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Thread: House price plunge worsens in Greece and Spain

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    Default House price plunge worsens in Greece and Spain

    A world league table of property markets has shown values are falling fastest in Southern Europe, as a recovery gathered pace in major markets across the globe.

    Prices in Greece, where the economy has been crippled by the weight of government debt and by austerity measures, fell by 11.8pc in the year to the end of March, according to estate agency Knight Frank.
    The rate of decline worsened from 9.8pc a year earlier.

    Other countries in the so-called PIIGS countries - Spain (-7.9pc), Portugal (-6.9pc), Italy (-4.1pc) and Ireland (-3pc) - were also among the weakest markets (see the table below).

    The fall in the value of Spanish propery was marginally worse than the year before when it was 7.3pc.
    Ireland's fall, however, was a vast improvment from a 16pc plunge the year before.

    Unemployment has soared in many of the eurozone economies while wages have stagnated or fallen in real terms, putting pressure on property valuations. In Spain, further ill-effects have been imposed by changes in tax rules, according to experts.

    A new law in April required residents to declare any overseas asset worth more than €50,000, sparking fears that their may be a future Cyprus-style money grab.

    However, Knight Frank's experts have said a decision by the Spanish government to grant residency to non-EU nationals who buy property in the country costing more than €500,000 would offer some support.
    The rule is expected to be enacted into law in coming months.



    Hong Kong, in contrast to Europe, posted gains of 28pc, followed by China at 23.8pc and Dubai at 21.1pc.
    Thirty five of the 55 housing markets analysed, or 63pc, registered gains.

    South Africa was also singled out by report author Kate Everett-Allen as a strong performer, with prices up 11.3pc - a turnaround form a 3.2pc fall the year before.

    She said: "South Africa’s momentum is linked to an increasingly wealthy middle class who are tapping into the rising confidence of the wider African continent, keen to get on the property ladder."

    A similar pattern of recovery was seen in the US. Values for the year were up 10.2pc after a 1.9pc fall the year before.

    Last month, the Standard & Poor's/Case-Shiller home price index showed the market was rising at its fastest level in seven years, fuelled by cheaper borrowing costs, rising consumer confidence and a shortage of properties to buy.

    The recovery in the market has helped pull as many as 1.7m American households out of negative equity, which could help underpin further gains. Some economists have warned that rising mortgages rates in the US, which are influenced by the yield on US government bonds, could hamper the recovery. The average 15-year mortgage fixed rate in the US has risen above 3pc and is at its highest level since March 2012.

    Prices in the UK, according to Knight Frank were up by just 0.2pc over the year. Demand has been propped up by various Government-backed schemes. The Funding for Lending Scheme, launched last summer, has helped push the best mortgage rates down to just 1.7pc with experts predicting a drop below 1.5pc in coming months.

    Chancellor George Osborne's Help to Buy scheme, which offers interest-free loans and guarantees from taxpayers to buyers, has also increased buyer interest, according to estate agents.





    Which are the cheapest and most expensive markets?

    Last month a study by the OECD, which compared prices with local wages and rents, suggested Belgium, Norway and Canada were the most expensive markets compared with their own long-term averages, followed by New Zealand, France and Australia (see OECD the chart below).

    British house prices were estimated as being 31pc too high compared to rents and 21pc over-priced against incomes.
    For cheap property, the research pointed to Portugal, Ireland, Germany and Japan.

    The former two saw huge price falls during the financial crisis. The excesses of the property bubble that burst in late 2007 largely passed over Germany, and Japan's market has been in an on-off slide since a banking crisis in Tokyo in 1990.

    The OECD study echoes research published last month by The Economist. The news magazine produces its own study twice a year with the latest suggesting the most over-valued markets were Hong Kong - 81pc too high against rents - Canada and Singapore.


