Normandy 1944 and now.

[Jarl]

I see they were really concerned about the Poles, since they immediately rushed to their protection
Not to mention that the Soviets, became their buddies after taking half of Poland

They physically could not do anything. All that could have been done was a French counter at the German border along Siegfried line. However, France was not prepared for a military offensive. Noone was prepared for war and noone was expecting German threats would result in unexpected invasion and blitzkrieg.

No. The Soviets were German buddies... to the extent that Stalin, day before invasion, could not believe in Barbarossa operation. A German soldier who crossed the border to warn the Soviets was shot for being a provocateur.

1. Treaty of Rapallo - 1922

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Rapallo,_1922

2. Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact - 1939

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov...ibbentrop_Pact

3. German–Soviet Treaty of Friendship, Cooperation and Demarcation

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%...endship_Treaty

4. German–Soviet Commercial Agreement - 1940

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%...greement_(1940)

5. German–Soviet Border and Commercial Agreement - 1941

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%...cial_Agreement



Soviets, so much feared and hated by Lloyd George and Churchill, became buddies with the English after German invasion of Soviet Union. Their "friendship" was forced by the circumstances and evaporated immediately after WWII.

[Jäger]

It is your country that marched into Poland, causing World War II.

And the Afghanistan War, Gulf War I & II, Korea, and Vietnam!

So as to blame it all on the British, Jäger, is weak.

Huh? Where did I do that? Liar.

They didn't march into Poland. Germany did.

They marched into America, which ultimately lead to every war on earth thereafter

And immediately after you arrived on this forum you began to talk about the Poles and the Italians. Lebensraum.

Lebensraum was brought up by some Pole, I see they are still a little touchy there
All I said was that I like Poles and Italians

We have heard it all before- and thank God your compatriots here (we have some great Germans here on this forum too) would not agree with you.

Luckily I am not on a quest for agreement here up

Noone was prepared for war and noone was expecting German threats would result in unexpected invasion and blitzkrieg.

I see, that's why they agreed to military aid, because they didn't think it would actually become reality

No. The Soviets were German buddies

Which makes sense, since both attacked Poland, what doesn't make sense is that the English ally with with an aggressive force that did the same thing the Germans did which drew them into the conflict to begin with.
Well, it does make sense, if the goal was the destruction of Germany, and not the concern about Polish people.

[Jarl]

Which makes sense, since both attacked Poland, what doesn't make sense is that the English ally with with an aggressive force that did the same thing the Germans did which drew them into the conflict to begin with.
Well, it does make sense, if the goal was the destruction of Germany, and not the concern about Polish people.

No. Actually it does not make any sense. Could you re-write it please?

[Poltergeist]

And the Afghanistan War, Gulf War I & II, Korea, and Vietnam!

As if one misdeed were justifiable with another misdeed someone else did. Don't be ridiculous.

[The Lawspeaker]

And the Afghanistan War, Gulf War I & II, Korea, and Vietnam!

Has nothing to do with WW2.

Huh? Where did I do that? Liar.

Hmm- where was it again ? Ooh here:

How long did it take until the English put their words into actions and actually attacked Germany?

Luckily, everything went well and we now have a dying Europe, exactly what the British ever wished for ...

Lebensraum was brought up by some Pole, I see they are still a little touchy there
All I said was that I like Poles and Italians

No you spoke of taking over their lands and how hard it was to Germanize them.
That's what you said. So don't call me a liar.

Luckily I am not on a quest for agreement here up

No - you are just another troll.

I see, that's why they agreed to military aid, because they didn't think it would actually become reality

Yes like in 1914 when the Germans attacked neutral Belgium. Which caused Britain to activate the 1839 Treaty of London and declare war on you lot.
Andenne, Leuven (EDIT: glad to see that the British are finally using the Dutch rather then the French name).. the list of German atrocities in Belgium alone is staggering.

Which makes sense, since both attacked Poland, what doesn't make sense is that the English ally with with an aggressive force that did the same thing the Germans did which drew them into the conflict to begin with.
Well, it does make sense, if the goal was the destruction of Germany, and not the concern about Polish people.

And you didn't blame it all on the British ?

[Jäger]

As if one misdeed were justifiable with another misdeed someone else did. Don't be ridiculous.

