atheists and their religion. There is nothing, no consequences to all their actions after they die. Wouldn't that be nice? If only the nature has cooperated. I know of no single thing material or non material that escapes the law of cause and effect. That we can't see past death yet proves nothing. Ignorance of the full picture is no proof. Atheists think that Theists is all there is, wrong. Buddhists don't believe in God, don't believe in anything, don't even use faith at all. Here is the reality, every single thought, word and action has consequences. There is nothing that can exist without underlying causes. Every cause HAS TO have an effect when the conditions are right for it to manifest itself.

    The hard truth of the matter is that all "you" are is a pattern of nuerons in your brain that react to outside stimuli so when your brain dies-"YOU" die. So there cannot be consequences for such a temporary state of being since the chemicals in your brain are always in constant flux. Lastly what i am trying to say is that there is no permanent "you" that can have consequences after you die.

  7. #7
    Insufferable by many Apricity Funding Member
    "Friend of Apricity"


    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Last Online
    @
    Ethnicity
    -
    Country
    Antarctica
    Politics
    Bros over hoes
    Gender
    Posts
    18,698
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 11,269
    Given: 13,631

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    [QUOTE=ricko0812;1005965]
    Quote Originally Posted by arcticwolf View Post
    Well. The Atheists and their religion. There is nothing, no consequences to all their actions after they die. Wouldn't that be nice? If only the nature has cooperated. I know of no single thing material or non material that escapes the law of cause and effect. That we can't see past death yet proves nothing. Ignorance of the full picture is no proof. Atheists think that Theists is all there is, wrong. Buddhists don't believe in God, don't believe in anything, don't even use faith at all. Here is the reality, every single thought, word and action has consequences. There is nothing that can exist without underlying causes. Every cause HAS TO have an effect when the conditions are right for it to manifest itself.

    The hard truth of the matter is that all "you" are is a pattern of nuerons in your brain that react to outside stimuli so when your brain dies-"YOU" die. So there cannot be consequences for such a temporary state of being since the chemicals in your brain are always in constant flux. Lastly what i am trying to say is that there is no permanent "you" that can have consequences after you die.
    Ricko, do you think that in some distant future humans will develop technology to teleport themselves?

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Last Online
    10-30-2013 @ 07:31 PM
    Location
    Kentucky
    Meta-Ethnicity
    white
    Ethnicity
    american
    Ancestry
    somewhere?
    Country
    United States
    Region
    Kentucky
    Taxonomy
    northwest european cm+ slight nordid
    Politics
    N/A
    Religion
    athiest
    Age
    28
    Gender
    Posts
    765
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 8
    Given: 0

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    Ricko, do you think that in some distant future humans will develop technology to teleport themselves?[/QUOTE]

    Im sure we will someday.

  9. #9
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Last Online
    07-13-2012 @ 06:15 PM
    Location
    America
    Meta-Ethnicity
    Finno-Ugric, Celtic
    Ethnicity
    Finnish, Scottish, Irish
    Ancestry
    Finland, Ireland, Scotland
    Country
    United States
    Region
    West Viginia
    Taxonomy
    Arctic Nordid
    Politics
    Independent
    Religion
    Sedevacantist Catholic
    Gender
    Posts
    164
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 3
    Given: 0

