Jewish mtdna not middle eastern

[dhunter93]

http://www.nature.com/ncomms/2013/13...comms3543.html


Wow not even K or N1b2 is middle eastern !

Behar's information is outdated at this point, and he set out to prove a connection between Jews and the middle east which does not exist.

N1b is Eurasian (Turkic) N1b1 ( 16176G ) gets further west into Europe and is the non Jewish version .

N1b2 ( 16176A ) is Jewish but none of the N1b verities are middle eastern.


N1b1 ( 16176G ) is found from the Caucuses to the British Isles with low distribution almost everywhere. Best evidence now says it's Eurasian in origin.

N1b2 ( 16176A ) is Jewish and is now believed to have mutated in Italy.

Regarding Behar ; You have to be careful relying on outdated information from a source trying to prove a Jewish middle eastern origin.
[/B]

[Sikeliot]

http://www.nature.com/ncomms/2013/13...comms3543.html


Wow not even K or N1b2 is middle eastern !

N1b is Middle Eastern, I am pretty sure.

[MarkyMark]

N1b is Middle Eastern, I am pretty sure.

Seems Turkic: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_N-M231

[Prisoner Of Ice]

Did you expect it to be, when jews don't come from middle east?

[curupira]

Behar did not agree with that study.

From a previous study (Behar et al, 2006), also focusing on this subject, Ashkenazi mtDNA (more reliable take, IMO):

We have identified four Ashkenazi founding lineages, three within Hg K and one in Hg N1b, deriving from only four ancestral women and accounting for fully 40% of the mtDNAs of the current Ashkenazi population (~8,000,000 people). The most dominant of these lineages, K1a1b1a, encompasses 62% of the Ashkenazi K mtDNAs, which translates into 19.4% of contemporary Ashkenazi Jews, or ~1,700,000 people. The second most common lineage is within Hg N1b and corresponds to an additional 800,000 people.

The observed global pattern of distribution renders very unlikely the possibility that the four aforementioned founder lineages entered the Ashkenazi mtDNA pool via gene flow from a European host population.

For example, in databases of HVS-I sequences of British, Irish, German, French, or Italian subjects, these Ashkenazi sample founder lineage sequences were not observed (Baasner et al. 1998; Lutz et al. 1998;
Pfeiffer et al. 2001).

Furthermore, the non-Ashkenazi Jewish populations sharing the Ashkenazi mtDNA Hg K lineages turn out to be from Jewish communities that trace their origins to the expulsion from Spain in 1492.

Either a shared ancestral origin of the two groups or, alternatively, a postexile admixture between neighboring Ashkenazi and Spanish-exile Jewish populations may explain the sharing of these maternal lineages. However, the very presence of the Ashkenazi founding lineages, albeit at low frequencies, in North African, Near Eastern, and Caucasian Jews, supports a common Levantine ancestry.

In conclusion, the present study highlights the importance of a combined phylogenetic/phylogeographic strategy that includes complete mtDNA sequence analysis to accurately portray maternal founding events and to infer conclusions relevant to both shared ancestries and population-level effects that shaped the mtDNA gene pool in a given population. In the Ashkenazi Jews, this approach enabled us to reconstruct a detailed phylogenetic tree for the major Ashkenazi Hgs K and N1b, allowing the detection of a small set of only four individual female ancestors, likely from a Hebrew/Levantine mtDNA pool, whose descendants lived in Europe and carried forward their particular mtDNA variants to 3,500,000 individuals in a time frame of 2 millennia.

http://www.familytreedna.com/pdf/43026_doron.pdf

It is intriguing how so few maternal lineages account for so much of the maternal lines of the Ashkenazi population... likely they all descend from a few Levantine women who made their way to Europe over a thousand years ago.

This is what 23andme says on a few of these lines:

K1a1b1a, K2a2a, K1a9, etc:

K split off the more ancient haplogroup U8 about 35,000 years ago. Since then, haplogroup K has been involved in migrations from the Near East into Europe, most notably the founding and expansion of Ashkenazi Jewish populations.

One branch of haplogroup K ties about 1.7 million Ashkenazi Jews living today to a single maternal ancestor.

K in the Ashkenazi

A few branches of haplogroup K, such as K1a9, K2a2a, and K1a1b1a, are specific to Jewish populations and especially to Ashkenazi Jews, whose roots lie in central and eastern Europe. These branches of haplogroup K are found at levels of 30% among Ashkenazi. But they are also found at lower levels in Jewish populations from the Near East and Africa, and among Sephardic Jews who trace their roots to medieval Spain. That indicates an origin of those K haplogroup branches in the Near East before 70 AD, when the Roman destruction of Jerusalem scattered the Jewish people around the Mediterranean and beyond.

