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Thread: Are light traits in Southern Europe due to the northern European admixture ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peyrol View Post
    It depens zone by zone.

    In northern Italy lighter traits are moslty celtic (that's also why our languages are called ''Gallo-Romance'') + minor germanic, in some zone slike Sicily are a normannic and swabian heritage.
    i agree in part for northern Italy (or better North-western Italy , Veneto it's another story) but to be honest i don't think that northern european aDNA +light features were inexistent in Sicily and South Italy in general before the Normans...the Siculi were indoeuropeans of the Latin-faliscan group and the Island was reached in the ancient bronze age by the Bell Beakers from Spain that may could have brought some northern admixture :

    "We have detected here a signal of gene flow from northern Europe into Spain around 2000 B.C.We
    discuss a likely interpretation. At this time there was a characteristic pottery termed ‘bell-beakers’
    believed to correspond to a population spread across Iberia and northern Europe. We hypothesize
    that we are seeing here a genetic signal of the ‘Bell-Beaker culture’ (HARRISON, 1980). Initial
    cultural flow of the Bell-Beakers appears to have been from South to North, but the full story
    may be complex. Indeed one hypothesis is that after an initial expansion from Iberia there was a
    reverse flow back to Iberia
    (CZEBRESZUK, 2003); this ‘reflux’ model is broadly concordant with
    our genetic results, and if this is the correct explanation it suggests that this reverse flow may have
    been accompanied by substantial population movement."

    http://www.genetics.org/content/earl...45037.full.pdf

    Diffusione_Campaniforme.png

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    Map is an approximation, but the Siculi were never anywhere near Palermo, where the most Germanic/Celtic admix is.


    Ah, per fortuna un uomo può sognare... un uomo può sognare.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peyrol View Post
    It depens zone by zone.

    In northern Italy lighter traits are moslty celtic (that's also why our languages are called ''Gallo-Romance'') + minor germanic, in some zone slike Sicily are a normannic and swabian heritage.

    Is the Veneto Are inlfuenced by slavs?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kastrioti1443 View Post
    Is the Veneto Are inlfuenced by slavs?
    I'm sure Veneto and Friuli-Venezia Giulia are both influenced by Croats and Slovenes.


    Ah, per fortuna un uomo può sognare... un uomo può sognare.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kastrioti1443 View Post
    Is the Veneto Are inlfuenced by slavs?
    Ancient venetians were called ''Venedi'', like an ancient population of Poland.
    I don't know if there are some relations, btw.

    Modern venetics are basically gallo-romance people with a strong germanic inputo and a quite high slavic one (even if the slavic imput is higher in the Veneto's neighbor, Friuli, the only place in Europe where a rhaeto-romanic language is majoritary).

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    Quote Originally Posted by alfieb View Post
    I'm sure Veneto and Friuli-Venezia Giulia are both influenced by Croats and Slovenes.
    Fòrlan (friulian) language sound a bit portuguese and/or romanian, btw (from 0:55).

    Quite unintelligible with standard italian and other northern italic languages, btw.


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    I'd say due to a Nordid or Alpine impact in the West/Central regions and West/East Baltid in East. Light "traits" are recessive and cannot be compared to the "Arab" 10% dominant genes playing a role as somebody stated .

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    The Mesolitich hunther gathereres are the main source of Northern Euro admixture in S.Europe .
    Last edited by Prince Carlo; 05-08-2013 at 06:44 PM.

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    Btw, light eyes for single italian regions...as you can see, more south you go, less light eyers you can see.



    Veneto/Friuli 41,4%
    Piemonte/Valle d'Aosta 40%
    Lombardia 37,2%
    Liguria 29,6%
    Emilia-Romagna 31,2%
    Umbria 32,8%
    Toscana 31,5%
    Marche 31,3%
    Lazio 26,2%
    Abruzzo/Molise 28,5%
    Campania 25,6%
    Puglia 26,4%
    Sicilia (isola) 23,7%
    Basilicata 23,1%
    Calabria 19,6%

    Sardegna (isola) 13,9%

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peyrol View Post
    Btw, light eyes for single italian regions...as you can see, more south you go, less light eyers you can see.



    Veneto/Friuli 41,4%
    Piemonte/Valle d'Aosta 40%
    Lombardia 37,2%
    Liguria 29,6%
    Emilia-Romagna 31,2%
    Umbria 32,8%
    Toscana 31,5%
    Marche 31,3%
    Lazio 26,2%
    Abruzzo/Molise 28,5%
    Campania 25,6%
    Puglia 26,4%
    Sicilia (isola) 23,7%
    Basilicata 23,1%
    Calabria 19,6%

    Sardegna (isola) 13,9%

    These numbers seem exaggerated unless they include green/hazel eyes.

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