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    House pricing fall has nothing wrong, in fact house pricing is a very important variable that never is taken in account when quality of life is compared between countries. It isn't taken into account even when comparing PPP (Purchaing Power Parity) prices, usually quality of life is evaluated by comparing salaries (many times before taxes). How accurate and reliable is that?? Nil, because it tends to overate places where people have more income and devaluate the quality of live in places where the salaries are lower. It's a huge misunderstanding since usually the prices are adapted by the market to the salaries as is logical. You can't have Norwegian prices in Portugal, we couldn't afford that but since we aren't living in Norway that makes no difference to us. It make a lot of difference if a Norwegian decides to come in vacations to Portugal... and it makes a lot of difference to us if we want to go there in vacations (we don't). All this to say that, even if supermarket prices aren't very different, or even if they are different it doesn't much difference, food, beverage and housing, make all the difference.
    So let the prices fall, they were highly overrated anyway. And in the northern countries they should fall by 1/2 or something like that, it would be good for people living there because most can't afford to own a house, something we all do in the south even if, for example in Spain, average prices of housing can be 3 times higher than in Portugal in a countryside town and our salaries are shorter by 1/5, I bet that in bigger urban areas the difference remains. The in France prices are higher than in Spain, then in Denmark, prices are higher than in France and so on. Salaries follow that trend... there is no free lunch anywhere.
    This makes me conclude that even if northerners live better than us, no question, the difference is not that big. You earn more and you spend much more too. Their problems are the same as ours, at least it used to be like this. In the last couple of years I don't know anymore.
    This is a difficult thing to explain to people because they tend to compare salaries and think that others live in heaven and we live in hell. Personally I would never move to a northern country unless (very important) I wouldn't have a job here. I would never move for money (to earn more) and the main reason is precisely the housing. You can't live on the street. Here housing is accessible to everyone that works. On the other hand there are some really low renting prices caused by a post carnation revolution law difficult to overcome. Those prices are so low that owners can’t afford to take proper care of the buildings and it is the cause of some really nasty facades in Lisbon.

    Let the prices fall - - always a good sign!
    Last edited by Catrau; 06-13-2013 at 01:26 PM.

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    Time to pick up some prime property in Greece.
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    UK housing crash, will be a matter of time. Housing is too expensive, for first time buyers. Starting With the first hurdle, deposit, being too difficult to pay, 10 % of the asking price.

    Many young adults now only rent, or stay with parents.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Graham View Post
    UK housing crash, will be a matter of time.
    I certainly hope so.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    Time to pick up some prime property in Greece.
    Prices don't look that low in Greece. A friend told me that he paid 5€ for a cola in Athens... that is a bad sign, it looks like an overrated price to me. If that is true, I must tell you that I pay 1€ for that item where I live and I guess it could cost 1,5-2€ in Lisbon or in the Algarve at some touristic coffee/bar.
    Loking at the graphics, apparently the housing price is overrated taking into consideration the wages and renting is undervaluated taking into consideration the house pricing.
    Apparently it is interesting to rent, not to buy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Catrau View Post
    Prices don't look that low in Greece.
    Those are goods prices, though.

    I think property in Greece has potential to fall a lot more.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graham View Post
    UK housing crash, will be a matter of time. Housing is too expensive, for first time buyers. Starting With the first hurdle, deposit, being too difficult to pay, 10 % of the asking price.

    Many young adults now only rent, or stay with parents.
    Houses In the UK can be much cheaper, taking into account the type of construction.
    Most of the divisions are not made of brick.Instead they are made of plaster(Cheaper then bricks)don't have much Cement either.
    I don't get why an average house Is 300.000 Pounds or more.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Catrau View Post
    Prices don't look that low in Greece. A friend told me that he paid 5€ for a cola in Athens... that is a bad sign, it looks like an overrated price to me. If that is true, I must tell you that I pay 1€ for that item where I live and I guess it could cost 1,5-2€ in Lisbon or in the Algarve at some touristic coffee/bar.
    Loking at the graphics, apparently the housing price is overrated taking into consideration the wages and renting is undervaluated taking into consideration the house pricing.
    Apparently it is interesting to rent, not to buy.
    The prices vary, depends of where you get that

    I mean, in a super market, the can of 330ml is like 0.6€. In kiosks is 1~1.2€
    In cafeterias is from 2.5 to 4€ while in a club is like 5-6€

    Our cafeteria's prices are significantly higher than the rest of euro
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    Quote Originally Posted by Queen B View Post
    The prices vary, depends of where you get that

    I mean, in a super market, the can of 330ml is like 0.6€. In kiosks is 1~1.2€
    In cafeterias is from 2.5 to 4€ while in a club is like 5-6€

    Our cafeteria's prices are significantly higher than the rest of euro
    In Poland prices are low, but when you compare it with higher salaries for example in our western neighbours it turns out the ''opposite''. I know that house prices in Germany are lower than in Poland but services are much more expensive (even twice, thrice for example dentist). I remember also being flabbergasted by how high were some prices of some basic products in Croatia (when you compare them to Polish - even in touristic centres).

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