The Mandeans(Last gnostic Semites of Iraq)

[StonyArabia]

The Mandeans

The religion's origin is difficult to reconstruct, as there is so much unknown. They could be a continuation of traditions from Mesopotamia, or Palestine, or both. The Mandean religion could be pre-Christian, or it could date to 1st or 2nd century CE. It could actually be John the Baptist who founded the sect, or they could be a continuation of the Jewish sect that John the Baptist belonged to (guessed by some to be the Essenes).
However, elements of their language indicate that the community is of Jewish origin.
One of the texts of the Mandeans tell about a flight of a group called 'Nasoreans', from areas that probably were in today's Jordan, to the Mesopotamian region, in the times of the Jewish wars following the destruction of Jerusalem in year 70 CE. The Mandeans appears first to have gained a strong position in Babylon, but lost this with the appearance of the Sassinids in year 226. In the time of Mani, there have been contacts between him and the Mandeans, resulting in both love and hate.With the arrival of Islam in Iraq in 636, the Mandeans were considered as the third 'people of the book', as the mysterious Sabians of the Koran.But the Mandeans still faced a difficult relationship with Islam, and Muhammad is in their writings called the 'demon Bizbat'. The Mandeans moved from the cities to the marshlands in Southern Iraq. It is first in modern times that the Mandeans have moved back to the cities, especially Nasiriyya, Baghdad and Basra, where many of them work as gold and silver smiths, iron smiths and boat buildersMandeans are also found in medium-sized towns between Baghdad and Basra. Some small groups of Mandeans even live in Iran, in cities like Ahvaz and Shushtar in the southwestern corner of the country.Today Mandean theology is seriously threatened, as recruiting new priests is difficult, and many offices are vacant. Mandean laymen are often highly educated, but know little of the old language and the scripts, and they attend ceremonies only seldom, as in weddings. Yet, there is a strong feeling of pride of their heritage, and they often claim to belong to a religion older than Judaism, Christianity and Islam.


Genetically the Mandeans are a Mesopotamian people and the closest kith and kin to Assyrians.
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[RUHA]

Excellent post, it does however miss one very prominent point, this story was told to me by my grandmother, so its origins may not be accurate but at the time of conflict in Modern Iraq 633. The Mandeans were slaughtered as there were summary executions of the Mandeans by Islam at the time, due to the fact that early Islam required one of three either conversion or the tip of the Sword, pay dues (Jaziyah) or be one of the three major religions, including the Sabbians. The story goes on as the rivers flooded with the blood of innocent Mandeans that could not even defend themselves due to the pacifism they believe in and because they simply cannot convert because their souls would be damned for an eternity, hence death was the only choice for these poor people.
As this slaughter continued a group of learned Mandean heads met with the conquering troops of Islam and took our holy book to show the Muslim Emir, whom did accept and verify the faith as the third Major religion of the Quran after Christianity and Judaism or otherwise known as Sabbians. I have no idea from, where Mohammad is called a demon or any other name that is not appropriate of a prophet, but I know that many consider him as the saviour in a way because if the slaughter would have continued, Mandeans would not exist today.

"Genetically the Mandeans are a Mesopotamian people and the closest kith and kin to Assyrians. " I would like to challenge this statement strongly.

[Genn]

"Genetically the Mandeans are a Mesopotamian people and the closest kith and kin to Assyrians. " I would like to challenge this statement strongly.

I've only seen the results of two Mandaean individuals and their genetic distances are fairly close to other Mesopotamians. Have you tested at any of the major companies (23andMe, FTDNA, Ancestry)? Two individuals aren't representative of an entire population, but I haven't come across any studies relating to their genetics other than this paper, which only looked at mitochondrial data.

For what it's worth, I posted the following comment a while back and noted that both the Mandaeans were closest to Iranian Jews. It's only based on a sample of 6 Assyrians, 10 Iraqi and 4 Iranian Jews:
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/sho...=1#post2452776

[RUHA]

Excellent empirical data, however it needs to be rectified by more samples. very interesting indeed.

[ZephyrousMandaru]

Excellent empirical data, however it needs to be rectified by more samples. very interesting indeed.

There's two Iraqi Mandaeans in GED Match's database. You could rectify it by purchasing an Autosomal DNA kit. I highly, HIGHLY recommend you do.

http://www.23andMe.com/

I implore you to sign up for an account on a forum called Anthrogenica.

Neighbor-Joining Trees













Eurogenes SPA Plot



Harappa Ancestry Project Results For Assyrians and Two Mandaeans (I'm ASY5)



Dodecad Ancestry Project Results For An Assyrian and Mandaean



Family Tree DNA's Population Finder Results For A Mandaean And Assyrian

[random]

They look like average iraqis.

[The King, I am]

what a good looking bunch

[Anglojew]

I'm genetically related to them. They're Judeans (maybe the Assyrian link implies a Samaritan origin?)

[Anglojew]

They look like average iraqis.

They look like ancient Judeans.

[Anglojew]

Excellent post, it does however miss one very prominent point, this story was told to me by my grandmother, so its origins may not be accurate but at the time of conflict in Modern Iraq 633. The Mandeans were slaughtered as there were summary executions of the Mandeans by Islam at the time, due to the fact that early Islam required one of three either conversion or the tip of the Sword, pay dues (Jaziyah) or be one of the three major religions, including the Sabbians. The story goes on as the rivers flooded with the blood of innocent Mandeans that could not even defend themselves due to the pacifism they believe in and because they simply cannot convert because their souls would be damned for an eternity, hence death was the only choice for these poor people.
As this slaughter continued a group of learned Mandean heads met with the conquering troops of Islam and took our holy book to show the Muslim Emir, whom did accept and verify the faith as the third Major religion of the Quran after Christianity and Judaism or otherwise known as Sabbians. I have no idea from, where Mohammad is called a demon or any other name that is not appropriate of a prophet, but I know that many consider him as the saviour in a way because if the slaughter would have continued, Mandeans would not exist today.

"Genetically the Mandeans are a Mesopotamian people and the closest kith and kin to Assyrians. " I would like to challenge this statement strongly.

What do Mandeans think of Jews and Israel?