About 1.7 million Ashkenazi living today – about 20% of the population – share a single branch of the K haplogroup, K1a1b1a. The diversity of that haplogroup among Ashkenazi suggests that it arose in the Near East between 2,000 and 3,000 years ago, and that everyone who shares it today could have shared a common ancestor as recently as 700 years ago. A similar pattern in two other K branches that are common among the Ashkenazi, K1a9 and K2a2, as well as the N1b branch of haplogroup N, has led researchers to conclude that 40% of the Ashkenazi living today – about 3.4 million people – could descend from as few as four women who lived within the last 2,000 years.

Historical information supports that conclusion. The Ashkenazi tradition traces back to a small number of people who migrated from northern Italy to the Rhine Valley of Germany around 700 AD, then grew over the next 1,300 years to a population of more than 5 million.

N1b2:

Haplogroup: N1b, a subgroup of N

Example Populations: Mazandarani, Bedouin, Ashkenazi

Highlight: It is likely that every Ashkenazi Jew with mitochondrial DNA from N1b may have inherited it from a single woman who lived less than 2,000 years ago.

Haplogroup N1b2

Jewish populations dispersed from the Near East about 2,000 years ago, after the fall of Jerusalem and the destruction of the Second Temple by the Romans. Some of them ended up in Rome, and a few of their descendants eventually made their way northward to settle in the Rhine Valley around 800 AD. Over the next millennium that small group of founders, known as the Ashkenazi, grew to a population of 6 million.

Research has shown that Ashkenazi living today trace back to just a handful of mitochondrial DNA lines. Their mitochondrial genetics is so restricted, in fact, that 40% of the Ashkenazi living today can be traced back to as few as four individual women.

One of those women belonged to the N1b2 haplogroup, which is found today in the mitochondrial DNA of about 10% of Ashkenazi. Though it is also found in other Jewish groups, the vast majority of the people who carry it today trace their lineage back to one, or at most a few, women who lived between 500 and 2,500 years ago, and most likely during the first millennium AD.

MtDNA haplogroup K is fairly common in the Levant:

Approximately 16% of the Druze of Syria, Lebanon, Israel, and Jordan, belong to haplogroup K. It was also found in a significant group of Palestinian Arabs. K reaches a level of 17% in Kurdistan.

Approximately 32% of people with Ashkenazi Jewish ancestry are in haplogroup K. This high percentage points to a genetic bottleneck occurring some 100 generations ago. Ashkenazi mtDNA K clusters into three subclades seldom found in non-Jews: K1a1b1a, K1a9, and K2a2a. Thus it is possible to detect three individual female ancestors, likely from a Hebrew/Levantine mtDNA pool, whose descendants lived in Europe.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_K_(mtDNA)

[Smeagol]

Ashkenazis are autosomally about 50% European, 50% Near Eastern.

[curupira]

Genetically, they're closer to other Jews such as Sephardic Jews and Moroccan Jews than they are to the host populations in which they have lived for so long (Germans and Eastern Europeans), and pulling towards the Levant.

Besides they carry lineages which are highly specific of Jews, be it maternal, or paternal, like the Cohen haplotype, f.e:



An autosomal map from the Behar study:


http://www.nature.com/nature/journal...e09103_F2.html

An autosomal map from the eurogenes project:



It is amazing IMO that for Ashkenazi Jews Germans (and Eastern Europeans) do not appear even among the first 40 closest to them, for Sephardic Jews Iberians do not appear among the first 40 closest either, nor do Moroccans do to Moroccan Jews!

Dodecad k12b results of the Ashkenazi Jews:

