Do you think that Balkan Dardanians might be one/or related to Trojan Dardanians?

[wvwvw]

Do you know what colonisation means?
It is possible to learn other languages.
There is plenty of evidence to suggest they were possibly Hittite other speakers. Ancient languages in north west turkey have been found not to be related to Greek such as the Luwian language.
The source of Trojans being Greeks is based on “colonisation” and the Iliad being in Greek language, but that doesn’t mean they were Greek, most likely Greeks committed mass genocide on them.

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All they found was a Luwian seal which is not even significant because it was found in a later layer (containing minoan and myceanean pottery). A similar Luwian seal is known from Mycenae.

That doesn’t make them Hittites. It’s like saying since Egyptian paintings have been found in Pompey that makes Southern Italians Egyptians.

There was also no Luwian language in the seal only a Luwian seal with Luwian letters. Trojans had Greek names and a Greek culture and worshipped the same Gods as the Greeks. Long before the Aeolian and Ionian migrations Aegean Islands and most of the coast of Asia-Minor was already Greek and admitted to being Greek by the Hittites.

The whole Asia Minor was Minoan before it was Myceanean. Minoan presense to Troy and Asia aminor date to 3000 BC.

The geneology of Trojans is well known as to leave any doubt. Herodotus identifies the Trojans with Teucrians and Strabo identifies the Teucrians with Cretans. With Trojan kings with names like Alexander recorded by the Hittites their origin couldn't be more obvious. Every shred of archaeological evidence from Troy show Greek culture. Luwia was nowhere Troy.

Les Troyens étaient des Grecs
http://www.portique.net/spip.php?article54

[Epirus DNA]

Hittite yes I agree with that, and possibly Balkan, but I don’t believe they were Greek, however they might have mixed with some Greeks. Hittites makes a lot of sense but Balkan Dardanians and Paeonians makes even more sense...

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In the epic poem Iliad, the Trojans speak Homeric Greek.
If the Trojan Elite were not Greek, why did they fluently speak the Greek language and trade with the Mycenaeans?

The Trojans in the Iliad have no difficulty in speaking to the Greeks: For example, Trojan Aeneas converses without difficulty both with Punic Dido and with Latin Turnus.

Greek legend gives further indications on the subject of language at Troy. For one thing, the allies of Troy, listed at length in the Trojan Battle Order which closes book 2 of the Iliad, are depicted as speaking various languages and thus needing to have orders translated to them by their commanders (2.802–806). Elsewhere in the poem (4.433–438) they are compared to sheep and lambs bleating in a field as they talk together in their different languages. The inference is that, from the Greek point of view, the languages of Trojans and their allied neighbors were not as unified as those of the Achaeans.

[Cumansky]

I don’t want an argument here... but they do actually have a lot in common with one another, and let’s not forget they are geographically close to each other

For myself I’m going to say yes... if not one, surely related.

I want to make a poll for this but I don’t know how


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Albanians not all related with people of Troy, they came from Caucasus mountains later and stole my shine

[wvwvw]

It's really possible

During the age of Herodotus in various mountainous area of continental Greece it was still spoken the Pelasgian language, and he describes it as a totally unintelligible language.

That’s not how he describes it. Herodotus was discussion the origin of the Hellenic race and that race he considered to be a branch of the Pelasgic race. He uses the term barbarian to refer to people who did not speak the Hellenic dialect of Greek. It was also used by the Athenians to refer to those who did not speak the Attic dialect of Greek.

Hellenic was a specific set of Greek dialects and Pelasgic was another set of Greek dialects. All the Hellenic dialects, Doric, Aeolic, Achaean and Attic-Ionic were descended from Pelasgian i.e Mycenean Greek. The Pelasgians were an Arcadian tribe that did not multiply much. The Hellenes were nomadic and they multiplied much.

In Herodotus time Pelasgians was still spoken by the Pelasgians beside Thrace and in Creston (Italy) above the Tyrrhenians and everywhere else Pelasgians lived. Herodotus heard the language because he visited these places and know that it was common to all Pelasgians and that Greek was descended from it, whereas it bore no relation to any other languages.

Herodotus had heard Pelsagian and he knew that Greek was directly descended from it and apart from the Hellenes nobody spoke anything similar to it, not even the Italians and Tyrrhenians or the Carians.

[valentinavalley2]

In the epic poem Iliad, the Trojans speak Homeric Greek.
If the Trojan Elite were not Greek, why did they fluently speak the Greek language and trade with the Mycenaeans?

The Trojans in the Iliad have no difficulty in speaking to the Greeks: For example, Trojan Aeneas converses without difficulty both with Punic Dido and with Latin Turnus.

Greek legend gives further indications on the subject of language at Troy. For one thing, the allies of Troy, listed at length in the Trojan Battle Order which closes book 2 of the Iliad, are depicted as speaking various languages and thus needing to have orders translated to them by their commanders (2.802–806). Elsewhere in the poem (4.433–438) they are compared to sheep and lambs bleating in a field as they talk together in their different languages. The inference is that, from the Greek point of view, the languages of Trojans and their allied neighbors were not as unified as those of the Achaeans.

I’m going to be honest and say I think Greeks actually committed genocide on them, they most likely did... true Troy became a Greek city after the Trojan war, but Troy was never originally a Greek city.

I think Greeks live in denial with what their ancestors did...


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[PaleoEuropean]

1. Can you prove that trojans did learn the greek language? No.
2. Is there source about trojans were greek speakers? Yes.
3. Is there source about trojans were hittite or other speakers? No.

I mean just admixture wise, wouldn't go as far to make any assertions about the nobility. The average soldier was probably levied from the local populaces.

[valentinavalley2]

Troy was an Independent Greek city state. The Trojans were nothing to do with the Hittites. Hittites were Hittites. Trojans were Greeks. Tithonus (Ramses II) the father of Memnon was the son of the Trojan king Laomedon the father of Priam.

For most of their existance Hittites had been vassals of the Greeks, which is why there is no mention by them in the Illiad. The last Hittite king was Priam the king of Troy who was known to the Hittites as Suppiluliama 1200-1190 BC. Suppiluliama(s) is a Hittite corruption of the Greek Zeus-Priamos meaning Zeus the Primary.

The Hittites recognised the Achaeans as equals and called their leader by the title Great King. All of the tribes of the Asia-Minor region of Greece were recognised by the Hittites as equals and that includes the Trojans.

When the siege of Troy began in 1193 BC the Egyptians had already destroyed the Hittite empire because it attacked Egypt. Read the inscription of Merneptah.

The Hittites were known to the Greeks by the name of Assyrians since to all intents an purposes the were either ruled by the Assyrians or ruling the Assyrians since 1600 BC. Their decedents are the Assyrian Christians of Hatay which the Turks inflicted a systematic genocide on in 1938.

Troy was never originally Greek, they were most likely related to Paeonians, Dardanians, Pelasgians or Hittites. Troy only became Greek after the Greek burnt it down killing people. I think you Greeks live in denial with what your ancestors did. In the Iliad Trojans are called Dardanians.

Herodotus clearly states Pelasgians spoke a non Hellenic language a non Greek language.
Herodotus clearly states Pelasgians were not Greek.

If we think about it realistically Trojans were most likely the same as Dardanians a non Greek people, but if we look at archaeological sources they were probably Luwian. Trojans never considered themselves Greek but Dardanians, most likely they were Dardanians.


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