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by newnature View Post
    Paul’s usage of the Greek word for body is “soma.” “Soma” is not something external to a man himself, something he has, it is what he is. Indeed, “soma” is the nearest equivalent to our word personality. To believe in the resurrection of the “soma,” means to believe that my human self, the human being that “I” am, will be restored to life again. I will not be someone different from who I am now, but I will be exclusively myself. God has committed himself to preserving my individuality, personality, and character. The term body “soma” is simply a synonym for “person.” The goal of God’s redemption is not the destruction of his first creation, but its restoration to its original perfection. This is why the Scripture speaks of the resurrection of the body “soma” rather than of the creation of new beings. Both death and resurrection affect the total person “soma.” The resurrected persons “soma” will be the same individuals as those who existed previously on earth.
    Being created in the image of God means that we must view ourselves as intrinsically valuable and richly invested with meaning, potentially and responsibilities. We are to be and to do on a finite scale, what God is and does on an infinite scale. By virtue of being created in the image of God, human beings are capable of reflecting his character in their own life; animals possess none of these qualities. What distinguishes people from animals is the fact that human nature inherently has godlike possibilities. Omniscience omnipotence, or omnipresence, none of these other divine attributes have been ascribed to man as part of the image of God. We have been created to reflect God in our thinking and actions, but the physical sustained by God and dependent upon him for our existence in this world and in the world to come. Developing a godly character in this present life, this will be our personal identity in the world to come. It is the character or personality that we have developed in this life, that God preserves in his memory.
    Breath of life and the living soul; man’s soul is in his blood and indeed his blood is his soul. He is kept in being [alive] as a living soul by the inhalation of oxygen out of the air. Man’s soul depends on this intake of oxygen and the blood, but the cessation of breathing results in the death of the soul, because the blood, which is equated with the soul, no longer receives the oxygen that is so vital for life. Breathing is seen as a manifestation of the sustaining power of God. Man became a living soul does not mean that at creation his body was endowed with an immortal soul, a separate entity, distinct from the body. Rather, it means that as a result of the divine inbreathing of the “breath of life” into the lifeless body, man became a living, breathing being. The heart began to beat, the blood to circulate, the brain to think, and all the vital signs of life were activated. A living soul means a living being. Not through the implantation of an immaterial, immortal soul into his material, mortal body, but through the animating principle of life “breath of life” conferred on him by God himself.
    In the Old Testament, the word “sheol” is the underground depository of the dead. There are no immaterial, immortal souls in sheol, simply because the soul does not survive the death of the body. Nowhere in the Old Testament is the abode of the dead regarded as a place of punishment or torment. The concept of an infernal ‘hell’ developed in Israel only during the Hellenistic period. The condition of the dead in sheol, the realm of the dead, is one of unconsciousness, inactivity, a rest or sleep that will continue until they are resurrected. The prospect that one day a vast number of people will be consigned to the everlasting torment of hell is most disturbing. Traditionalists read “eternal punishment” as “eternal punishing.” When the adjective “aionios” meaning eternal or everlasting, is used in the Greek with nouns of action, it has reference to the result of the action, not the process. The wicked will not be passing through a process of punishment forever, but will be punished once and for all with eternal results. The destruction of the wicked is eternal “aionios,” not because the process of destruction continues forever, but because the results are permanent. “Eternal” often refers to the permanence of the result, rather than the continuation of a process. It is evident that the fire that destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah is eternal, not because of its duration, but because of its permanent results.
    “And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire” (Jude 23a). The fire to which Jude refers is obviously the same kind of fire that consumed Sodom and Gomorrah. It is evident that the fire that destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah is eternal, not because of its duration, but because of its permanent results. It is important to note that the Greek word “aionios” literally means “lasting for an age.” Roman emperors being described as “aionios”; what is meant is that they held their office for life. Unfortunately, the English words “eternal” or “everlasting” do not accurately render the meaning of “aionios”, which literally means “age-lasting.” The notion of the eternal torment of the wicked can only be defended by accepting the Greek view of the immortality and indestructibility of the soul, a concept which is foreign to Scripture. Everlasting torture is intolerable from a moral point of view, because it pictures God acting like a bloodthirsty monster who maintains an everlasting Auschwitz for his enemies, whom he does not even allow to die. Consider the moral implications of the traditional view of hell, which depicts God as a cruel torturer who torments the wicked throughout all eternity. The thought of such a torment being deliberately inflicted by divine decree, is totally incompatible with the idea of God as infinite love.
    Many Christians will be sorely disappointed to discover that their beliefs in the afterlife are a delusion. When this happens, it will cause personal crisis to Christians accustom to believing that at death their souls break loose from their bodies and continue to exist either in Heaven or in the torment of Hell. Redemption is the restoration of the whole person, and not the salvation of the soul apart from the body. If at death the soul of the believer goes up immediately to Heaven to be with Jesus, one hardly can have any real sense of expectation for Jesus to come down to raise the dead believers that were in Jesus, and transform the living believers that are in Jesus. Traditionally, evangelical and other religious persuasions teach, that at the resurrection, their material bodies are reunited with their souls, thus intensifying the pleasure of Heaven or the pain of Hell. Why are evangelicals so adamant in refusing to reconsider the Biblical teachings on the restoration of the whole person? To abandon souls being reunited with their bodies, also entails abandoning a whole cluster of doctrines resulting form it. The total impact of dividing humans into body and soul has promoted all sorts of false dichotomies in Scripture. To be an “Evangelical” means to uphold certain fundamental traditional doctrines without questioning. Any one who dares to question the Biblical validity of a traditional doctrine can become suspect as a “heretic.” It is impossible to estimate the far-reaching impact that the doctrine of unending hellfire has had throughout the centuries in justifying religious intolerance, torture, and the burning of “heretics.” The rationale is simple: If God is going to burn heretics in Hell for all eternity, why shouldn’t the church burn them to death now?
    '