DodecadOracle(c(2.8, 0.6, 4.2, 0, 25.1, 13.2, 1.3, 0.4, 12.8, 0.5, 39, 0),k=85)
[,1] [,2]
[1,] "Ashkenazy_Jews" "0"
[2,] "Ashkenazi_D" "1.8248"
[3,] "Sicilian_D" "6.1514"
[4,] "S_Italian_Sicilian_D" "6.5383"
[5,] "Sephardic_Jews" "8.8578"
[6,] "Greek_D" "9.078"
[7,] "Morocco_Jews" "12.8031"
[8,] "C_Italian_D" "13.5477"
[9,] "Cypriots" "15.5827"
[10,] "O_Italian_D" "17.4333"
[11,] "Tuscan" "17.9025"
[12,] "Turkish_D" "18.9296"
[13,] "TSI30" "19.4728"
[14,] "Lebanese" "21.4156"
[15,] "Turks" "21.9066"
[16,] "Druze" "23.805"
[17,] "Bulgarian_D" "24.5668"
[18,] "Bulgarians_Y" "24.665"
[19,] "Syrians" "24.735"
[20,] "Jordanians" "25.6731"
[21,] "Romanians" "26.421"
[22,] "N_Italian_D" "26.5522"
[23,] "Palestinian" "26.908"
[24,] "North_Italian" "27.5764"
[25,] "Uzbekistan_Jews" "27.7743"
[26,] "Armenian_D" "28.6855"
[27,] "Georgia_Jews" "28.7531"
[28,] "Samaritans" "29.2602"
[29,] "Iraq_Jews" "29.3379"
[30,] "Assyrian_D" "29.3784"
[31,] "Azerbaijan_Jews" "29.5745"
[32,] "Armenians_15_Y" "29.8612"
[33,] "Armenians" "30.6504"
[34,] "Iranian_Jews" "31.1989"
[35,] "Kumyks_Y" "31.5393"
[36,] "Egyptans" "31.691"
[37,] "Nogais_Y" "31.8152"
[38,] "Kurds_Y" "32.7379"
[39,] "Kurd_D" "33.3354"
[40,] "Iranian_D" "33.6982"
[41,] "Iranians" "35.5892"
[42,] "Adygei" "35.933"
[43,] "Balkars_Y" "36.1872"
[44,] "Turkmens_Y" "36.4286"
[45,] "North_Ossetians_Y" "37.0169"
[46,] "Baleares_1KG" "37.042"
[47,] "Canarias_1KG" "37.5781"
[48,] "Chechens_Y" "37.7647"
[49,] "Yemenese" "38.3286"
[50,] "Galicia_1KG" "38.5051"
[51,] "Bedouin" "38.5096"
[52,] "Extremadura_1KG" "38.8348"
[53,] "Murcia_1KG" "39.0442"
[54,] "Portuguese_D" "39.0863"
[55,] "Lezgins" "39.5084"
[56,] "Andalucia_1KG" "39.7006"
[57,] "Castilla_Y_Leon_1KG" "41.1618"
[58,] "Spaniards" "42.0943"
[59,] "Spanish_D" "42.9535"
[60,] "Cataluna_1KG" "43.2757"
[61,] "Hungarians" "43.3482"
[62,] "Castilla_La_Mancha_1KG" "43.7549"
[63,] "Algerian_D" "44.0118"
[64,] "Valencia_1KG" "44.4297"
[65,] "Abhkasians_Y" "44.5719"
[66,] "Cantabria_1KG" "44.7376"
[67,] "French" "44.7471"
[68,] "French_D" "45.029"
[69,] "Aragon_1KG" "45.3586"
[70,] "Tajiks_Y" "45.9169"
[71,] "Uzbeks" "46.8559"
[72,] "Georgians" "47.4162"
[73,] "German_D" "47.9959"
[74,] "Yemen_Jews" "48.444"
[75,] "Mixed_Germanic_D" "49.3436"
[76,] "Sardinian" "51.231"
[77,] "Dutch_D" "51.3298"
[78,] "Kent_1KG" "52.1156"
[79,] "Bnei_Menashe_Jews" "52.3587"
[80,] "CEU30" "52.6992"
[81,] "English_D" "52.7228"
[82,] "Uygur" "53.2533"
[83,] "Cornwall_1KG" "53.4111"
[84,] "Moroccan_D" "53.5623"
[85,] "British_D" "54.1536"
[86,] "British_Isles_D" "54.2386"
[87,] "Hazara" "54.6536"
[88,] "Argyll_1KG" "55.2765"
[89,] "Moroccans" "55.4705"
[90,] "Irish_D" "55.6737"
[91,] "Ukranians_Y" "55.6758"
[92,] "Orcadian" "56.0235"
[93,] "Orkney_1KG" "56.2767"
[94,] "Chuvashs" "57.3128"
[95,] "Polish_D" "58.183"
[96,] "Mixed_Slav_D" "59.0689"
[97,] "Norwegian_D" "59.7258"
[98,] "Swedish_D" "59.8196"
[99,] "Pais_Vasco_1KG" "59.84"
[100,] "Pathan" "60.3621"
[101,] "Mordovians_Y" "60.596"
[102,] "Russian_B" "61.4236"
[103,] "Russian_D" "62.0663"
[104,] "Belorussian" "62.1939"
[105,] "Russian" "62.9443""

[dhunter93]

Behar's information is outdated at this point, and he set out to prove a connection between Jews and the middle east.

N1b is Eurasian (Turkic) N1b1 ( 16176G ) gets further west into Europe and is the non Jewish version .

N1b2 ( 16176A ) is Jewish but none of the N1b verities are middle eastern.

[curupira]

N1b1 ( 16176G ) gets further west into Europe and is the non Jewish version . .

On 23andme, I share with 2 Arabians whose mtDNA is N1b1. These are example mtDNA N1b populations listed by 23andme:

Haplogroup: N1b, a subgroup of N

Example Populations: Mazandarani, Bedouin, Ashkenazi

[d3cimat3d]

This proves Jooz had the hots for European wimminz, and assimilated them if they served out that vag.

Ashkenazis are autosomally about 50% European, 50% Near Eastern.

True but that 50% is mostly only southern European (south Italian, Sicilian), which is already pretty much indistinguishable from Near Eastern. However Ashkenazis have 15% North European component probably when they left Italy and screwed some German chicks in the Rhine, at least that's how I interpret this mtDNA study.