Has nothing to do with WW2.

That was not my line of thought, but without WW2 it is highly unlikely that these wars would have happened, do you agree?
Then of course we must be responsible for these too, right?

Hmm- where was it again ? Ooh here:

No, not there, that the British wished for it, doesn't mean they can take all the credit for it

No you spoke of taking over their lands and how hard it was to Germanize them.

The pole cited them from Skadi, I didn't bring them up. I said, I didn't bring it up, and this was correct. Dum Dum.

And you didn't blame it all on the British ?

Contrary to you, I am aware that mono-causality is non existent in reality. :nod

[Groenewolf]

Which proved to be Germany. Poland got invaded on September 1, 1939. The British and French responded with an ultimatum and after the deadline ended on, for Britain, 11 o' clock on September 3, 1939 Britain declared war on Germany with France following at 14.30 Paris Time (if I remember correctly).
They didn't declare war for no reason did they ?

They did not declare war on the USSR however who also atacked Poland at the same time. Besides they could not keep those commitments. Camberlain did not used the time bought at Munich to build up the Britisch military might and the French where practicly locked up in the Montreforte-line. the Polish fought bravely no doubt, but they where left under the tender mercies of uncle Stalin and his succesors.

[The Lawspeaker]

They did not declare war on the USSR however who also atacked Poland at the same time. Besides they could not keep those commitments. Camberlain did not used the time bought at Munich to build up the Britisch military might and the French where practicly locked up in the Montreforte-line. the Polish fought bravely no doubt, but they where left under the tender mercies of uncle Stalin and his succesors.

Yes - and that was a political mistake (or hypocrisy) from the part of the 1939 Allies. The French were just barricaded along the Maginotline and the British were in Northern France- and they were surprised and outclassed by the Germans in 1940.
The rest is history.

[Creeping Death]

That's it...come on!....you can get there, Brian....one more step..."dey must ave been an alliance, just as dat good man What sed"
Well done, Brian. Aaaannd relax. :hug_002:

Anglo-Polish military alliance:
Franco-Polish Military Alliance:

The British War Bluebook
Agreement of Mutual Assistance Between the United Kingdom and Poland.-London, August 25, 1939.
ARTICLE I.

Should one of the Contracting Parties become engaged in hostilities with a European Power in consequence of aggression by the latter against that Contracting Party, the other Contracting Party will at once give the Contracting Party engaged in hostilities all the support and assistance in its power.

That is not a guarantee for military intervention.
Followed by a classic sellout:

On May 4, a meeting was held in Paris at which it was decided that "the fate of Poland depends on the final outcome of the war, which will depend on our ability to defeat Germany rather than to aid Poland at the beginning."

You see the above, that was the result of that treaty.

Yeah.Sieg heil! Sieg heil! Sieg heil!

Konichiwa my little Mongol spotted Magyar.

The reason of hatred against anything German, and fear of German strength.

Precisely that is why Britain and France came together because they feared German Strength. Germany had legitimate concerns of Polish attacks on the German inhabitants stranded there because of Versaille. Polish attempts at Ethnic cleansing is what brought about the German invasion.

Luckily, everything went well and we now have a dying Europe, exactly what the British ever wished for ...

Thanks to the former inhabitants of Britain and Frances Junglebunny Empires flooding Europe. German rule was a missed opportunity for Europe.

Ultimately Jäger, there is only one country to blame for it all. And that is your country. It is your country that marched into Poland, causing World War II.

If Germany had of been treated correctly after WWI and not dispossessed of territory, extorted of gold reserves, Industrial equipment confiscated and to pay enormous war reparations bankrupting its economy for a war that Germany was innocently dragged into, WWII would never of happened. It all happened because Britain and France wanted to destroy Germany and weaken it by keeping the German people broken up in small states.

[Beorn]

That is not a guarantee for military intervention.

I'm feeling dizzy. I'm sure there is a song about drawing circles. In sand I think.

Wat Tyler said: Germany started the war by invading a British ally.
Brian Foley said: Poland was not an Ally of Britain.
Wat Tyler said: O RLY? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-P...itary_alliance

Original debate concluded. Time to come home boys, Good job done.