    What is this bullshit

  10. #10
    Insufferable by many Apricity Funding Member
    "Friend of Apricity"


    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Last Online
    @
    Ethnicity
    -
    Country
    Antarctica
    Politics
    Bros over hoes
    Gender
    Posts
    18,698
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 11,269
    Given: 13,631

    0 Not allowed!

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ricko0812 View Post
    Im sure we will someday.
    Well that is the problem between thinking of an atheist and theist. You observe everything in terms of matter and energy. Why is so easy to think that because fundamental particles arranged in humans over time differently than in stones, wood, iron... made us aware? Because that is all we know?
    As you can see I asked human teleportation not teleportation in general.
    Yes, I think that teleportation technology will be developed in near future which will enable teleportation of objects and people but I do not see why once humans are disintegrated in fundamental particles and transferred to another place should come out alive.

    You are observing awareness too objectively.
    From an objective viewpoint, the brain is relatively comprehensible. When you look at this page, there is a whir of processing: photons strike your retina, electrical signals are passed up your optic nerve and between different areas of your brain, and eventually you might respond with a smile, a perplexed frown or a remark. But there is also a subjective aspect. When you look at the page, you are conscious of it, directly experiencing the images and words as part of your private, mental life. You have vivid impressions of colored flowers and vibrant sky. At the same time, you may be feeling some emotions and forming some thoughts. Together such experiences make up consciousness: the subjective, inner life of the mind."
    Is it so hard to believe that there is something transcendental to human nature and awareness?
    By the very same thinking some scientists observe origin of life too objectively despite the fact that many theories and experiments have flaws in describing the origin of life.
    As some Nobel prize winner in medicine said ( I think it was Jack Szostak ) "If we can create the exact scenario of the origin of life in the lab it does not mean that any life should arise from it" ( something like that )
    Last edited by Insuperable; 07-10-2012 at 11:19 PM.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Where da hell is Aemma?
    By Aemma in forum The Lounge
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 04-10-2010, 04:05 AM
  2. Hell
    By Martin Timothy in forum Religion & Spirituality
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 08-23-2009, 09:20 AM
  3. What a hell is going on lately?
    By Radojica in forum Off-topic
    Replies: 27
    Last Post: 08-19-2009, 04:58 PM
  4. What the hell should I do?
    By MarcvSS in forum The Lounge
    Replies: 38
    Last Post: 02-21-2009, 11:05 PM
  5. A Crow in Hell.
    By Beorn in forum Technology
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 12-29-2008, 12:31 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •